Opinion Best 22 - 2015

[Cringle]

I did like what I saw from Jaksch up forward. Looked a bit undersized against spud Griffiths. Either Rowe plays 2nd tall and Jaksch plays 3rd or Jaksch plays 3rd forward. He surely isn't ready to wrestle with the big forwards of the comp. (Not that Griffiths is any good... just decent delivery and size)

 

[Bluejob]

If fully fit:

Back: White Jamison Docherty
Half B:Yarran Hendo* Simpson
Centre: Everitt Curnow Daisy
Half F:Walker Jones Murphy
Fwd: Rowe* Casboult Menzel
Foll: Kreuz, Judd, Gibbs
Int: KJ, Bell, Cripps, sub: Buckley

*Hendo is a better backman. Rowe is a good shot at goal. Equally need to improve at finding the footy as a forward. IMO a swap is a better option.

I suppose for me at this point, Kreuz is injured so default to Wood. Daisy replaced by whoever happens to be putting their hand up from the two's.

 

[ctacp]

If fully fit:

Back: White Jamison Docherty
Half B:Yarran Hendo* Simpson
Centre: Everitt Curnow Daisy
Half F:Walker Jones Murphy
Fwd: Rowe* Casboult Menzel
Foll: Kreuz, Judd, Gibbs
Int: KJ, Bell, Cripps, sub: Buckley

*Hendo is a better backman. Rowe is a good shot at goal. Equally need to improve at finding the footy as a forward. IMO a swap is a better option.

I suppose for me at this point, Kreuz is injured so default to Wood. Daisy replaced by whoever happens to be putting their hand up from the two's.

"if fully fit" - after 6 months pre season we still need to asterix "if fully fit". this pre season, everyone was flying, everyone was fit & going great by all reports. qtr & a half in & they were cooked.

 

[Chasing 17]

FB: Sheehan - Jamo - Buckley
HB: Simmo - Hendo - Yarran
C: Doc - Cripps - Gibbs
HF: Bell - Everitt - Tuohy
FF Jones - Cas - Menzel
FOLL: Judd - Murphy - Kreuz
INT: Jaksch - Walker - Whiley - Sub: Byrne

Silvagni to make all recruitment decisions, forever.

 

[Bluejob]

Fully fit, all available to be selected, barring injury. However you wish to phrase it and feel more comfortable.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

It occurs to me that good teams have a plethora of midfielders and they are versatile enough to go forward or play off half back so they can be fit into the same side. We don't have enough midfielders so we start looking for flankers to try to convert to midfield and the midfielders we do have aren't really adept at playing forward or back.

I mean really, Judd, Murphy, Carrazzo, Cripps, Bell, Curnow are not terribly dangerous forward options or defenders. Walker, Yarran, Menzel, Tuohy, Sheehan, Johnson, Docherty, Buckley can't really play midfield (not yet in some cases ... wait and see). The only truly versatile mids are Gibbs, Simpson and Thomas ... maybe Everitt.

It probably makes it harder to find replacements for injuries, or mix things up mid match, without losing structure.

 

[BM123]

It occurs to me that good teams have a plethora of midfielders and they are versatile enough to go forward or play off half back so they can be fit into the same side. We don't have enough midfielders so we start looking for flankers to try to convert to midfield and the midfielders we do have aren't really adept at playing forward or back.

I mean really, Judd, Murphy, Carrazzo, Cripps, Bell, Curnow are not terribly dangerous forward options or defenders. Walker, Yarran, Menzel, Tuohy, Sheehan, Johnson, Docherty, Buckley can't really play midfield (not yet in some cases ... wait and see). The only truly versatile mids are Gibbs, Simpson and Thomas ... maybe Everitt.

It probably makes it harder to find replacements for injuries, or mix things up mid match, without losing structure.

Geelong and Hawthorn won a fair share of premierships with midfielders who could play forward or down back if need be.

Bartel, Hodge, Lewis, Mitchell, Burgoyne, Johnson, Chapman, Kelly to name a few.

We have Gibbs and Thomas.

And we can't afford to take Gibbs out of the midfield without been completely screwed.

 

[gbatman]

Say for example Carlton were able to just go out and take the players it needed to win a premiership. I've been thinking about this and how many players would miss out and how our current players roles would change. It really got me thinking, who's getting a game that would get a game in a premiership side.

Where Carlton need to be at to challenge for the Premiership.

B: Simpson Jamison Jaksch
HB: Yarran Henderson Gibbs
C: Thomas Judd Wingman
HF: Walker CHF Murphy
F: Menzel FF FR
OB: Kreuzer, Rover, Ruck Rover
IC: Docherty Everitt (Curnow or Carrazzo)
SUB: ???

1. Jaksch, Menzel, Everitt and the tagger are the fringe players. There is only one tagger. Jaksch lucky to be there but I believe he'll make it and could play the third tall role well.
2. Gibbs plays as a half back who rotates through the midfield Like Luke Hodge.
3. Simpson is a defender who can have stints up the ground on the wing.
4. Murphy plays 50/50 forward midfield similar to Bartel.
5. We need two high quality centermen, Murphy and Gibbs are good but they won't lift you to a flag, they don't play relentless powerful footy and they don't win enough of the ball, in an ideal situation they play a peripheral role and pinch hit through the center, avoiding a hard tag when they do.
6. Henderson is filling the hole in the forward line but he's not a forward, just hasn't got the hands and strength. He's a pretty high quality defender though. No one on our list is a genuine tall forward, Jones and Casboult have some of the qualities but their quality isn't very high.
7. Casboult isn't a bad player but his kicking is terrible, as an elite premiership forward ruck he's not there. Not saying you couldn't win a flag with him in, he's one of those battler types who can get a premiership through playing a role well enough.
8. We might have a few young players coming through who may be good enough like Cripps but it's hard to tell at this stage.

You'd love to go out and take Tom Rockliff, Gary Ablett, Lance Franklin, Jarryd Roughead, Stephen Hill and David Hale. They are the best of the best at what we need, but it's not going to happen due to a little thing called the salary cap but these are the type of players and the amount of players we need to win the premiership. Honestly I don't think we have enough time to get that many players of top level elite quality into the team before guys like Judd, Simpson, Jamison, Walker and possibly Kreuzer retire it's not just the players we need but the ones we need to replace that makes it hard. Winning the premiership is tough, this is why you need to absolutely smash it in the draft over a short period of time to get there. The only way I can see us being able to do it is if we draft really well and offer up for trade anyone over 23 who is not on this list and possibly make the most of the low position on the ladder we'll be in.

You can sort of see where our struggles are coming from. In elite terms anyone playing in the side that I haven't mentioned are role fillers or stop gap players. Anyone playing in other positions are filling a hole for needs base. Henderson is filling a hole at CHF, we're missing him at CHB and we're getting the least out of him because.

Simpson and Gibbs currently play midfield, they play defence brilliantly, they get a heap of the ball doing so and are extremely damaging and shut down opposition well. As good as Gibbs was for us, he does not compare to the top 30 good ball winning midfielders in the AFL. This just goes to show just how weak we are in the middle, same said for Murphy. Gibbs, Yarran, Simpson, Docherty, there's a backline that would destroy teams coming out and very capable of relieving opposing mids. IMO this is a perfect backline. At least we potentially have one area of the ground sown up.

Walker, we miss him, he's been filling a hole in defence and doing it really well but ideally you'd love him playing half forward and wing in the same role Bell played the other night. As for tall forwards, we haven't got a genuine one on our list, Casboult is the closest thing to one but he can't kick and is not consistent.

Kreuzer is a top quality ruckman but he's always injured, we've had some genuine hole fillers playing for us the last two seasons.

You can see from our recruiting that we are trying to find these players but the quality just isn't there. I think at a minimum if we found two onballers who regularly gathered 25-30+ possessions and weren't slow or unskilled and a really good big forward we'd push pretty hard for the top 8.

I think everyone bagging the coach and many of the players need to take a deep breath and remember we haven't got much to work with and because of that players are playing a game/role/position they they shouldn't be. You can't get pissed off at Murphy and Gibbs because they aren't dominant superstars, they just aren't, not when they should be playing 50% midfield and 50% forward or back instead playing all on the ball. Only Judd is a genuine bonafide onball star and he's getting on. You can't get pissed off at Henderson who is a CHB for not getting a kick in the forward line. How can you blame the coach with so many holes in the side being filled by players who aren't up to it?

I think we just need to be patient, not expect us to be world beaters and work at getting the players we need.

 

[gandaal]

Post round 1 best 22

B Carrazzo, Rowe, Jamison
HB Docherty, Henderson, Thomas
C Yarran, Gibbs, Simpson
HF Menzel, Casboult, Bell
F Jones, Walker, Murphy
R Kreuzer, Whiley, Judd
Int Everitt, Curnow, Cripps
Sub: Random player B

Here's what I'd be aiming towards as a goal for best 22.

Carrazzo to the back line to play a defensive shutdown role on opposition small forwards. He used to be great at that job. Henderson back because forward he's a hack.
Midfield is obvious but has one omission that I'll explain later. I rate Whiley highly so he goes straight in. It's still very slow but we've got what we've got.
Casboult returns to the forward line out of desperation. Bell is in as a defensive small forward. Walker is our main forward. Murphy goes forward has an attacking creative small forward. He's just too small and weak to play modern midfield.

 

[BluesRule]

Post round 1 best 22

B Carrazzo, Rowe, Jamison
HB Docherty, Henderson, Thomas
C Yarran, Gibbs, Simpson
HF Menzel, Casboult, Bell
F Jones, Walker, Murphy
R Kreuzer, Whiley, Judd
Int Everitt, Curnow, Cripps
Sub: Random player B

Here's what I'd be aiming towards as a goal for best 22.

Carrazzo to the back line to play a defensive shutdown role on opposition small forwards. He used to be great at that job. Henderson back because forward he's a hack.
Midfield is obvious but has one omission that I'll explain later. I rate Whiley highly so he goes straight in. It's still very slow but we've got what we've got.
Casboult returns to the forward line out of desperation. Bell is in as a defensive small forward. Walker is our main forward. Murphy goes forward has an attacking creative small forward. He's just too small and weak to play modern midfield.

Bell would be the biggest small forward ever!
Agree Hendo should go back, but he is no hack.
We lack quality in midfield so isolating Murphy forward may hurt us. That said Paul Chapman and Steve Johnson have showed how good small forwards can impact midfield.
We keep throwing kids in the deep end and wondering why they cannot swim.

 

[T2B_]

Let's be honest, for a long time even the Hawks midfield wasn't exactly known for being fast. They did however smartly recruit some zippy outside players (wingers, flankers, whatever) to receive from those midfielders and instantly give them a boost of speed over the ground.

I'd rather a "slow" but extremely strong and solid midfield consisting of the likes of Cripps, Whiley and of course Judd, Gibbs etc at the centre and stoppages rather than a bunch of athletes we're trying to turn into midfielders. The key is making sure the pace is available elsewhere as support IMO.

 

[gandaal]

If you don't use your height to advantage then are you still a tall?

Everitt is very tall. Doesn't make him a KPP.

 

[Toddy86]

If your desposal is on then you can make any team look fast. It really comes down to how you use the ball!! Ever team that gets beaten will have 80% of goals kicked on them from turn overs! The Hawks had slow players but exceptional ball users. Fast accurate ball movement is the key!

 

[setantypants]

I don't think Carrots is in our best 22.

I think Dylan Buckley is.

Bell gets a spot before Carrots and Curnow IMO.

 

[Navara79]

If your desposal is on then you can make any team look fast. It really comes down to how you use the ball!! Ever team that gets beaten will have 80% of goals kicked on them from turn overs! The Hawks had slow players but exceptional ball users. Fast accurate ball movement is the key!

THIS!!

 

[T2B_]

If your desposal is on then you can make any team look fast. It really comes down to how you use the ball!! Ever team that gets beaten will have 80% of goals kicked on them from turn overs! The Hawks had slow players but exceptional ball users. Fast accurate ball movement is the key!

Bingo.

Hawks and Swans etc have made this a fine art for some time.

 

[BM123]

Let's be honest, for a long time even the Hawks midfield wasn't exactly known for being fast. They did however smartly recruit some zippy outside players (wingers, flankers, whatever) to receive from those midfielders and instantly give them a boost of speed over the ground.

I'd rather a "slow" but extremely strong and solid midfield consisting of the likes of Cripps, Whiley and of course Judd, Gibbs etc at the centre and stoppages rather than a bunch of athletes we're trying to turn into midfielders. The key is making sure the pace is available elsewhere as support IMO.

We need two line breaking mids on the wings with good endurance.

Hill brothers, Hartung, Smith, Gaff etc are just aerobic machines who can maintain their skills all day due to their immense fitness.

I was hoping that Boekhurst would have the engine early.

 

[Blue Dimension]

What I'd like to see...

Touhy Jamison Jaksch
Buckley Rowe Docherty
Yarran Gibbs Boekhorst
Thomas Henderson Walker
Casboult Jones Menzel
Kreuzer Murphy Cripps
Int: Judd Everitt One of Curnow/Bell/Carrazzo Sub: Smith

I'd also like to see Touhy used up at half forward as a weapon but that will be dependent on Byrne and Sheehan.

Yes I know Boekhorst hasn't set the world on fire, but ideally if he starts to perform we need him providing some run on the wings in the ilk of a Smith/Hill at Hawthorn.

Means you have mid rotations of Murphy, Gibbs, Judd, Cripps, Menz, Daisy and one of Curnow/Bell/Carrazzo and the run to complement with and dash of Buckley, Boekhorst, Walker and Yarran.

Walker and Yarran having stints moving in the midfield wouldn't be the worst idea either!

You also have Tutt and Whiley who are legitimate options as well.

 

[gbatman]

Thinking about our best 22, if we keep losing, fading out and struggling to play 4 quarters, perhaps we should address our midfield depth issues and just throw some kids in the deep end and see if they can swim. Gibbs, Judd and Murphy are carrying us in veign. They should be playing 50% outside the center square. It's why we get out run, over ran, can't play up the middle and can't create space.

B: Simpson Jamison Jaksch
HB: Gibbs Henderson Yarran
C: Thomas Whiley Docherty
HF: Walker Casboult Murphy
F: Kreuzer Jones Menzel
OB: Warnock Judd Cripps
IC: Graham Curnow Everitt
SUB: Byrne

Watching the footy this week and from being at the game Thursday night it's really clear what's wrong with us. Same thing that's been wrong with us for the last 20 years. Not enough quality ball winning midfielders in the side. Judd, Murphy Gibbs and the taggers V 5 - 7 mids rotating fresh through the center all day, it's unsustainable. Not only are we struggling to play 4 quarters and run but we aren't getting the best out of these three because they are up against fresh players all the time and they aren't getting free by playing other roles. You see Hodge and Bartel, both gun mids playing forward and back half the time and killing it. Gibbs should be our Hodge, Murphy should be our Bartel. Not permanent centermen who have to carry this side and cop all the attention.

Play this side, it might get flogged, if it does it just means Cripps, Graham, Whiley aren't good enough and we're damned if we do and damned if we don't. It might actually start winning games. At least we wont have the problem of us running out of gas in the middle and getting stuck bombing it long up the boundary and relying on three blokes to carry the team.

One thing that team does have is a very good, quick and classy backline capable of really hurting the opposition which it doesn't have at the moment. It's a midfield that has a lot of numbers and will be full of fresh players for 4 quarters. It has more ball winning players.

The forward line looks really good. Murphy forward when he's not exhausted will be interesting. Kreuzer as a forward ruck. Casboult as a permanent key forward and Walker on the other half forward flank. It actually looks dangerous.

This might not be the usual layout or the best 22 players at the club, but if we want to structure our side to match the good modern sides then this is our best 22.

 

[Toddy86]

Bingo.

Hawks and Swans etc have made this a fine art for some time.

Is it the be all and end all of a football game. I remember Clarkson saying that they would recruit plays based on their disposal not their profile or numbers. It only takes 1 or 2 bad uses of the ball to let down a team, with Murphy, Curnow and Bell in the middle turnows are a common feature of our forward ball movement.

 

[Cringle]

Thinking about our best 22, if we keep losing, fading out and struggling to play 4 quarters, perhaps we should address our midfield depth issues and just throw some kids in the deep end and see if they can swim. Gibbs, Judd and Murphy are carrying us in veign. They should be playing 50% outside the center square. It's why we get out run, over ran, can't play up the middle and can't create space.

B: Simpson Jamison Jaksch
HB: Gibbs Henderson Yarran
C: Thomas Whiley Docherty
HF: Walker Casboult Murphy
F: Kreuzer Jones Menzel
OB: Warnock Judd Cripps
IC: Graham Curnow Everitt
SUB: Byrne

Watching the footy this week and from being at the game Thursday night it's really clear what's wrong with us. Same thing that's been wrong with us for the last 20 years. Not enough quality ball winning midfielders in the side. Judd, Murphy Gibbs and the taggers V 5 - 7 mids rotating fresh through the center all day, it's unsustainable. Not only are we struggling to play 4 quarters and run but we aren't getting the best out of these three because they are up against fresh players all the time and they aren't getting free by playing other roles. You see Hodge and Bartel, both gun mids playing forward and back half the time and killing it. Gibbs should be our Hodge, Murphy should be our Bartel. Not permanent centermen who have to carry this side and cop all the attention.

Play this side, it might get flogged, if it does it just means Cripps, Graham, Whiley aren't good enough and we're damned if we do and damned if we don't. It might actually start winning games. At least we wont have the problem of us running out of gas in the middle and getting stuck bombing it long up the boundary and relying on three blokes to carry the team.

One thing that team does have is a very good, quick and classy backline capable of really hurting the opposition which it doesn't have at the moment. It's a midfield that has a lot of numbers and will be full of fresh players for 4 quarters. It has more ball winning players.

The forward line looks really good. Murphy forward when he's not exhausted will be interesting. Kreuzer as a forward ruck. Casboult as a permanent key forward and Walker on the other half forward flank. It actually looks dangerous.

This might not be the usual layout or the best 22 players at the club, but if we want to structure our side to match the good modern sides then this is our best 22.

Can't see a problem if the young-uns can build some match fitness throughout the year.

As much as we all can't admit it and justify it with the term 'role players'... White, Curnow, Bell, Everitt and Carrazzo cannot be in the team simultaneously if we're ever to challenge for the top 8.

Everitt is in the list because he literally defines sheep. Plays up when we're up but goes invisible when we're struggling. The others lack football IQ and unfortunately is the best we've got. Carrazzo to a lesser extent than the rest.

 

[I AM CARLTON]

Ok here is my team for this week

FB: Buckley Jamieson White
HB: Simpson Henderson Docherty
C: Yarran Gibbs Menzel
HF: Bell Rowe Everitt
FF: Tutt Jones Murphy
R: Casboult Cripps Judd

I/C Whiley Bryne Carazzo Sub Boekhorst

Not considered due to injury Walker Kruezer Jaksch Thomas
Forward line very week but wanted Hendo back at CHB

 

[Cringle]

KPF: Watson and Jones
KPD: Henderson and Jamison

Rowe plays either depending on the game whilst relieving in the ruck.

 

[Hussey14]

Ok here is my team for this week

FB: Buckley Jamieson White
HB: Simpson Henderson Docherty
C: Yarran Gibbs Menzel
HF: Bell Rowe Everitt
FF: Tutt Jones Murphy
R: Casboult Cripps Judd

I/C Whiley Bryne Carazzo Sub Boekhorst

Not considered due to injury Walker Kruezer Jaksch Thomas
Forward line very week but wanted Hendo back at CHB

Like it a lot! Rowe looks to have the confidence back to play forward and leads well. Not too sure if Casboult can ruck for most of the game, would rather him sitting at CHF as his field kicking is pretty good. Whiley & Tutt in I like too.

 

[Premiership Quarter]

I don't think Carrots is in our best 22.

I think Dylan Buckley is.

Bell gets a spot before Carrots and Curnow IMO.

Agree. Carrazzo, Curnow are not in best 22. Could make an argument for Bell and Everitt as well not being in best 22. Happy to give Bell
more time as he has something. Looking forward to Walker and Sheehan getting fit.