News Another Possible American Rookie

[jmac70]

At this rate we will become the land of the free.

 

[Gone Critical]

The problem with the Americans (and internationals/non footy playing locals also) is that while they may have the PHYSICAL attributes, they just never really grasp the rest of the game because they didn't grow up playing it. They will never get the nuance, the minutae of the game, which is what really separates the good from the great.

Unless you get lukcy and happen to find that one in a million that just "clicks" with our game like Stynes did. Hanley and that Carlton dude come to mind too. You can just see it when they've grasped our game.

Throw in Ty and White and Pyke and it is starting to look like less than a million to one.

 

[Hardas]

At this rate we will become the land of the free.

And home of the naive...but back to the topic:
my only reservation about trying everything is whether the development staff would be better off focusing on our main-list young blokes, where time spent is far more likely to lead to on-field improvements.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Hope not. Should give it to a highly rated local.player who actually has a chance of making it.

Can you please advise the procedure for putting these highly rated local players on the international rookies list. And while youre at it can you please explain why these highly rated local players arent already on an AFL list.

 

[Ketchup]

Can you please advise the procedure for putting these highly rated local players on the international rookies list. And while youre at it can you please explain why these highly rated local players arent already on an AFL list.

Should read more than one post.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Should read more than one post.

No, I think I pretty well have it right. If you are going to use the "international" list then you may as well source your players from countries with deep talent pools. If theres a local who has never played the game and therefore qualifies to be on this list....sure...give him a crack (your "highly rated" line baffles me still) ...but its basic maths that the odds of finding a gem offshore are higher than onshore. Most of the talented kids in this lowly populated country are already in the system.

The local kid who has never played the game has no greater claim on an AFL spot than an American or and Irishman. Some may say he has less right because he has had the opportunity to enter the game via the front door but for some reason has decided not to do that.

 

[Ketchup]

No, I think I pretty well have it right. If you are going to use the "international" list then you may as well source your players from countries with deep talent pools. If theres a local who has never played the game and therefore qualifies to be on this list....sure...give him a crack (your "highly rated" line baffles me still) ...but its basic maths that the odds of finding a gem offshore are higher than onshore. Most of the talented kids in this lowly populated country are already in the system.

The local kid who has never played the game has no greater claim on an AFL spot than an American or and Irishman. Some may say he has less right because he has had the opportunity to enter the game via the front door but for some reason has decided not to do that.

Guess you read the part where I expressed an opinion about getting rid of the "international" list and increasing the amount of rookie spots by 2-3 to account for the deletion of that rookie list then

As also pointed out with the example of Sam Dwyer (who was a highly rated local footballer) and many other league footballers around the country that actually understand the game and have played it for years but can't get onto a list because shae mac is on one. Who have less than 1% chance of making it to play an AFL game yet alone playing 50.

 

[loki04]

Guess you read the part where I expressed an opinion about getting rid of the "international" list and increasing the amount of rookie spots by 2-3 to account for the deletion of that rookie list then

As also pointed out with the example of Sam Dwyer (who was a highly rated local footballer) and many other league footballers around the country that actually understand the game and have played it for years but can't get onto a list because shae mac is on one. Who have less than 1% chance of making it to play an AFL game yet alone playing 50.

Mate Shae or any other international recruit doesn't have any effect on the Dwyers of the world as they are on a separate list.
VFL players can't be recruited outside normal draft systems.

 

[jackcass]

Mate Shae or any other international recruit doesn't have any effect on the Dwyers of the world as they are on a separate list.
VFL players can't be recruited outside normal draft systems.

And that's why he saying get rid of the Cat B rookie list and expand the standard rookie list. It's a valid idea. We still need to use the existing rules/arrangements to our best abilities though and that means we engage and list Cat B rookies. If it ever changes then we change our focus.

I think people under value the O/S promotional opportunities that come from these international Cat Bs. If the AFL want to grow the game then this is just 1 way to do it, and it's why they permit these guys to be added outside normal footy department expenditure.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Its still 22 a side no matter how many Aussies (or non Aussies) you have on lists. An "international" list outside the normal draft and rookie draft does not affect that because its extra. If they are any good then they move on to the main list, and rightly so the club that took a punt on them gets them for free in teh draft. Aussies have about 750 chances to get drafted...750 being the approx total number of players in the system. If you expand the list you dont create more opportunity, you just spread it out thinner. Its still 22 a side, 9 games a week, for 22 weeks.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Mate Shae or any other international recruit doesn't have any effect on the Dwyers of the world as they are on a separate list.
VFL players can't be recruited outside normal draft systems.

Not that youd ever had to make a decision like this because they are seperat e lists....but

I'd take a punt on a Shae over a Dwyer every day of the week. An international recruit has massive upside. Dwyer is vanilla and there are plenty of his type available.

 

[loki04]

Not that youd ever had to make a decision like this because they are seperat e lists....but

I'd take a punt on a Shae over a Dwyer every day of the week. An international recruit has massive upside. Dwyer is vanilla and there are plenty of his type available.

Agree but I also think they are being very short sighted with only showing interest to the 200cm types.

Generally speaking the 6 foot to 6'5 types are much more co ordinated and overall better athletes.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Agree but I also think they are being very short sighted with only showing interest to the 200cm types.

Generally speaking the 6 foot to 6'5 types are much more co ordinated and overall better athletes.

Possibly so although there is an argument that with ruckmen they have an easier learning curve. Ball skills and reading the play (things that take years to develop) are less important with the monsters

 

[Old Spice]

Possibly so although there is an argument that with ruckmen they have an easier learning curve. Ball skills and reading the play (things that take years to develop) are less important with the monsters

A 200+cm ruck option probably has some experience in American sport in jumping in the air to win a ball. Rucks in our code are not exactly the silkiest types so the ruck rookie strategy probably makes most sense as there is less of a deficit to overcome against their Australian competitors.

 

[loki04]

A 200+cm ruck option probably has some experience in American sport in jumping in the air to win a ball. Rucks in our code are not exactly the silkiest types so the ruck rookie strategy probably makes most sense as there is less of a deficit to overcome against their Australian competitors.

I reckon that is their theory however I disagree with it.

 

[mike123]

Agree but I also think they are being very short sighted with only showing interest to the 200cm types.

Generally speaking the 6 foot to 6'5 types are much more co ordinated and overall better athletes.

Because you can get away with having a ruckman that's not good at much else besides rucking. Weather key forwards and defenders are harder positions.

Although we could look for a shut down key defender that has the perfect balance of closing speed and strength.

 

[loki04]

Because you can get away with having a ruckman that's not good at much else besides rucking. Weather key forwards and defenders are harder positions.

Although we could look for a shut down key defender that has the perfect balance of closing speed and strength.

Imo they are more likely to hit gold in the meduim hieghts.
There is also more to r uck work then contesting center bounces too

 

[mike123]

Imo they are more likely to hit gold in the meduim hieghts.
There is also more to r uck work then contesting center bounces too

Well than can you give us your theory?

 

[loki04]

Well than can you give us your theory?

I think you guys are close to the money for recruiters current thoughts I just disagree on it. Will go into when I get home.

Also they are not looking at them as pure rucks being developed as kpf as much as ruck so they have as much to learn as a kp prospect.

 

[ottoman]

Quick question re elevation af Cat B players. If Cox improved incredibly and by mid way through the year was best 22 standard what is the procedure for elevation.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Because you can get away with having a ruckman that's not good at much else besides rucking. Weather key forwards and defenders are harder positions.

Although we could look for a shut down key defender that has the perfect balance of closing speed and strength.

.....and go go gadget arms.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Quick question re elevation af Cat B players. If Cox improved incredibly and by mid way through the year was best 22 standard what is the procedure for elevation.

hed have to wait until 2016. If he improved that quickly hed be placed on our senior list with our last pick. Same as a father-son but without the bidding. Or hed go on our rookie list with our last pick.

 

[jmac70]

Because you can get away with having a ruckman that's not good at much else besides rucking. Weather key forwards and defenders are harder positions.

Although we could look for a shut down key defender that has the perfect balance of closing speed and strength.

You always take the weather with you.

 

[35Daicos]

Quick question re elevation af Cat B players. If Cox improved incredibly and by mid way through the year was best 22 standard what is the procedure for elevation.

I don't think there is anything stopping us from elevating Cox during this season, as long as there is a vacancy on the list due to LTI or whatever. Geelong's Blicavs has been a Category B rookie for years but always got elevated and played senior football regularly. Craig Moller (Fremantle) debuted in 2013 after also being elevated during that season. Neither of those two are international rookies, but it shouldn't matter that Cox is one.

@Timmy from Thomastown

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I don't think there is anything stopping us from elevating Cox during this season, as long as there is a vacancy on the list due to LTI or whatever. Geelong's Blicavs has been a Category B rookie for years but always got elevated and played senior football regularly. Craig Moller (Fremantle) debuted in 2013 after also being elevated during that season. Neither of those two are international rookies, but it shouldn't matter that Cox is one.

@Timmy from Thomastown

hmm ok. I may be wrong. Fair enough. Perhaps I was thinking of the now defunct NSW development list and assumed it was a bit like that....where your players are basically on a VFL list but you have first right to promote them without having to go through the draft.