It's not as simplistic as having "a designated tackler" or specialist tackler but more a particular strength of that player. Carr was still an excellent kick of the football and none of those I listed above were one-dimensional players.
Strategy 2015 Tactics and Strategy
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TeeKray
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- #52
I think Wines is a pretty decent tackler/big bodied midfielder. Boak and Cornes are not bad either and Hartlett has really improved that area of his game over the last couple of years since his shoulder problems have eased up. I think with maturity and confidence we'll probably see a few players develop a harder edge to their games. Polec is the one that really needs improvement in that regard.
Wines is a great tackler, no doubt. He has such a brilliant all round game though, seems he's always too busy doing everything else! Fitness is the big one with him that'll help him get to the ball more often.
I actually think Wingard has a bit of mongrel in him but it was missing a lot this year as he was a bit preoccupied with trying flashy stuff. His attack on the man and ball was first class in 2013 and led to alot of his goals/assists. Hopefully he's back hard at it this year with a bit more size on him to boot.
I don't think the gameplan needs alot of tinkering.Obviously there will be with Ryder in and the general evolution of it, but I feel we just need a but more poise in big moments, as the brashness of youth cost us is big games last year.A lot of our close loses we could've/should've won with a bit more poise,and experience as a group together ala Hawthorn, Geelong, Sydney we'd have finished 17-5 rather then 14-8.Our best footy is the best in the competition with daylight 2nd, as no one when we crank it up can stop the destructive run and goal scoring we are capable of.If Burgess 3 year plan makes the players more capable of sustaining that football then look out comp.
Been watching a few of our games.. no one gets away from a Wines tackle. He will be fitter with another preseason.
Chad is also a good tackler. The one in the showdown on MacKay, was the first tackle in the match. MacKay thought he was away lol
Wines' tackle on Rodan in his debut, when Rodan tried his trademark sidestep and Ollie picked it from a mile off, was the exact moment I fell in love with Ollie.
off kilter
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Regarding having a tackling beast, rest assured peeps, we drafted him last year. Whilst rewatching our games this season I have had the luxury to single out and watch some players intently. One of these have been Jarman Impey. This is the guy who has it in his dna to be our junkyard dog. He has mongrel in spades. He not only goes hard at the ball but goes hard at the man given any chance. And hinkley knows it. He will be in our mids rotations by the end of the year. I really get excited when I think about our future with the likes of him and wines in our engine room.
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If anyone thinks that we're going into the 2015 season with the same tactics and gameplans of 2014 you have got to be kidding yourself. Opposition is going to study us harder now than ever before so obviously there are going to be a few tweaks and changes. Things like restricting our time in possession, closing down our space and run but most importantly set up around clearances (Reading a demographic from a few weeks back saying that we were top 3 in scoring from clearances). The real tactical mastermind coaches who really restricted us last year were Lyon, Longmire and Clarkson so it's going to be a real battle there.
The real tactic that can really throw teams off is the use of Ryder. I hope we don't just plant Ryder in the square and having him switch between ruck and forward the whole year as this is way too easy to figure out. Say if we played him a couple games forward then the next few back/wing in addition to the unknown position of westhoff it could really put teams off which is the beauty of it. Throughout the year I remember a few of us wanting 2 westhoffs and now we do, all that's left now is how ken can best utilise them to solidify an advantage. Also I think its about time Wingard spent more time in the midfield perhaps wing and roving a bit how gray is utilised now. They could switch positions to rest up and with wingard building a tank and putting on a few more kgs (he is at 82 on the website atm) I don't see why he can't play mid
FF: Monfries Schulz Ryder
HF: Neade Westhoff Wingard (swap resting gray)
The real tactic that can really throw teams off is the use of Ryder. I hope we don't just plant Ryder in the square and having him switch between ruck and forward the whole year as this is way too easy to figure out. Say if we played him a couple games forward then the next few back/wing in addition to the unknown position of westhoff it could really put teams off which is the beauty of it. Throughout the year I remember a few of us wanting 2 westhoffs and now we do, all that's left now is how ken can best utilise them to solidify an advantage. Also I think its about time Wingard spent more time in the midfield perhaps wing and roving a bit how gray is utilised now. They could switch positions to rest up and with wingard building a tank and putting on a few more kgs (he is at 82 on the website atm) I don't see why he can't play mid
FF: Monfries Schulz Ryder
HF: Neade Westhoff Wingard (swap resting gray)
Jello_B
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Well said, pretty much agree with this.
TeeKray
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Tactics change from game to game, moment to moment. Strategy generally remains the same.
It's one thing knowing what we are going to do, it's another stopping it.
It's one thing knowing what we are going to do, it's another stopping it.
Your never going to use the same gameplan from year to year that goes back to that old footy saying of if you stand still you go backwards.There isn't alot to tinker with when we are at full tilt just a few minor tweaks here and there, I don't know what those tweaks are that's why I'm a fan not a coach of any level.Our decision making under pressure cost us big time when it came to the crunch.A bit more poise late in games could've turned the prelim final late, if Ebert goes back and takes that kick instead of playing on, or Polec continued his run outside of Ebo in that corresponding play who knows what happens.Those things will come in time no doubt, there will be tweaks there already is one with Ryder into the side.I have no doubt Ken, Vossy, Hart and our brains trust will tinker with things but the base of our gameplan is top 4/top 2 material.I don't think that needs to be tinkered with to much.
Janus
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Premiership teams aren't premiership teams because people don't know how they play. They are premiership teams because they are so good it makes no difference. Everyone knows how Hawthorn play - doesn't make a difference. When Geelong made their run, everyone knew their style - didn't make a difference.
Clarkson mitigated our run with his own runners, knowing that was our advantage. He backed his players in to get the job done with his own tactics, and it almost backfired on him in both the first and last quarters. Lyon pressed up inside our forward half and shot out the other way, as did Longmire, but that's their style of gameplan.
It's time to stop worrying about how opposition teams are going to figure us out and just play to our strengths. No one is saying there won't be times to be duplicitous and throw players into various positions to outfox a coach who has constructed a gameplan to counter it. But saying 'This won't work, people will figure it out' before actually letting things go and seeing if it matters whether they know it or not is poor tactics. You start with the way you want to play first, then counter-move. Not counter-move and show weakness in your belief system from the very start. Ken has a way that he wants his team to play, and he needs to be unwavering in that.
Playing Ryder in the goal square might be 'too easy to figure out', but respectfully, who cares if they do? He's too athletic for most to beat one on one, and he will require a taller defender - most likely taking the second best defender in the team, with other defenders coming across to help out. Ryder's job isn't to be another Westhoff. It's to allow Westhoff to be Westhoff, and take the pressure off Schulz as the only primary target in the forward line when Westhoff is doing his thing. The reason why Lyon and Longmire succeeded last year was because they pressed up the ground to about the half-forward/midfield area, stifling our movement before shooting out the back and scoring quickly. Make no mistake, there will be times when Ryder pushes down the ground and takes the mark from a kick in because he's athletically gifted and Westhoff pushes into the role that Paddy vacated. But if ever a team was crying out for a tall target that started in the goal square and went on 20-30 m leads from it, it was 2014 Port Adelaide.
Of course, if Ken's idea is to play both Westhoff and Ryder at half forward and give them license to roam up and down the wings as they feel like it, that can work too. The one thing I don't want to see is a guy like Neade being the only man in the forward 50, or Impey going on a nice run and then kicking it into empty space because there is no target. That is what happens when you have opposition defenders who feel they can run with our players and leave the forward line unguarded, because they know they don't have to worry about players getting out the back. With a tall like Ryder there...suddenly, it doesn't have to be a pin point pass. Which means the defenders get in two minds about whether to push up with our guys into the midfield, or stay back to help with Ryder.
Ford Fairlane
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Ryder's fantastic athleticism will be used to full advantage. There will be times he will lead from or mark in the square, there will be other times when he's running hard up to half back.
As Kenny when he arrived said he told Schulzy, 'The fence around the 50m arc has come down mate'
As Kenny when he arrived said he told Schulzy, 'The fence around the 50m arc has come down mate'
Complacency and injuries IMO are the only two things standing in the way of our second Premiership. Our best is good enough to beat anyone, anywhere, on any day, and in any conditions. It will be interesting to see if Lobbe can take his game to another level with Paddy in the side.
When Geelong made their run teams tried their best to shut down the corridor but they also had options outside of the corridor which made them so great for their era, we need this; variation. So far our main go is to run and gun play on as much as possible. Teams as you said hawthorn, freo and swans found us out its only a matter of time till others do aswell. I never said that this doesnt work, that style personified out 2014 season. We've got that string to our bow now we just need an arrow. Who cares if other teams figure him out? Well then we will be back to 2014 set up with Neade at FF. I think the westhoff comment wasn't clear, I meant we needed one westhoff in the forward line and another westhoff roaming. Ryder is the former. Defenders are always in two minds about leaving the man and going third up as I am one myself. It depends on their reading of play and decision making. I get what your saying in defenders feeling more pressured if a ryder was at ff with a high ball coming in instead of say a neade.
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has anyone mention go the biff yet.....
go the biff, especially the young teams, from the first bounce. knees up, elbows out, fists ahoy.
oh, and kick more goals......
go the biff, especially the young teams, from the first bounce. knees up, elbows out, fists ahoy.
oh, and kick more goals......
pastmyprimus
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I don't think Port's core game plan will change much from last year. Enhancements yes but not a re-write. Ken has some pretty clear ideas about the style of football that can win finals. That's been drilled into the players already, practised over and over until it's become pretty much instinctive.
Strategy is one thing but you also need the talent to execute. Hawthorn's game plan is no great secret. Opposition coaches have studied the style closely. But its damn hard to counter when you've got the likes of Roughead, Rioli, Gibson, Smith, Burgoyne etc etc in your team.
Port's in the enviable position of having a sound game plan, a strong core of elite players (plus good depth outside the core) and a fitness base that's the envy of most teams. The team's also flexibile. If going tall in the forward line isn't working we can go short, and vice-versa.
We're in for a good ride this year.
Strategy is one thing but you also need the talent to execute. Hawthorn's game plan is no great secret. Opposition coaches have studied the style closely. But its damn hard to counter when you've got the likes of Roughead, Rioli, Gibson, Smith, Burgoyne etc etc in your team.
Port's in the enviable position of having a sound game plan, a strong core of elite players (plus good depth outside the core) and a fitness base that's the envy of most teams. The team's also flexibile. If going tall in the forward line isn't working we can go short, and vice-versa.
We're in for a good ride this year.
Porked04
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Well said. Ken's got all the tools to mix the game plan up. Wingard to midfield/half back ala 4th qtr prelim, gray forward/midfield, Westoff can play both ends, Ryder can be used up forward as another option. Kenny has enough aces up his sleeve if things aren't working.
floodbuster
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In the prelim we changed strategy for the last quarter to get Wingard in the game and it almost worked so my opinion is to have radical back up plans when certain players are not getting in the game.
Dave Omsby
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To me the only one we couldn't handle in the prelim last year was Roughead if we could device a tat tic to stop him next time it'll help
I quite simply would like more tackling and inside pressure at centre clearances particularly. I think Vossy will help us improve in this area.
chimmez
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That is where Ryder comes in.
When I was at the prelim final last year, after the game a few friends and I were talking about what we could have used to beath Hawthorn, and what we could reasonably get over the off season. I suggested that what we needed was a Jeremy Cameron type who can switch onto Roughead when he moves into the centre without disturbing our defensive set (ie, putting trengove to counter). Ryder fits this role perfectly.
Last season we weren't one tall short in offence, which you hear around here quite a bit. We were one tall short overall. Whenever Lobbe needed a break, we either had to be a tall short in defence or offence (ie, did we use Trengove or Westhoff in the ruck). Especially so with Westhoff, as he plays the loose across the ground so effectively. So, when Hale was resting forward in the prelim, and Roughead was in the ruck, we had the option of a mismatch in the ruck (ie, Lobbe v Roughead - think how Trengove won us the game in the 2013 2nd showdown, that type of mismatch), or a mismatch in defence (Trengove in the ruck, therefore Hale's matchup would have to be O'Shea or Bobby).
Now, with Ryder our versatility has increased such that we can go tall or small in offence, whilst resting Lobbe, and also whilst not diminishing our defensive setup. Thus, not only have we somewhat countered the use of Roughead (he's such a good player it really isn't possible to completely cover Roughead), but we not have the ability to use the same tactic on opposition teams as we now have our own Roughead in Ryder.
RussellEbertHandball
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Saw a replay of the PF this arvo. We need our gorilla playing - like Roughead for the Hawks and Buddy for the Swan. Time for Harvey to step up.
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I am hoping that more than Harvey steps us
I watched it again this arvo as well, and we were monstered in the clearances from the end of the 1st through until about the midway of the 4th.That killed us.Ryder in the ruck will be more then handy as he's a great tap ruckman, his hitouts go to advantage alot more then Lobbe's who is more your give a contest, run the other ruckman into the ground type of ruckman.A lot of little things went wrong that night, Ryder coming into that 22 will be worth another 5 goals I feel.
