2015 Draft Discussion

[cheekyLionsFan]

I suggested about six rounds from the end of the season that I would prefer we didn't win too many more games as I couldn't see the point and was shouted down. Still think I was right on that. Those last few wins did nothing for us for this season except relegate us down the draft list.

didn't matter though as we traded our first pick for beams

 

[jackess]

Or that some may take a broader, long term view.

Recent premiership teams don't have a lot of top 3 draft picks. It's no coincidence.

 

[jjami15]

Recent premiership teams don't have a lot of top 3 draft picks. It's no coincidence.

Not true - Hodge pick 1, Roughie pick 2. Understand the 'alot' part by they are quality which you get at the top end of the draft (sometimes).

 

[carnthemlions]

Or that some may take a broader, long term view.

Well, good luck with that.

 

[dmac_55]

All I wonder is if we had of attained a top 3 draft pick last year would we be able to keep crisp? Maybe 3 and our second for Beamer? Crisp has looked quite good at the enemy, would of been best 18 at our club this year..

 

[Ironmonger]

All I wonder is if we had of attained a top 3 draft pick last year would we be able to keep crisp? Maybe 3 and our second for Beamer? Crisp has looked quite good at the enemy, would of been best 18 at our club this year..

I think Crisp is at the right club for him. Buckley rates him higher than Leppitsch did.

 

[jackess]

All I wonder is if we had of attained a top 3 draft pick last year would we be able to keep crisp? Maybe 3 and our second for Beamer? Crisp has looked quite good at the enemy, would of been best 18 at our club this year..

There was a fair chance Crisp was on his way out anyway being unsigned at the end of the season.

 

[jjami15]

All I wonder is if we had of attained a top 3 draft pick last year would we be able to keep crisp? Maybe 3 and our second for Beamer? Crisp has looked quite good at the enemy, would of been best 18 at our club this year..

I would most probably be the only one here but where our list currently sits it might have been wiser to have not gone for Beams and Christensen (blasphemy right!) we could have gotten 2m Peter and also Goddard, Tom Lamb and kept Crisp whk from what he showed at the back end of the season wasn't going anywhere until the trade. It's just that we have glaring holes, so far from finals it hurts and our mids are at the right age in comparison to the rest of our list. The media are picking away at Carltons list but I wish they would do the same to ours as well.

 

[carnthemlions]

I would most probably be the only one here but where our list currently sits it might have been wiser to have not gone for Beams and Christensen (blasphemy right!) we could have gotten 2m Peter and also Goddard, Tom Lamb and kept Crisp whk from what he showed at the back end of the season wasn't going anywhere until the trade. It's just that we have glaring holes, so far from finals it hurts and our mids are at the right age in comparison to the rest of our list. The media are picking away at Carltons list but I wish they would do the same to ours as well.

Yeah, we have a lot in common with Carlton right?
Far too early to be making that sort of call. Pick 5 might've been a bit early for Wright going on where he was drafted, and I don't think Goddard would've been available to us in the 2nd round either. It doesn't matter, because neither would be making much of a contribution to the side at the moment(or for at least another couple of years).

 

[Skoob]

But, coming out of contract, he was disappointed that the Lions were slow to offer him a two-year extension and asked McConville to “explore any opportunities down south’’.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...-for-fresh-start/story-fni5f6hd-1227094736955
Crisp was already not just open, but actively looking for an opportunity in Melbourne. I wouldn't worry about "what ifs" there.

 

[jjami15]

Yeah, we have a lot in common with Carlton right?
Far too early to be making that sort of call. Pick 5 might've been a bit early for Wright going on where he was drafted, and I don't think Goddard would've been available to us in the 2nd round either. It doesn't matter, because neither would be making much of a contribution to the side at the moment(or for at least another couple of years).

The last five years we have finished 2014 - 4th last (*3rd last), 2013 - 7th last (*5th last), 2012 - 6th last (*4th last), 2011 - 3rd last (*2nd last), 2010 - 4th last and this season albeit very early doesn't look like we are going to improve past these results. It is frustration that makes one highlight these things. I think because we are in Qld and with our success over a decade ago we are forgotten. If we were in Melbourbe it would be a very different story.
* minus GC and GWS

Wright was taken at 8, three picks later and the Patfull compo which was on traded to Saints was used to draft Goddard.

 

[Bucking Beads]

The last five years we have finished 2014 - 4th last (*3rd last), 2013 - 7th last (*5th last), 2012 - 6th last (*4th last), 2011 - 3rd last (*2nd last), 2010 - 4th last and this season albeit very early doesn't look like we are going to improve past these results. It is frustration that makes one highlight these things. I think because we are in Qld and with our success over a decade ago we are forgotten. If we were in Melbourbe it would be a very different story.
* minus GC and GWS

Wright was taken at 8, three picks later and the Patfull compo which was on traded to Saints was used to draft Goddard.

We've been screwed by the GC and GWS inclusions to the competition. We would have nabbed a decent key forward without them being introduced IMO. With more teams it will mean bottom teams will be bottom teams for longer IMO.

 

[winged1]

We've been screwed by the GC and GWS inclusions to the competition. We would have nabbed a decent key forward without them being introduced IMO. With more teams it will mean bottom teams will be bottom teams for longer IMO.

But we knew that was happening when we recruited Fev. Nobody to blame but ourselves, we knew it was a risk and we rolled snake eyes. Or in Fev's case trouser snake eyes.

 

[carnthemlions]

The last five years we have finished 2014 - 4th last (*3rd last), 2013 - 7th last (*5th last), 2012 - 6th last (*4th last), 2011 - 3rd last (*2nd last), 2010 - 4th last and this season albeit very early doesn't look like we are going to improve past these results. It is frustration that makes one highlight these things. I think because we are in Qld and with our success over a decade ago we are forgotten. If we were in Melbourbe it would be a very different story.
* minus GC and GWS

Wright was taken at 8, three picks later and the Patfull compo which was on traded to Saints was used to draft Goddard.

And this relates to our recruitment of Beams and Christensen how?

 

[lukiuslion]

I have now seen this doubt surrounding the Beams decision on a few threads. When an A-grader and someone of his quality says "I want to join your club", you do it. There is only about 20 players in the league that are currently his calibre, don't let a few shalackings cloud your judgement or make you jump to frustrated conclusions, he is the PERFECT age for our list too.

 

[Kevvo]

I have now seen this doubt surrounding the Beams decision on a few threads. When an A-grader and someone of his quality says "I want to join your club", you do it. There is only about 20 players in the league that are currently his calibre, don't let a few shalackings cloud your judgement or make you jump to frustrated conclusions, he is the PERFECT age for our list too.

Yeah, I find that line of logic crazy.

(EDIT: to be clear, I don't mean Lukiusmacsimus 's point. I think his point is spot on. I mean the argument he is arguing against)

Beams is an All-Australian and Copeland trophy winner entering what you would expect to be his prime. There is absolutely no way we are worse off in the short or medium term with him in the side.

Christensen, similarly, is a very effective premiership player.

I can't see the rationale for not recruiting those guys to have a shot at 18 year old KPPs. There are more than enough examples of high KPP drafts not working out to know that it's a risk. In contrast, it is not a risk to pick up 2 excellent midfielders who are effective right now.

 

[Sanchez365]

Agreed. But obvs recruiting a collingwood player means the sky is falling.

 

[jjami15]

As I said I would be in the minority with thinking like that. I am very happy that he come to our club and yes he is at the right age to be entering his prime. Both Christensen and Beams add to our team. It's just the glaring obvious deficiencies that we have in regards to KPP's and our overall list. The last five years haven't been any different and I can't see it changing soon without some hard decisions.

 

[Kevvo]

As I said I would be in the minority with thinking like that. I am very happy that he come to our club and yes he is at the right age to be entering his prime. Both Christensen and Beams add to our team. It's just the glaring obvious deficiencies that we have in regards to KPP's and our overall list. The last five years haven't been any different and I can't see it changing soon without some hard decisions.

I understand what you're getting at, but I think more patience is necessary.

IMO, this is easily the best midfield in terms of individual proven performance that we've had since 2001-4. When they're mostly healthy, the depth will improve us on the HBF and HFF. In Clarke and Gardiner we have two KPDs who look very likely to be somewhere in the effective-excellent range.

For sure we are short KPFs. At the moment, they are all very young. Even if they don't become top-end key forwards, they will almost certainly improve with experience and physical development. At that stage, I'd be very confident that the problems with our forward line would have a much less acute impact on our rest-of-field confidence and performance.

In contrast, I think it would be a thousand times bigger risk to break apart the one likely strength of our team for the sake of possibly fixing a weakness that is likely to get at least a bit less bad regardless.

 

[lionshine]

Stuck for words after my reply. lionshine: 1. WLF: 0.

 

[POBT]

We've had an awful midfield for 10 years. If we've over corrected slightly (and that remains to be seen), then it is an understandable reaction to a decade of losing the midfield battle weekly.

 

[Panthera]

We've had an awful midfield for 10 years. If we've over corrected slightly (and that remains to be seen), then it is an understandable reaction to a decade of losing the midfield battle weekly.

Can't wait to actually see them on the park together

Rockliff Beams Hanley Rich Redden Christensen Zorko

In any case, no such thing as too many midfielders

 

[bungalow_bill]

If we don't use our first pick (likely top3) on trading for a KF do we draft one of the two highly rated KPP's ? If we get a 1st rounder for Aish we potentially could draft both of them.

9. Josh Schache
Club: Murray Bushrangers
Position: Key Forward
Height: 197 cm
Weight: 93 kg

Probably the most promising ‘true’ key forward of 2015, Schache kicked 27 goals from 15 games as a 17 year old. Schache prides himself on his contested marking, averaging just over one per game and 4.4 marks per game in the TAC Cup. Schache is a great player below the knees, and unlike most key forwards, he is a reliable field kick and shot for goal. Schache has speed on the lead and he also likes to use his physicality. Schache can kick a goal from most places on the field, and he’s got a 55 metre cannon too. Schache is in a similar boat to Peter Wright at this point in time. He’s shown his talent, but he needs to start taking more marks, particularly in contests, And if he can play 15 games, he must kick around 40 goals.

10. Sam Weideman
Club: Eastern Ranges
Position: Key Forward
Height: 195 cm
Weight: 89 kg

Grandson of Collingwood legend Murray, and son of Mark, Sam Weideman is an extraordinarily talented key forward, who will be available on the open market. 2014 was an up and down year for the forward. He was able to play 15 games, but only kicked 19 goals and 15 behinds. His statline is poor, but recruiters will look to his best games to find out why he is so highly regarded. Weideman is a terrific mark of the ball. His contested marking is a standout in pack situations. However, what is most impressive is his ability to take one grab marks on the lead, particularly in sticky situations. You know if the ball is within his long reach, then he won’t drop it. Weideman was named in the bests in three games throughout 2014. His average statline in the bests read three goals, 12 disposals, 7 marks and three contested marks. Weideman plays as a true leading centre half forward, but he also has the size and skill set to play as a full forward.

 

[Fatcat08]

If we don't use our first pick (likely top3) on trading for a KF do we draft one of the two highly rated KPP's ? If we get a 1st rounder for Aish we potentially could draft both of them.

9. Josh Schache
Club: Murray Bushrangers
Position: Key Forward
Height: 197 cm
Weight: 93 kg

Probably the most promising ‘true’ key forward of 2015, Schache kicked 27 goals from 15 games as a 17 year old. Schache prides himself on his contested marking, averaging just over one per game and 4.4 marks per game in the TAC Cup. Schache is a great player below the knees, and unlike most key forwards, he is a reliable field kick and shot for goal. Schache has speed on the lead and he also likes to use his physicality. Schache can kick a goal from most places on the field, and he’s got a 55 metre cannon too. Schache is in a similar boat to Peter Wright at this point in time. He’s shown his talent, but he needs to start taking more marks, particularly in contests, And if he can play 15 games, he must kick around 40 goals.

10. Sam Weideman
Club: Eastern Ranges
Position: Key Forward
Height: 195 cm
Weight: 89 kg

Grandson of Collingwood legend Murray, and son of Mark, Sam Weideman is an extraordinarily talented key forward, who will be available on the open market. 2014 was an up and down year for the forward. He was able to play 15 games, but only kicked 19 goals and 15 behinds. His statline is poor, but recruiters will look to his best games to find out why he is so highly regarded. Weideman is a terrific mark of the ball. His contested marking is a standout in pack situations. However, what is most impressive is his ability to take one grab marks on the lead, particularly in sticky situations. You know if the ball is within his long reach, then he won’t drop it. Weideman was named in the bests in three games throughout 2014. His average statline in the bests read three goals, 12 disposals, 7 marks and three contested marks. Weideman plays as a true leading centre half forward, but he also has the size and skill set to play as a full forward.

Just might be worth giving Dukes Of Hurley a bit of credit if you're going to use his work FYI.

 

[jackess]

The problem with drafting a KPF is do they join the queue and sit behind McStay, Close, Freeman, Andrews and possibly Hammelmann, Staker, Leunberger and Paine or do we based on their under 18 form let them jump the rest and start them off in the team so we can get games into them next season?