2013 Potential Draftee and Trade Watch

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Really most Cats fans should be satisfied with our picks in the ND and Rookie draft. if you believe that Wells is a good judge of talent and has a high strike rate.

We got two inside mids in Lang and Jansen And Jansen is a big bodied mid as well, while Lang has some pace. On paper they fill some needs we have.

With Toohey and Kola we have some decent sized potential backmen. Certainly Toohey is of KP size and Kola may become suitably tall to be considered a KP size.

So now, assuming that some of these players come thru, is a ruckman to replace Hmac in time.

Lang hopefully will replace Kelly, Jansen a Corey type replacement, Kola a Rivers/Brown type 3 rd tall backman and Toohey to replace Lonergan.

Now it would be wishful thinking at best, and foolish at worst, to think it will all work out this way - but at least we have options now to fill voids we currently have or will have soon.

If we recruit well next season we could get that second ruckman and some players that add depth in case the above does not happen.
 
I think what Wells has tried to do at the ND is recruit some solid role players to fill a need who aren't necessarily going to become stars but will end up developing into good reliable players in their own right. From a distance all 3 draftees seem like high character people who you just know will work hard to get the most out of themselves, along with the fact that none of them look like being long term projects like Hamling or Brown for example.

Lang with his light frame and late b'day suggests that there is plenty of upside aswell as the fact that he didn't complete a pre-season heading into his final year with the Falcons due to cricket commitments. He really doesn't seem to have any major weakness in his game at all so i think at worst we're going to end up with a solid well rounded midfielder. And who knows he may end up being much better than that.

Jansen gives our midfield something different with his height and size. The club will be looking to develop him into an inside bull who wins his own ball, tackles hard and has a real physical presence so that when the opposition win the ball they're looking over their shoulder with the expectation that they're about to recieve a bone cruching tackle from this bloke. He seems to have a willingness to want to do all the 1% things which is bound to make him popular with his team mates in no time. Finally, his strong overhead marking is going to be a real asset linking up through the midfield, particularly for a team that likes to go through the corridor limiting the amount of turnovers.

Kola reminds me of an old fashioned, no nonsense type of defender who isn't afraid to come off his man and help out his fellow defenders when necessary. I think in time he'll be more than big enough to be a KPD, particularly when you take into account his athleticism, but initally will start out as that 3rd tall who can play on both talls and smalls. He also seems to have clean strong hands which is always a good thing for any footballer. Don't be surprised if we make a big play for his twin brother at some stage either, i think the club would be more than happy to help reunite the twins.

Anyway, if at this point you are still reading my post :D thanks for your patience as i was just trying to bring some positivity in regard to our recent draftees rather than some of the negative things i have been reading recently. Cheers :thumbsu:
 
dazbroncos said:
The system is designed for us, or any team with long term success to fall.
So far, we have daffy ducked (turn dodge perry twist spin! ) our way around it.
To get we would have to give - and give big.
Guthrie and a pick for Ziebell, Shiel, Adams is probably a bit over but it is what they would want. My issue is what does it gain us? To we need what we get that badly to give up what we would have to?

FWIW, I wound never give up Guthrie.

Interesting question however YOTC

GO CATTERS
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LOL :thumbsu:
 

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Turbocat said:
LOL :thumbsu:
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Anyone not growing up under the awesome influence of the original Warner Bros stuff would be lost here - glad it was a winner for at least one...

Of course, I didn't add the THWACK as the stick nails him in the face but you know…..

GO Catters
 
year of the cat said:
I think the likes of O'Meara are probably unattainable and would require the trading of untouchables. I'm probably thinking of the next tier down - still excellent, A-grade players but not rated as superstars just yet. As you say you can keep going back to the draft and hoping that one will come through that may become a star - but when you keep getting first round picks where we do the probability isn't great I would have thought.
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Sort another Caddy ? Id say that is doable.

I still sort of question in the long run the supreme advantage of that sort of player over what we would normally gather and groom. Thurlow for instance has a very good chance of becoming Agrade
Im open to the idea it just depends on the cost I suppose , and as I said I think the days getting a young star for an older one is done , I say you would have to give some one in the 23-26 range to have any chance to get a quality kid.

Imagine us need a quality forward , Patton on the market next year. Just who would we have that would tempt them. Its seem the best chance for trading for someone is probably when you don't need to trade.
 
Turbocat said:
Couldn't resist !!


The AFL equalization plan in action
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GOLD! and exactly what i was getting at...

And if one whipper snapper gets into this after viewing, my…. sorry TC… our work here is done!

GO Catters
 
Turbocat said:
Sort another Caddy ? Id say that is doable.

I still sort of question in the long run the supreme advantage of that sort of player over what we would normally gather and groom. Thurlow for instance has a very good chance of becoming Agrade
Im open to the idea it just depends on the cost I suppose , and as I said I think the days getting a young star for an older one is done , I say you would have to give some one in the 23-26 range to have any chance to get a quality kid.

Imagine us need a quality forward , Patton on the market next year. Just who would we have that would tempt them. Its seem the best chance for trading for someone is probably when you don't need to trade.
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Next year, having said all that, may be a year to try and add higher picks to go to the draft with rather than trade for an established player. Though if Patton was put up for trade, I'm sure we would look at it closely. You would think though that the Bulldogs, in dire need of a key forward, and the likelihood of having a high single digit first rounder to play with would be best suited.

It does sound like at this early stage that next years draft has both plenty of talent (particularly taller types) and plenty of depth. With a number of on our list at the crossroads in 2014, it could be the time to go heavy in the draft.
 
year of the cat said:
Next year, having said all that, may be a year to try and add higher picks to go to the draft with rather than trade for an established player. Though if Patton was put up for trade, I'm sure we would look at it closely. You would think though that the Bulldogs, in dire need of a key forward, and the likelihood of having a high single digit first rounder to play with would be best suited.

It does sound like at this early stage that next years draft has both plenty of talent (particularly taller types) and plenty of depth. With a number of on our list at the crossroads in 2014, it could be the time to go heavy in the draft.
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You would think so. There are maybe 3-5 players that are on the watch list - and if they do not perform then they could well be out of the hoops. I just hope we have at least 3 live picks in the next ND - and I expect Blicavs will be upgraded so that will mean 4 senior listed players will need go.

That means Schroder, Brown, Bews, Stringer, etc will all need to have a good season to remain on the list. Strange thing is they could still be - except maybe Stringer.
 
Jon Douglas said:
You would think so. There are maybe 3-5 players that are on the watch list - and if they do not perform then they could well be out of the hoops. I just hope we have at least 3 live picks in the next ND - and I expect Blicavs will be upgraded so that will mean 4 senior listed players will need go.

That means Schroder, Brown, Bews, Stringer, etc will all need to have a good season to remain on the list. Strange thing is they could still be - except maybe Stringer.
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All players will be looked at but some will be more vulnerable imo.
Bews should be safe but the other three there mentioned would be hoping for a big 2014 , but they wouldn't be alone. Rivers , Hmac , Enright maybe even a couple of the 2001's will be looked at for delisting if they have poor seasons. Would we have thought Chappy would be gone this time last year IF we knew he kicked 4 goals in a final.

And of course if we take them at their word , they will be lining up an IN trades (Sydney style perhaps even now) so all players even the young ones like Duncan and Vardy will be know now that very few , if anyone , is 100% safe.
 
It is a hard one. Cannot destroy the culture by delisting or trading players too readily - but yes players must perform - as long as they have been given the opportunities to do so.

People under the microscope too much can have a hard time performing - too much pressure. Then again you cannot promise too much as then they have no reason to do all the hard work.

You do earn credit - and surely Duncan and similar players get some allowance if they play a bad game or two and not have to think they could be traded.
 
Jon Douglas said:
You would think so. There are maybe 3-5 players that are on the watch list - and if they do not perform then they could well be out of the hoops. I just hope we have at least 3 live picks in the next ND - and I expect Blicavs will be upgraded so that will mean 4 senior listed players will need go.

That means Schroder, Brown, Bews, Stringer, etc will all need to have a good season to remain on the list. Strange thing is they could still be - except maybe Stringer.
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Possibly add Rivers & Kelly last year of contracts
 
Jon Douglas said:
It is a hard one. Cannot destroy the culture by delisting or trading players too readily - but yes players must perform - as long as they have been given the opportunities to do so.

People under the microscope too much can have a hard time performing - too much pressure. Then again you cannot promise too much as then they have no reason to do all the hard work.

You do earn credit - and surely Duncan and similar players get some allowance if they play a bad game or two and not have to think they could be traded.
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How about Varcoe, he had 12 games to come good, didn't!....does he have special rights?
 

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Yep I agree even some of the older players will be watched closely. They will all know what happened to Chappy.

Rivers could yet be quite good and Kelly has been a gun for us. But if slows and plays more like he did at the back end of this season - it could well be his last season. But like Corey he deserves his place until someone is good enough to replace him.
 
Jon Douglas said:
Yep I agree even some of the older players will be watched closely. They will all know what happened to Chappy.

Rivers could yet be quite good and Kelly has been a gun for us. But if slows and plays more like he did at the back end of this season - it could well be his last season. But like Corey he deserves his place until someone is good enough to replace him.
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At least you don't seem to protect sacred cows till the culture unravels, not like some on this forum. :thumbsu:
 
year of the cat said:
Next year, having said all that, may be a year to try and add higher picks to go to the draft with rather than trade for an established player. Though if Patton was put up for trade, I'm sure we would look at it closely. You would think though that the Bulldogs, in dire need of a key forward, and the likelihood of having a high single digit first rounder to play with would be best suited.

It does sound like at this early stage that next years draft has both plenty of talent (particularly taller types) and plenty of depth. With a number of on our list at the crossroads in 2014, it could be the time to go heavy in the draft.
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I think you might be on the money here mate.

I'm fairly sure next year will be Enright's swansong.

Lonergan appears to be on his last legs.

If Rivers has another year where he misses a chunk of footy then I wouldn't bother offering him another contract unless it was on vastly reduced money and it would only be for 1 year.

McIntosh would want to get on the park otherwise he might be pensioned off.

I think it is only fair that Bartel, Kelly and, to a lesser extent, Stokes and Johnson are monitored throughout the year to see how they are tracking.

Varcoe would really want to produce a lot more in '14.

And then there are the fringe players who we all expect to get more chances but need to start sticking the opportunities presented.

Schroder, Cowan and Stringer are the obvious guys but the spotlight shouldn't be packed away for guys like Smedts (who is one guy I'm starting to go a bit cold on, he needs to start doing more of the basic stuff well and then, only then, try a few party tricks), Brown, Horlin-Smith, Vardy, Taylor Hunt and Murdoch. These latter names need to close the gap between their best and worst but also need to start picking up more of the slack. Christensen, Duncan, Guthrie and Motlop have stepped up, time for these guys to join them in the trenches.

I'd really like to see Hamling show more next year. Injuries of not, McCarthy is another one who needs to get out there and start producing some decent footy.

Hartman must get fitter otherwise his place on the senior list should be questioned.

And then there is the elephant in the room - Menzel.

It is a ruthless business these days but players who have been with us for 3 or 4 years need to start pressing hard for senior selection.

If the draft is "deeper" and "better" than most years we may very well look to load up again meaning spots will need to be freed up.

Already I'm looking forward to seeing how kids like Clem Smith, Patrick McCartin, Christian Petracca, Jake Lever, Hugh Goddard etc go.

We made some tough calls on Chapman, Josh Hunt, Podsiadly and West at the end of the season.

They are probably just the beginning as the landscape changes via FA and younger players being more agressive in trying to get to clubs of their choosing after serving their 2 year draft stint.
 
If we were to look to add higher or more draft picks I am not to sure how we would do that. To get higher or more picks you need to give something away especially to get higher picks. Lets say for arguments sake we finish 6th next year. That nets us pick 12, is that high enough? Ideally you want a top 10 pick. But to get that who do you give up or do you just take your pick 12. Maybe a package of say Varcoe plus pick 12 for pick 5 or 6 is how you do it.
 
Given that this draft looks like it'll be dominated by key position players in the top half, pick 12-15 might easily be enough to get a really quality midfielder.
 
The Pivotonian - I'd say that we will see a combination of retirements, delistings and/or possible trades. If 2013 was anything to go by then I think it will be Kelly and Lonergan's last years. Both put in some good performances but really their seasons taken in totality were poor. If that decline continues then they probably should hang up the boots.

Bartel is a concern but I think with a different role he is capable of re-inventing himself. SJ, fortunately, is showing no signs yet of decline and could easily play another 2-3 seasons.

Enright, similarly, still has a lot to offer, but mentally may feel that it's time to give it away.

Of the younger ones, Shroeder, Cowan, McCarthy and Stringer are needing to show that they are capable of being AFL standard. I reckon 2-3 of them will be gone.

Blicavs will clearly be elevated from the rookie list. But I see that, trades aside, we could take 5-6 players at next years draft. It will make us probably one of the youngest lists in the comp and really signify the end of one era and hopefully the dawn of another successful one.

thejester has made an interesting point with regard to this draft. Although it is top heavy with taller talent, there may be a great opportunity to pick up a quality mid if everyone stocks up on taller types. I'm not sure whether that would be the right approach but it seems you could at least get some nice mids slipping into the second round next year.
 
Yep the transition will be effectively over after the next ND. All sides have a few older players in their team so that is not a transition situation.

We will lose 2 older players you would think and delist/trade 3 players. Total of 5 players off the senior list. That allows Blicavs to be upgraded and gives us 4 ND picks (maybe 1 Rookie maybe upgraded and that gives 3 live ND picks for Wells to work with).

Having 3-4 live ND picks next year would be good unless some really wanted player is up for trade.

Given how good some people are saying that next year's draft will be it seems unlikely we will trade. But perhaps Varcoe could be traded to upgrade or get another pick - if he does not play as well as expected.

But in 2015 we will then have quite a young side and few really older players. By 2016 we should be really hitting our stride - and I expect so will GC. But we will see Geelong only need 2-3 picks each for some time - and we will look at trading to get a gun player - with just 1-2 extra players we should be a gun side again.

So 2014 - go for draft picks and will need create spots for these picks and Blicavs - and 2016-2018 we look more to trading - players or picks to get the 1-2 players we may need to set us up for a prolonged period of on field success.
 
Jon Douglas said:
We will lose 2 older players you would think and delist/trade 3 players. Total of 5 players off the senior list. That allows Blicavs to be upgraded and gives us 4 ND picks (maybe 1 Rookie maybe upgraded and that gives 3 live ND picks for Wells to work with).
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Considering we just cleaned out the Rookie list I doubt very much we'd be looking to elevate any of them other than Blicavs.

Sherringham would be the only obvious candidate as it'll be his last year but, from where I sit, he doesn't really fit into the rebuild/remodel or offer anything that isn't already there on the list (that is also why I still shake my head a bit that he was retained and Eardley wasn't since we have a few "Sherringham" types [mids] but not many "Eardley" types [small defenders]:confused:) .

Sherringham would have to play out of his skin to get a look in as I don't see him as a better option than guys like Schroder, Cowan or Stringer (who appear the ones most likely to be in the firing line).

I'd be stunned if any of Toohey, Bourke, Bates or Luxford got elevated after 1 season.

Could happen but I'd be very, very surprised considering the way Geelong utilises the rookie list (i.e. usually giving a rookie a couple of years before making a call).
 
Yeah I said maybe - just in case a Rookie stands up and needs to replace an injured player. Maybe Toohey for Lonergan - if Lonergan got injured. Of course they could consider Blicavs or Walker for that role given they would have a bit of experience and fitness over Toohey.

Then again Lonergan might retire at next season's end as well and Toohey made a good fist of it - you never know.

But yes historically it would seem unlikely we would upgrade a first year Rookie. Leaving maybe 4 ND picks plus an upgrade for Blicavs.
 
On Sherringham I completely agree - not sure what he brings that could see him make the senior list.

A bit of a strange one as if we had delisted him we could have had Tsitas or Bundy Jnr. as a Rookie now. My guess is that one of them would have more chance of making it that Sherringham.
 
I think we will cut pretty deep next year-it looks like a deep draft and although a lot of those whom we cut or trade have little currency, in a good draft you can get good players with third rounders etc, as we did in 99/01/09. It's the sort of draft in which you would want to hand Wells 5 or 6 picks, particularly considering our minimal picks the last 2 years.

So I think basically if you have been on the list longer than 3 years and are not in the best 22 at year's end you are in big trouble-this applies to Brownm Cowan Schroder Stringer and Burbury mainly. Bews and McCarthy may be given more time as they have had injuries but even they will need to progress to stay on the list.

Also Blitz will go up and the free agency pool for 2014 is much better than this year's so we would go at some targets there.

You would expect Enright may not want to go around again (though I hope he does), Kelly maybe retirements wise. I would be retiring Lonners but he already has a contract for 2015. Varcoe will be a free agent and he may look to test the market there

All in all it wouldn't surprise to see 8 or more changes on the senior list next year.
 
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