Abbott Leadership challenge - "Et tu, Turnbull?" - 14/9/15

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kfc1 said:
Maggie has taught me that this entire image can just be dismissed by the words "old data"

Nonetheless, “In 2009-10, adult victims included 25,296 females…compared with 6,992 males” does not equal 95-99% of victims are women :drunk:
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80% is an overwhelming majority.
 
kfc1 said:
Your maths needs work.
6992/(25296+6992)*100 = 21.65% of victims are male

lol @ panning me for not being able to hold an argument, at least i can do simple maths :drunk:
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1. It was a typo.
2. Your maths is wrong. Try reading the data again.

EDIT: I'll give you a hint. My mistake was closer than yours.
 

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Rustin Cohle said:
1. It was a typo.
2. Your maths is wrong. Try reading the data again.

EDIT: I'll give you a hint. My mistake was closer than yours.
Click to expand...
I assumed the persons reporting family violence incidents were actually victims. Perhaps not.
Take the finalised intervention orders then:
5097/(16906+5097)*100 = 23% male victims

Can you quote the text from that image which you think gives you 87% of victims are female, or 91-95% which was the first ludicrous number put forward?
 
kfc1 said:
I assumed the persons reporting family violence incidents were actually victims. Perhaps not.
Take the finalised intervention orders then:
5097/(16906+5097)*100 = 23% male victims

Can you quote the text from that image which you think gives you 87% of victims are female, or 91-95% which was the first ludicrous number put forward?
Click to expand...

It's all under 'Gender of victim and perpetrator' section.
 
AIC says 25% of intimate partner homicide victims are male (Table 3)
http://aic.gov.au/publications/current series/rip/21-40/rip38.html

Women are only 37% of all homicide victims. Going by the logic of your dismissal of male DV victims, why do we care about violence against women at all? After all, it's only a minority. In fact, the only type of homicide where female victims outnumber males is intimate partner violence.

Rustin Cohle said:
It's all under 'Gender of victim and perpetrator' section.
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Think you need to learn to read.
Has anyone ever argued against 91-95% of perps who kill women being male? :nuts:
That statistic says nothing about the percentage of victims who are male.
 
In nsw over the last 10 years the murder rate by DV is nearly 80% of women nearly all by male partner. For males its 20% but the interesting thing is that even out of that the majority is not by partner but by other relative normally the father.

So any argument that tries to say that men are not the issue here is disingenous.
 
kfc1 said:
AIC says 25% of intimate partner homicide victims are male (Table 3)
http://aic.gov.au/publications/current series/rip/21-40/rip38.html

Women are only 37% of all homicide victims. Going by the logic of your dismissal of male DV victims, why do we care about violence against women at all? After all, it's only a minority. In fact, the only type of homicide where female victims outnumber males is intimate partner violence.


Think you need to learn to read.
Has anyone ever argued against 91-95% of perps who kill women being male? :nuts:
That statistic says nothing about the percentage of victims who are male.
Click to expand...

25296 female vs. 6992 male victims
Take out the male on male and female on female victims.
23525 female vs. 4195 male victims
27720 total
4195/(23525+4195)*100 = 15.13% of victims are male
 
kfc1 said:
Women are only 37% of all homicide victims.
Click to expand...

Care to give me the gender of the perpetrator of homicide?

Let me save you some time:

Offending rate in 2006-07, by age and sex (per 100,000 per year)


offending_age.png

Offending rate from 1989-90 to 2006-07, by sex (per 100,000 per year)

offending_trends.png


http://www.aic.gov.au/statistics/homicide/offenders.html

Im sure if the above offending rate disparity (Men are around 700 percent more likely to kill) was shown to be the case for 'Muslims' instead of 'Men generally' you (and others) would be screaming for all sorts of measures to stop it (banning further entry into the country by Men, special laws that target and monitor Men etc etc etc).
 
Rustin Cohle said:
25296 female vs. 6992 male victims
Take out the male on male and female on female victims.
23525 female vs. 4195 male victims
27720 total
4195/(23525+4195)*100 = 15.13% of victims are male
Click to expand...
Why would you take them out? Are same sex abusers irrelvant?
 
kfc1 said:
Can you quote the text from that image which you think gives you 87% of victims are female, or 91-95% which was the first ludicrous number put forward?
Click to expand...

Kentucky, the 91-95% is the figure given by the Cops, obtained from Police and Court data, across all 11 years from 99/00 to 09/10. The 91-95% is the percentage of male perpetrators of violence on female victims over that period as shown by the data. It means that between 5 and 8% of perpetrators of violence on female victims were women (or not men:)).

kfc1 said:
Has anyone ever argued against 91-95% of perps who kill women being male? :nuts:
That statistic says nothing about the percentage of victims who are male.
Click to expand...

91-95% is not of male perps who kill women. It is the percentage of male perps who commit acts of violence.

Yes, that statistic says nothing about the percentage of victims who are male. You would get that from the 2009-10 figures which shows 6,992 male victims and 25,296 female victims or 21.66% being male. We also know from the 11 year data set that 60% of male victims have female perpetrators. If we apply that to the 6,992 male victims, 2,797 of the victims would by male perpetrators.

Back to your complaint against Turnbull. Sure, to say domestic violence is just violence against women is a simplification if you want to get lost in the statistics.

But pull your confused little noggin away from interpreting the boring statistics (it is not your strong suit). Surely it is correct to say if you want to minimise domestic violence, the main game is in tackling violence against women (by men). Get that one sorted out and I reckon most of the rest of the DV will just fall away.
 

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Malifice said:
Care to give me the gender of the perpetrator of homicide?

Let me save you some time:

Offending rate in 2006-07, by age and sex (per 100,000 per year)


offending_age.png

Offending rate from 1989-90 to 2006-07, by sex (per 100,000 per year)

offending_trends.png


http://www.aic.gov.au/statistics/homicide/offenders.html

Im sure if the above offending rate disparity (Men are around 700 percent more likely to kill) was shown to be the case for 'Muslims' instead of 'Men generally' you (and others) would be screaming for all sorts of measures to stop it (banning further entry into the country by Men, special laws that target and monitor Men etc etc etc).
Click to expand...
Haha no. Try again Maljazeera.
 
Rustin Cohle said:
Because they're irrelevant when discussing gender based violence.
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Correct there is hardly any partner violence between perp female on male or female. Nearly all DV on Males is cause by a male partner, a father or other relative ie the Males are kids.
 
kfc1 said:
No they are not.

Turdbull said DV is "just violence against women" - it is clearly not.
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Nice try. Please feel free to come back and discuss when you graduate from middle school.
 
Malifice said:
Ok cool. Ill remember that in the other threads on the topic.

Speaking of other threads on the topic, cant you debate this rubbish in the feminism thread?
Click to expand...
1. It started with a comment from Turdbull, which is appropriately posted in this thread.

2. What do male DV victims have to do with feminism?

3. There is no feminism thread anymore, it is now 'Meninist Myths'.

4. Im threadbanned from said thread so if you would like to undo that i will happily post there.

Also dont tell me you wouldnt be raging about racial/religious profiling but apparently completely ignoring victims based on their gender is all good.
 
Windhover said:
Kentucky, the 91-95% is the figure given by the Cops, obtained from Police and Court data, across all 11 years from 99/00 to 09/10. The 91-95% is the percentage of male perpetrators of violence on female victims over that period as shown by the data. It means that between 5 and 8% of perpetrators of violence on female victims were women (or not men:)).



91-95% is not of male perps who kill women. It is the percentage of male perps who commit acts of violence.

Yes, that statistic says nothing about the percentage of victims who are male. You would get that from the 2009-10 figures which shows 6,992 male victims and 25,296 female victims or 21.66% being male. We also know from the 11 year data set that 60% of male victims have female perpetrators. If we apply that to the 6,992 male victims, 2,797 of the victims would by male perpetrators.

Back to your complaint against Turnbull. Sure, to say domestic violence is just violence against women is a simplification if you want to get lost in the statistics.

But pull your confused little noggin away from interpreting the boring statistics (it is not your strong suit). Surely it is correct to say if you want to minimise domestic violence, the main game is in tackling violence against women (by men). Get that one sorted out and I reckon most of the rest of the DV will just fall away.
Click to expand...
I had all that, thanks. It seems Rusty Cole was the confused one as none of the above addresses what i was saying which is DV is not "just violence against women".
 
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