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Kouta: get draft pick

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Silvagnis

Silvagnis

TheBrownDog
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Sep 27, 2004
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AFL Club
Carlton
Kouta: get draft pick

RETIRED Carlton great Anthony Koutoufides wants to see the Blues to lose to Melbourne this week and secure the No. 1 draft pick.

If the Blues lose this week, like they did against the Kangaroos at Telstra Dome on Saturday afternoon, they are assured of the No. 1 draft pick. The former Carlton captain and dual best and fairest winner said it was in the club's best interest to lose on Sunday at the MCG and collect promising Victorian ruckman Matthew Kreuzer.

However he denied new coach Brett Ratten and the players would tank.

"In all fairness, I would rather them lose because of the draft picks," Koutoufides said last night.

"But I know their mentality is going to be to go out there and win.

"But in all truth, I think the majority of Carlton people would like to see them get the No. 1 draft pick."

If Carlton loses the "Kreuzer Cup" this week and St Kilda beats Richmond, it secures picks 1, 3, 20, 36 and 52. If the Blues win, they lose the priority pick.

"Of course, I don't want them to win for the simple fact I want to see them get the draft picks," said Koutoufides, who retired after Round 17 because of injury.

With Kreuzer expected to be taken with the first pick, Koutoufides said he would be a perfect fit at Carlton.

"Kreuzer, he's a standout in the (TAC Cup) competition at the moment and he's exactly what the club needs," Koutoufides said. "You want to see the club end up with him.

"So it will be an interesting game for that fact. We probably want to see them lose and just put up an effort."

Several other high-profile Carlton identities said it would be better for the Blues to lose.

Triple premiership player David McKay said he had mixed feelings about the game.

"I don't want to lose, but I don't want to win. Players don't go out to lose and they'll be trying. For the long term future of the club we have to get the best possible picks," he said.

Former president John Elliott said winning was simply not an option.

"We've got to lose. (Matthew) Kreuzer was best on the ground again at the weekend. I'll be going and I'll be sitting there quietly praying for Carlton to lose by less than three goals, knowing we could've kicked the three if we wanted to," he said.

Premiership coach Robert Walls said the No.1 draft picks should be the priority.

"I don't want Carlton to win because, as a supporter, the benefits of losing are so great. But I think they will win because the players will be trying hard, and they're better than Melbourne," he said.

Carlton premiership player David Rhys Jones said he had already been barracking for the Blues to lose.

"Saturday week ago it looked like they were going to beat Essendon and it's the one and only time I've ever barracked for Essendon," he said.

"I think the league owes us a few draft picks so even if we tanked this week, so be it."

Demetriou said the league's priority pick rules would not be changed despite on-going talk of tanking.

"I'm sure it will continue to be the case, but we're not going to change things."
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BAM! :thumbsu:
 
Former Blues president Ian Collins agreed: "My argument is that you have always got to try to win. You never, never give a sucker an even break."

Thank God this loser is no longer in charge!!!
 

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I don't hear anyone accusing Kouta of being anti-Carlton, or not a real supporter of the club, or a scumbag fan that the club can do without like
I was accused of being by a number of regulars on this messageboard for suggesting the same thing a week or so back as Kouta & co have now.

So the question is, are me and Koutoufides scumbag supporters or are we not?
 
Deej said:
I don't hear anyone accusing Kouta of being anti-Carlton, or not a real supporter of the club, or a scumbag fan that the club can do without like
I was accused of being by a number of regulars on this messageboard for suggesting the same thing a week or so back as Kouta & co have now.

So the question is, are me and Koutoufides scumbag supporters or are we not?
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while Kouta has said the following:

RETIRED Carlton great Anthony Koutoufides wants to see the Blues to lose to Melbourne this week and secure the No. 1 draft pick.

The former Carlton captain and dual best and fairest winner said it was in the club's best interest to lose on Sunday at the MCG and collect promising Victorian ruckman Matthew Kreuzer.

However he denied new coach Brett Ratten and the players would tank.
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Kouta has expressed what he feels, but has also stated that the Ratts and the boys wont be tanking. That makes him honest.

Whereas, You are there quite happily saying that they are tanking and how proud you are that they are tanking and losing matches so that we can get the #1 draft pick and thats what makes you a "scumbag" supporter.

Ohh and btw... Kouta is a legend for the club... He has given years of quality service to the club and I think that gives him the right to say what he feels... I dont see your name on any of the honour boards at the club.
 
Deej said:
I don't hear anyone accusing Kouta of being anti-Carlton, or not a real supporter of the club, or a scumbag fan that the club can do without like
I was accused of being by a number of regulars on this messageboard for suggesting the same thing a week or so back as Kouta & co have now.

So the question is, are me and Koutoufides scumbag supporters or are we not?
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Its the people who've been praying for losses for weeks (I'd probably even put last week in there) that are anti-Carlton. I think we can all see theres more to gain from losing this week and it sucks, not good for the game at all.
 
Dramoth said:
Whereas, You are there quite happily saying that they are tanking and how proud you are that they are tanking and losing matches so that we can get the #1 draft pick and thats what makes you a "scumbag" supporter.

Ohh and btw... Kouta is a legend for the club... He has given years of quality service to the club and I think that gives him the right to say what he feels... I dont see your name on any of the honour boards at the club.
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I've never said anything like that on here, you're either lieing or your powers of interpretation are very poor. What i have said is exactly what Kouta has said, along with dozens of others on here and many corporate backers of the club have said too, that I'd rather have the club lose and get picks 1 and 3 than win another game all year.

You said we were scumbags for hoping the club would lose by the way, it had nothing to do with the tank issue whatsoever. If you were consistent you'd be calling Kouta a scumbag for what he said in this article.
 
Deej said:
I've never said anything like that on here, you're either lieing or your powers of interpretation are very poor. What i have said is exactly what Kouta has said, along with dozens of others on here and many corporate backers of the club have said too, that I'd rather have the club lose and get picks 1 and 3 than win another game all year.

You said we were scumbags for hoping the club would lose by the way, it had nothing to do with the tank issue whatsoever. If you were consistent you'd be calling Kouta a scumbag for what he said in this article.
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Perhaps I just dont like your attitude?

Meh... you tankers are going to win the arguement and the club is possibly going to get the #1 draft pick and I am sure that there are going plenty of sticky trousers come the end of the match.

Personally I feel that manipulating the team and the way they play is a form of cheating.

Perhaps I am to honest and fair to be associated with the club any more if thats the case.
 

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Scruff83 said:
Its the people who've been praying for losses for weeks (I'd probably even put last week in there) that are anti-Carlton. I think we can all see theres more to gain from losing this week and it sucks, not good for the game at all.
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It's a lack of vision that explains why you couldn't see the benefits earlier.
 
Deej said:
It's a lack of vision that explains why you couldn't see the benefits earlier.
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No... its faith and belief in the club that wanted us to win...

We could see the benefits, but we still love our club enough to want them to win matches regardless.
 
Dramoth said:
Perhaps I just dont like your attitude?

Meh... you tankers are going to win the arguement and the club is possibly going to get the #1 draft pick and I am sure that there are going plenty of sticky trousers come the end of the match.

Personally I feel that manipulating the team and the way they play is a form of cheating.

Perhaps I am to honest and fair to be associated with the club any more if thats the case.
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Load of crap. First of all, losing is not tanking, and it's not cheating. Tanking isn't even cheating, it's making the system work for you in the best interest of attaining long term success for the club. All i've said on here is i wanted the picks more than i wanted wins, and i would be hoping for fighting losses for the rest of the year. That is the attitude i had that lead to being called a scumbag supporter, nothing else.
 
Kouta has a brain.

I look at Wells and Goddard and when they play good games i always think how good they would have been at Carlton. If we win this week i will be doing the same with Kruezer for the next 10 years.
 
Deej said:
It's a lack of vision that explains why you couldn't see the benefits earlier.
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I could always see the benefits of losing. But IMO they were outweighed (massively) by the benefits of winning. After all, your meant to play sport to win. What does it do for the confidence of players who have been in our team for 3 or so years to have played in a measly 11 wins from 66 matches? Thats probably half the reason we have so many players that are takeing forever to develop, they dont have the confidence to take the game on.

How long have you been hopeing for losses for? Since we couldnt make the finals? I really doubt Kouta has been hopeing for losses for weeks too, so dont try put yourself in the same boat as him.
 
Scruff83 said:
I could always see the benefits of losing. But IMO they were outweighed (massively) by the benefits of winning. After all, your meant to play sport to win. What does it do for the confidence of players who have been in our team for 3 or so years to have played in a measly 11 wins from 66 matches? Thats probably half the reason we have so many players that are takeing forever to develop, they dont have the confidence to take the game on.

How long have you been hopeing for losses for? Since we couldnt make the finals? I really doubt Kouta has been hopeing for losses for weeks too, so dont try put yourself in the same boat as him.
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I'm not, I'm just saying that if you people had any consistency or conviction in your beliefs you'd be calling Kouta and many other great carlton champions scumbags now just like you've called many of us on here lately for wanting to lose to get the pick.

Greg Swann said it weeks ago, he's the CEO, is he a scumbag too?
 

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Deej said:
Greg Swann said it weeks ago, he's the CEO, is he a scumbag too?
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Mate, Ive said it before, I couldnt give a toss what Greg Swann or any of the other suits at the club have to say. I do vaguely remember what he said though and it wasnt "I hope we lose so we get the pick". I dont remember exactly what it was but your taking it out of context to fuel your own argument.
 
Bronze said:
Former Blues president Ian Collins agreed: "My argument is that you have always got to try to win. You never, never give a sucker an even break."

Thank God this loser is no longer in charge!!!
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Let's not confuse the issue huh?
 
Scruff83 said:
Mate, Ive said it before, I couldnt give a toss what Greg Swann or any of the other suits at the club have to say. I do vaguely remember what he said though and it wasnt "I hope we lose so we get the pick". I dont remember exactly what it was but your taking it out of context to fuel your own argument.
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You are right. Swann never said anything about wanting to lose. He basically said that the draft picks would be handy.
 
C4[2]Yo`DooR said:
*drops down a ladder for ODN to hop aboard the TANK*


... c'mon ... you know you want to !
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No, I am frantically trying to avoid being spooned right now. If I get away with that, I will probably go to sleep while others drive the tank right over me.
 
Swann would prefer the draft picks, it's a fact, you don't have to be einstein to work out what that means.

This is not about that anyway, I agree with Swann's mindset, the issue is people abusing other fans and the moral posturing going on that attempts to alienate fans with a different mindset. I can accept fans who want to win every game and furthermore, although i think it's a short-sighted mindset, I would never call these fans scumbags or say the club would be better off without them.

The club needs all fans big and small short and tall, pro picks or pro wins. That is the truth. If you resort to abusing other fans just because they want the picks more than the wins you're pretty much self-destructing. I don't think Carlton needs any more infighting, do you?
 

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Kouta: get draft pick

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