Strategy Backline - (Rebounding vs Shut Down Ability)

[Bard]

I agree with that in theory. In an ideal world, we'd play Brown against teams like Geelong, whose most dangerous tall forward is a gorilla and Frost against the athletic guys like Cameron and Franklin. But the problem is that players need to feel confident and settled and dropping them for match ups doesn't achieve that. It just undermines their confidence. I'd prefer Frost, as I think he is more versatile and is better on the gorillas than Brown is on the athletes.

Yes, but for that to work Keeffe would have to be able to develop to take the 'Gorillas' because if Frost did he'd be too fat to chase the quicks. Unless he can somehow adjust his game for it but it seems like a far longer bow to draw than Keeffe stepping up IMO.

 

[sr36]

Yes, but for that to work Keeffe would have to be able to develop to take the 'Gorillas' because if Frost did he'd be too fat to chase the quicks. Unless he can somehow adjust his game for it but it seems like a far longer bow to draw than Keeffe stepping up IMO.

Frost's physique and competitiveness reminds me of Scarlett (obviously vastly inferior in other ways). Therefore I reckon he will be able to take the gorillas.

 

[cleomenes]

We have yet to see what Sinclair can achieve. He could well develop to the point that he can fill the role that Ben Johnson managed so well in the latter part of his career. Johnson's value to the team is poorly recognised, and the lack of a good replacement so far is one of our greatest defensive problems. A fit Sinclair may be that player.
Langdon may be the Lumumba replacement, but I don't see the confidence and aggressive running that he will need to do the job so well yet. It is very early days for Langdon, and he has plenty of time to improve.
Williams could step into Shaw's shoes. Again it is very early days, but he could well be the man for the job.
Toovey can replace himself. (I mean that no change is needed)
Brown is a top full back.
Frost, again is very new, and could show a whole lot more than he has so far. The kicking weakness may be less apparent with morre experience.
Keeffe is gaining experience in body positioning, and strength to his very long frame. His kicking is already great.

The existing players are a solid backline, with a lot of improvement possible. Someone has to step into Maxwell's shoes, and his placement in the leadership coterie suggests that the club thinks that he is the one.

I have made no mention of the injured draftees, the gameless rookies, or the new season's draft prospects. Yet still, it looks pretty solid, and has a lot of scope for improvement. I expect that actual form next April, as well as any dreaded injuries will see some of these players lose out to others, but I would not be unhappy to see this group as the core of next year's defence.

 

[mike123]

I don't think we'll have direct replacements for our premiership backline. I think our backline will have a much different structure. But if we did have replacements then I think it will go something like this maybe:

Frost or Moore will be the Brown replacement depending on development.

Keeffe the Reid replacement.

Scharenberg the Maxwell replacement

Seedsman the Lumumba replacement

Williams the Johnson replacement

Langdon the Toovey replacement

??? the Shaw replacement (A small defender that can run and carry but also hit up targets)

I think the Shaw replacement is what we are missing. Maybe we go with one of Sinclair or Oxley replaces him and we go with a different set up or we recruit Dillon Viojo-Rainbow or a another guy from the draft and he replaces him.

 

[PieMan!]

My Ideal back line that would have both footskills rebound ability and defensive ability would be:

B: Tom Langdon ~ Nathan Brown ~ Marley Williams
HB: Adam Oxley ~ Lachlan Keeffe ~ Paul Seedsman/Clinton Young

I/C: Alan Toovey/Jack Frost/Tyson Goldsack

You lost me already, Toovey and Goldstack, could not and would not be pushed out of the starting six by Oxley and Seedsman/Young

 

[mike123]

You lost me already, Toovey and Goldstack, could not and would not be pushed out of the starting six by Oxley and Seedsman/Young

Depends on form, but they could.

 

[THATSGOLD]

We have yet to see what Sinclair can achieve. He could well develop to the point that he can fill the role that Ben Johnson managed so well in the latter part of his career. Johnson's value to the team is poorly recognised, and the lack of a good replacement so far is one of our greatest defensive problems. A fit Sinclair may be that player.
Langdon may be the Lumumba replacement, but I don't see the confidence and aggressive running that he will need to do the job so well yet. It is very early days for Langdon, and he has plenty of time to improve.
Williams could step into Shaw's shoes. Again it is very early days, but he could well be the man for the job.
Toovey can replace himself. (I mean that no change is needed)
Brown is a top full back.
Frost, again is very new, and could show a whole lot more than he has so far. The kicking weakness may be less apparent with morre experience.
Keeffe is gaining experience in body positioning, and strength to his very long frame. His kicking is already great.

The existing players are a solid backline, with a lot of improvement possible. Someone has to step into Maxwell's shoes, and his placement in the leadership coterie suggests that the club thinks that he is the one.

I have made no mention of the injured draftees, the gameless rookies, or the new season's draft prospects. Yet still, it looks pretty solid, and has a lot of scope for improvement. I expect that actual form next April, as well as any dreaded injuries will see some of these players lose out to others, but I would not be unhappy to see this group as the core of next year's defence.

Sinclair simply doesn't have the skills to play senior footy. He can't take a contest Mark to save his life and he is a terrible kick. He will be delisted within 2 years.

 

[jmac70]

Sinclair simply doesn't have the skills to play senior footy. He can't take a contest Mark to save his life and he is a terrible kick. He will be delisted within 2 years.

It will be hard to delist a premiership player at his peak.

 

[cleomenes]

Sinclair simply doesn't have the skills to play senior footy. He can't take a contest Mark to save his life and he is a terrible kick. He will be delisted within 2 years.

i dispute all of these assertions

 

[THATSGOLD]

i dispute all of these assertions

Show me vision of Sinclair out marking an opponent.

 

[THATSGOLD]

It will be hard to delist a premiership player at his peak.

Sinclair Keeffe Fasolo will NEVER be senior premiership players for Collingwood.

 

[mike123]

Sinclair Keeffe Fasolo will NEVER be senior premiership players for Collingwood.

Fasolo should already be one

 

[jmac70]

Sinclair Keeffe Fasolo will NEVER be senior premiership players for Collingwood.

You're such a kill joy.

 

[jmac70]

Show me vision of Sinclair out marking an opponent.

 

[THATSGOLD]

Wish he meant it.

 

[THATSGOLD]

Fasolo should already be one

Not after his final quarter sub "effort."

 

[didaksrightfoot]

My ideal backline:

Toovey - Brown - Williams
Frost - Reid - Langdon
With Seedsman/Young/Scharenburg (at least until he gets games under his belt) on the wings and rotating back as needed.

I really think we need Reid in the backline... and by having Frost/Brown alongside him gives Reid freedom to play a bit more off his man and cover the space that he does so well. I also think that Reid/Frost are versatile enough that we don't lose too much in our ability to rebound with that bigger lineup. Plus, going a bit bigger at the back at the start of the game - gives Bucks the flexibility to either rotate guys around or swing Reid forward as a plan B... rather than not have any backup options if one of your key backs is being outplayed by his man (which happened a number of times last year)

 

[THATSGOLD]

I don't think we'll have direct replacements for our premiership backline. I think our backline will have a much different structure. But if we did have replacements then I think it will go something like this maybe:

Frost or Moore will be the Brown replacement depending on development.

Keeffe the Reid replacement.

Scharenberg the Maxwell replacement

Seedsman the Lumumba replacement

Williams the Johnson replacement

Langdon the Toovey replacement

??? the Shaw replacement (A small defender that can run and carry but also hit up targets)

I think the Shaw replacement is what we are missing. Maybe we go with one of Sinclair or Oxley replaces him and we go with a different set up or we recruit Dillon Viojo-Rainbow or a another guy from the draft and he replaces him.

Keeffe for Reid. 80% drop off.

Scharenberg for Maxwell. Immediate drop off. Not sure when he will even be ready.

Seedsman for Harry. 20 % drop off.

Williams for BJ. 40% drop off.

Langdon for Toovey. Don't mind. Break even but immediate slight drop off.

Backline will be in mess going off that in 2015.

 

[THATSGOLD]

My ideal backline:

Toovey - Brown - Williams
Frost - Reid - Langdon
With Seedsman/Young/Scharenburg (at least until he gets games under his belt) on the wings and rotating back as needed.

I really think we need Reid in the backline... and by having Frost/Brown alongside him gives Reid freedom to play a bit more off his man and cover the space that he does so well. I also think that Reid/Frost are versatile enough that we don't lose too much in our ability to rebound with that bigger lineup. Plus, going a bit bigger at the back at the start of the game - gives Bucks the flexibility to either rotate guys around or swing Reid forward as a plan B... rather than not have any backup options if one of your key backs is being outplayed by his man (which happened a number of times last year)

Looking at that if we could've added Frawley I would be happy. Ried and Frawley down back would be that combo I wouldve been looking for in 2015. Hawks go for the threepeat for mine with Gibson Frawley Lake.

 

[mike123]

Keeffe for Reid. 80% drop off.

Scharenberg for Maxwell. Immediate drop off. Not sure when he will even be ready.

Seedsman for Harry. 20 % drop off.

Williams for BJ. 40% drop off.

Langdon for Toovey. Don't mind. Break even but immediate slight drop off.

Backline will be in mess going off that in 2015.

Not 2015 but 2016, buy then it will be as a whole it would be a 20% bump up.

 

[mike123]

Not after his final quarter sub "effort."

He was played in the forwardline, you know, the place where the ball wasn't at most of the time.

 

[THATSGOLD]

He was played in the forwardline, you know, the place where the ball wasn't at most of the time.

No one just stands around in the foward line anymore. You should get to more games.

 

[mike123]

No one just stands around in the foward line anymore. You should get to more games.

No but we still have structure, in that structure Fasolo was forward of the ball.

 

[PTpie]

This was a considered thread with intelligent discussion for a while. The TG came along and started up the "I don't rate any current Collingwood players" and "they will never win a premiership until they do what I say" stuff.

Wait haven't I read this before? Yep almost every comment by TG in most threads.

Maybe try posting something different once in a while TG, something positive or interesting, just to keep me on my toes. I'd hate to miss something factual or meaningful in one of your posts.

 

[THATSGOLD]

This was a considered thread with intelligent discussion for a while. The TG came along and started up the "I don't rate any current Collingwood players" and "they will never win a premiership until they do what I say" stuff.

Wait haven't I read this before? Yep almost every comment by TG in most threads.

Maybe try posting something different once in a while TG, something positive or interesting, just to keep me on my toes. I'd hate to miss something factual or meaningful in one of your posts.

Wait a minute. The current backline is currently poor. So do you want a thread about how good it is or the truth?