Hird will be worse than Voss

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The Donners said:
Unless Collingwood wins the replay this weekend, MM has been a failure at Collingwood. Longest serving coach at any one club without a premiership.
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there lists in 02/03 were ordinary yet he got the very best out of them to reach grand finals. Even in the past 5 years, you wouldnt say the list has been anywhere near as talented (this year aside) as counterparts who made prelims, Malthouse gets the best out of his players, there is no denying that

To call him a failure is utterly ridiculous.
 
A) I wanted Hird at Port so if he sucks I will be mightly embarrassed.
B) Tough call on Primus, he was a great leader and he's biggest issue is getting the support staff around him, which Hird will not suffer from.
C) How many favourite sons do we have at all the clubs at the moment? Voss, Buckley, ratten, Worsfold, Primus.
D) I bet Richardson is spewing he pulled out of the Port job now, he'll be spewing.
 
The Dons should have just appointed Hird without a selection process because it is just plain ludicrous to argue he was the best credentialed candidate.

On the contrary, with no runs on the coaching board any level, he was clearly the worst candidate.

This smacks of a board trying to relieve pressure on themselves due to past mistakes with - you guessed it -another poor decision.

Now both he and the Dons and Hird will look foolish when this fails as it inevitably will.
 

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Bomber32 said:
OP, I've taken your advice and bookmarked this thread.

I will bump it with a high degree of glee when Hirdy delivers our next premiership.:thumbsu:
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You're going to need a long memory. Regardless of Hird and how good he may or may not be as a coach, your list isn't winning a premiership any time soon and with two compromised drafts in a row coming up, it's going to take time to turn it around.

That said, absolutely nobody has any idea how successful Hird will be as a coach. Anything said on the matter is speculation and nothing more.
 
Hird is a great man, player, communicator and thinker with a gentle but ruthless nature. ADD a Blight/Matthews and or Laidley.
Goodwin is already there I hear and keep whoever is doin a good job already and 'SEE the bombers fly up up'..........
 
millsie said:
I dunno, getting to the 2002 & 2003 GFs with the list he had to work with was quite an achievement.

I think Hird will do OK. He'll be better than Watson was at St Kilda.
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I wasn't trying to be critical, obviously he's a fantastic coach but really, you'd want a flag from him - obviously.

Hird could be as bad as Watson was at St. Kilda, he could also be as good as Lethal at the Pies, you just never know.
 
Yeah he has lack of experience but seems like a reasonably smart guy.

This is actually a really good situation to be entering a club as a coach imo:

- Everyone thinks Essendon's list is crap and it actually isnt that bad they have quality KP players just no midfield depth which is easy to target in drafts/trade. Essendon had bad injuries this year I think they will be up and running next year and may challenge for the bottom half of the 8 with a good injury run.

- When you enter a club that is supposedly at rock bottom (i.e. Hardwick) people give you a fair chance and they have there expectations low.

- If he plays young players people will excuse losses and any wins that they have will seem like a good acheivement.
 
I don't think expectations are low at all. Knights was sacked because the board thought he should have made finals this year, and Bombers were hurt with injuries to key players this year.

People now expect that Hird will do better than knights did, so expectations I would assume are finals or very close to it. Hird himself has said there will be no cleanout and he is happy with the list.

There was a thread sometime ago asking if Bombers are the new richmond and this appointment goes someway to justifying that. After sustained success the fans have booted out a coach who was unsuccesful for one season. They then go and bring back a "legend" of the club, see R. Hart and K. Bartlett for tigers who is supposed to immediately turn things around. What happens if Hird has 2 average seasons with results similiar to knights, which in most peoples opinions is about where the list is at. Club Legend or not can the bomber fans tolerate 2 more seasons of mediocrity, I don't think so.
 
Spanish_Fly said:
I don't think expectations are low at all. Knights was sacked because the board thought he should have made finals this year, and Bombers were hurt with injuries to key players this year.

People now expect that Hird will do better than knights did, so expectations I would assume are finals or very close to it. Hird himself has said there will be no cleanout and he is happy with the list.

There was a thread sometime ago asking if Bombers are the new richmond and this appointment goes someway to justifying that. After sustained success the fans have booted out a coach who was unsuccesful for one season. They then go and bring back a "legend" of the club, see R. Hart and K. Bartlett for tigers who is supposed to immediately turn things around. What happens if Hird has 2 average seasons with results similiar to knights, which in most peoples opinions is about where the list is at. Club Legend or not can the bomber fans tolerate 2 more seasons of mediocrity, I don't think so.
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As has already been pointed out, for us to become the new Richmond it would require Richmond to stop being Richmond. See --> Ladder position, indicates this has not happened.
 
Maybe I should have said "essendon to become another Richmond". Does that help?

What I am saying is they appear to be making the same mistakes Richmond did in the early 80's after a period of sustained success they are looking for quick fixes and bowing to pressure from the supporters.

It has taken us 30 years to understand that there is no quick recipe for success and patience is the only answer.

Perhaps next time if you are going to retort you could actually address the points raised rather than quibbling on semantics.
 
Papa G said:
How much grace will Essendon supporters give Hird?

What is an acceptable placing next year?
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I would expect to be around the same mark next year as we'll still be getting used to having a defense, 2012 should be a significant improvement though.
 
QPower said:
The Dons should have just appointed Hird without a selection process because it is just plain ludicrous to argue he was the best credentialed candidate.

On the contrary, with no runs on the coaching board any level, he was clearly the worst candidate.

This smacks of a board trying to relieve pressure on themselves due to past mistakes with - you guessed it -another poor decision.

Now both he and the Dons and Hird will look foolish when this fails as it inevitably will.
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:thumbsu: agreed.

While I still think the process was wrong and would rather have seen Voss serve for 2-3 years at another club before returning to the lions, at least they straight out put him in the position and didn't bullshit about him being the best candidate. Hird lied when asked about the Essendon position and Essendon has lied about selecting the new coach. Voss at least got to work with other coaches when he was involved with the AIS. Has Hird even had any coaching involvement with football since he has retired?
 

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Spanish_Fly said:
Maybe I should have said "essendon to become another Richmond". Does that help?

What I am saying is they appear to be making the same mistakes Richmond did in the early 80's after a period of sustained success they are looking for quick fixes and bowing to pressure from the supporters.

It has taken us 30 years to understand that there is no quick recipe for success and patience is the only answer.

Perhaps next time if you are going to retort you could actually address the points raised rather than quibbling on semantics.
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The difference is, you guys were chasing established experienced players left right and centre and never giving the youth a go.
Which is almost* the polar opposite of what we've done the last 4 years or so.
The list is young.
This decision is about which is the better way to develop it into a winning side.

* 1 exception.
 
Bomberman86 said:
Insightful thread :thumbsu: Just sums it all up perfectly really.. you provide factual arguments that are cohesive and draw you to the obvious conclusion... Oh wait, sorry, I just re-read what you wrote. Are you 12?

You're aware that, you might be right, he might be s**t. But you're also aware that he might be good yeah? Fact is, NOBODY (yep, even the logical argument maker yourself) knows what he'll be like. Its an exciting time at Essendon, so I dont think we're going to be worried about outsiders perspectives (s**t.. they practically feed off Essendons failure.. little man syndrome much?).

Heres a little something for you to walk away with.

1) Learn the term "mutually exclusive" (I understand this may be hard for you, but im sure if you google it youll be able to figure it out). Hird and Voss and mutually exclusive and should be treated as such.

2) Hird wont be calling the shots on game day for some time. It will be his Senior assistant which I would think would be M Williams or D Laidley.

3) His presence alone is a massive bonus for Essendon. On the training track, I cant think of anybody the players would want to play for more than Hird. In terms of their development, its a fantastic signing.
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You obviously like that term "mutually exclusive" you keep on using it on different threads, you also keep on about Knights Ricmondising essendon.

I hope for your sake that Hird returns the EFC to the Power club that it was after K Sheedy "Richmondised" it in the 80.

And i see that you agree that hird wont be the coach but just a figure head which is also "mutually exclusive"
 
Spanish_Fly said:
I don't think expectations are low at all. Knights was sacked because the board thought he should have made finals this year, and Bombers were hurt with injuries to key players this year.

People now expect that Hird will do better than knights did, so expectations I would assume are finals or very close to it. Hird himself has said there will be no cleanout and he is happy with the list.

There was a thread sometime ago asking if Bombers are the new richmond and this appointment goes someway to justifying that. After sustained success the fans have booted out a coach who was unsuccesful for one season. They then go and bring back a "legend" of the club, see R. Hart and K. Bartlett for tigers who is supposed to immediately turn things around. What happens if Hird has 2 average seasons with results similiar to knights, which in most peoples opinions is about where the list is at. Club Legend or not can the bomber fans tolerate 2 more seasons of mediocrity, I don't think so.
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Mate their list is better than its position suggests, Thats what Knights told the Veruca salts board when he got the Job.

Now Hird is saying the same thing, but if its not the case and they need to rebuild?

Who is going to shoot Bambi??????????
 
Slattery_20 said:
The difference is, you guys were chasing established experienced players left right and centre and never giving the youth a go.
Which is almost* the polar opposite of what we've done the last 4 years or so.
The list is young.
This decision is about which is the better way to develop it into a winning side.

* 1 exception.
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but but but didnt knights say the same thing, and IRC wallace said the same thing when we swallowed the line without gulping.......this could end very bad
 
Meh. Most apprenticeships are learn't on the job and if he's got the right people around him he'll be fine.
Good footy brain and I don't think the Bombers list is as bad as people suggest.
Untapped potential in my opinion.
 
Gibbo_88 said:
:thumbsu: agreed.

While I still think the process was wrong and would rather have seen Voss serve for 2-3 years at another club before returning to the lions, at least they straight out put him in the position and didn't bullshit about him being the best candidate. Hird lied when asked about the Essendon position and Essendon has lied about selecting the new coach. Voss at least got to work with other coaches when he was involved with the AIS. Has Hird even had any coaching involvement with football since he has retired?
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True. You can criticise Brisbane's choice, but they did not indulge in the blatant deception Essendon did by pretending to go through a process to choose the best available person.

Essendon were always going to appoint Hird despite having an unilimited number of better credentialed candidates available.
 
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