List Mgmt. Blair Hartley Project - 2014 - 5 list spaces confirmed

[tigs2010]

You get graded on how you play?

So when Jack doesn't get a kick for a couple of weeks what is he?

I'd say if Edwards doesn't get out of his slump he's edging towards being a C

 

[TheDyerLegacy]

What are peoples thoughts on Ben Saunders? Playing for South Freo atm in the WAFL.. is on now against West Perth and has kicked 7.1 till 3QT.
Had a big year in 2012 was on a few radars then had an injury plagued 2013..

Some stats below about him..
http://www.wafl.com.au/players/view/3653
Club: South Fremantle
DOB: 25th December 1991
Height: 187cm
Weight: 85kg
Position: HFF

Article below was from last month mentions his injury and also his hopes of being drafted..

Former Claremont squad member Saunders took the WAFL by storm and was touted as a potential AFL draft pick after winning the Bernie Naylor Medal as the league's leading goal kicker in 2012.

https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/sport/wafl/a/22110690/saunders-takes-heart-in-fight-of-bulldogs/

Perhaps a rookie selection?
Anyone got more info on him??

 

[theflea]

You get graded on how you play?

How do you rate players, by height?

 

[sante]

How do you rate players, by height?

Lol what a strange question for him to ask.

 

[thetradesman]

So when Jack doesn't get a kick for a couple of weeks what is he?

I'd say if Edwards doesn't get out of his slump he's edging towards being a C

It's just my opinion he's just a C, he wasn't very good last year either IMO.

 

[tigerfan1961]

Well we aren't trading Cotchin, Deledio, Martin and Jack. It would be stupid and these four absolute A graders are needed to carry us through.

I think NOW is the time to put our next batch into positions to see if they become A graders or just role players or not good enough to take us to our Premiership.

Vlastuin should be our wrecking ball inside midfielder. Not Matt ******* Thomas. Vlastuin needs to be given the chance (more than single games) to develop into that position. Not half back. He's got A grade qualities. If he becomes that player, what a bonus for our midfield. It goes from ok to very good.

Brandon Ellis is lost. He's lost cause he's being given different instructions every week. He doesn't even know his role. Again, this kid has shown glimpses of being an A grader. Time to play him in a role to develop him into that player.

I applaud Dimma for doing this with Griffiths. Finally giving him the shot to be that dominant forward in the Rough head mould. He's flying. He's on his way to becoming that player some of us thought he would when he was drafted.

We have a plethora of these kids who could become A graders or very good B graders. They are either playing roles not suited to them or languishing in the VFL whilst rejects are taking their spots.

This season, we should be developing these kids. Dimma stated we needed to take a step back to go two forward. You don't do that with playing rejects and ignoring kids.

I have heard and started to see the message is at least starting to come through. Lloyd, Arnot and Gordon all getting game time. Now add McDonough, Helbig and a few more while getting the players who aren't gonna take us to that level and have been wasted on our lists become removed.

It's so simple but our coach has fallen into the same trap as our previous coaches. Thinking short term for job security.

Massive mistake.

Agree with the majority of that Bob. Playing Matt Thomas and players like him that lack the speed and skill required to drive us forward will bite us big time. Nat Foley and Newy sadly also fit into that criteria now, as injury and age seem to have caught up. Shaun Grigg has been a good get to date but needs to be dropped until he plays with intensity and learns to tackle and put on heavy defensive pressure. He is one of the reasons that Matt Arnott stands out, polar opposites.

Bob, What do you think of young Miles? I was truly staggered he did not get the upgrade based on what I saw in NAB challenge series. He and Vlastuin would be amazing on ball IMO.

FWIW, I think we have been poor so far this year due to having truly key players missing. Maric is a massive loss, no doubt, as is Lids. And Rance, geez he defends and then provides so much run. Chris Knights would also be such a great fit, his kicking skills are first class.

Getting back to the title of the thread, if we are going to trade again, we must target young players that have speed. We should have grabbed Dom Tyson this year IMO, but I guess that would have come down to cost.

Start raiding the GCS and GWS lists, Clubs that have been gifted prime picks in last few years. They cannot keep them all with the salary cap in place and from memory, GCS are transitioning to the same cap as other sides in the next year or so, while hopefully, GWS lose that outrageous COLA. No more unskilled but contested battering rams please. We need skilful fast runners.

 

[Tigerbob]

Agree with the majority of that Bob. Playing Matt Thomas and players like him that lack the speed and skill required to drive us forward will bite us big time. Nat Foley and Newy sadly also fit into that criteria now, as injury and age seem to have caught up. Shaun Grigg has been a good get to date but needs to be dropped until he plays with intensity and learns to tackle and put on heavy defensive pressure. He is one of the reasons that Matt Arnott stands out, polar opposites.

Bob, What do you think of young Miles? I was truly staggered he did not get the upgrade based on what I saw in NAB challenge series. He and Vlastuin would be amazing on ball IMO.

FWIW, I think we have been poor so far this year due to having truly key players missing. Maric is a massive loss, no doubt, as is Lids. And Rance, geez he defends and then provides so much run. Chris Knights would also be such a great fit, his kicking skills are first class.

Getting back to the title of the thread, if we are going to trade again, we must target young players that have speed. We should have grabbed Dom Tyson this year IMO, but I guess that would have come down to cost.

Start raiding the GCS and GWS lists, Clubs that have been gifted prime picks in last few years. They cannot keep them all with the salary cap in place and from memory, GCS are transitioning to the same cap as other sides in the next year or so, while hopefully, GWS lose that outrageous COLA. No more unskilled but contested battering rams please. We need skilful fast runners.

I think its a crime Miles wasn't elevated over Thomas. An absolute horror mistake.

But as I keep saying, Dimma loves a battler. Adores them.

We went way too far with the recycled player. Instead of getting AFL standard players who can fill a role, we took guys with questionable afl standard. Too many of them too.

I understood the rookie list concept. Definitely. But then how can this "insurance" policy have these guys in the starting line up at Round One? It's a travesty. These guys were taken just in case we had an injury epidemic and that reason only. Instead it's taken games away from much more talented younger players and made us a worse skilled side in the process.

We need to revamp the list again no doubt. Mistakes have been made. If Hardwick and Blair don't own up to the mistakes then we are in trouble. They need to own up that they stuffed up and rectify. Otherwise we will continue to make the same mistakes and our list will go backwards.

Look, I'm negative as I have heard a lot of stuff internally. It's all looking as I was told. Players being gifted games because of name and too many players playing out of positions.

Our list can be made one of the better ones. But we need to be smarter and target better standard players.

Our A graders need better support. Not just mature bodies.....

 

[TheDyerLegacy]

I think its a crime Miles wasn't elevated over Thomas. An absolute horror mistake.

But as I keep saying, Dimma loves a battler. Adores them.

We went way too far with the recycled player. Instead of getting AFL standard players who can fill a role, we took guys with questionable afl standard. Too many of them too.

I understood the rookie list concept. Definitely. But then how can this "insurance" policy have these guys in the starting line up at Round One? It's a travesty. These guys were taken just in case we had an injury epidemic and that reason only. Instead it's taken games away from much more talented younger players and made us a worse skilled side in the process.

We need to revamp the list again no doubt. Mistakes have been made. If Hardwick and Blair don't own up to the mistakes then we are in trouble. They need to own up that they stuffed up and rectify. Otherwise we will continue to make the same mistakes and our list will go backwards.

Look, I'm negative as I have heard a lot of stuff internally. It's all looking as I was told. Players being gifted games because of name and too many players playing out of positions.

Our list can be made one of the better ones. But we need to be smarter and target better standard players.

Our A graders need better support. Not just mature bodies.....

Richmond just got carried away with recycling players.. you need to know when to pull out.. or else you can end up making a big mistake if you know what I mean...

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

Richmond just got carried away with recycling players.. you need to know when to pull out.. or else you can end up making a big mistake if you know what I mean...

I think we have been s**t at identifying post 20 picks and as such have overrated recycled players in comparison to post 20 picks .

 

[Bojangles17]

Agree with the majority of that Bob. Playing Matt Thomas and players like him that lack the speed and skill required to drive us forward will bite us big time. Nat Foley and Newy sadly also fit into that criteria now, as injury and age seem to have caught up. Shaun Grigg has been a good get to date but needs to be dropped until he plays with intensity and learns to tackle and put on heavy defensive pressure. He is one of the reasons that Matt Arnott stands out, polar opposites.

Bob, What do you think of young Miles? I was truly staggered he did not get the upgrade based on what I saw in NAB challenge series. He and Vlastuin would be amazing on ball IMO.

FWIW, I think we have been poor so far this year due to having truly key players missing. Maric is a massive loss, no doubt, as is Lids. And Rance, geez he defends and then provides so much run. Chris Knights would also be such a great fit, his kicking skills are first class.

Getting back to the title of the thread, if we are going to trade again, we must target young players that have speed. We should have grabbed Dom Tyson this year IMO, but I guess that would have come down to cost.

Start raiding the GCS and GWS lists, Clubs that have been gifted prime picks in last few years. They cannot keep them all with the salary cap in place and from memory, GCS are transitioning to the same cap as other sides in the next year or so, while hopefully, GWS lose that outrageous COLA. No more unskilled but contested battering rams please. We need skilful fast runners.

Good points tf , I sense the lunar eclipse of FA will arrive 7-8 years into the GC Gws time in the league with any number of young Vic's eligible to return home free of charge. They will be looking to trade prior to this happening...so agreed , a good place to focus

 

[Bojangles17]

What are peoples thoughts on Ben Saunders? Playing for South Freo atm in the WAFL.. is on now against West Perth and has kicked 7.1 till 3QT.
Had a big year in 2012 was on a few radars then had an injury plagued 2013..

Some stats below about him..
http://www.wafl.com.au/players/view/3653
Club: South Fremantle
DOB: 25th December 1991
Height: 187cm
Weight: 85kg
Position: HFF

Article below was from last month mentions his injury and also his hopes of being drafted..

https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/sport/wafl/a/22110690/saunders-takes-heart-in-fight-of-bulldogs/

Perhaps a rookie selection?
Anyone got more info on him??

Perthboy should have the oil on this guy

 

[TigerTime88]

I think we have been s**t at identifying post 20 picks and as such have overrated recycled players in comparison to post 20 picks .

To be honest the draft has been compromised for a while and those pick 30 odds are really 3rd/4th rounders. In saying that the big miss for me was Batchelor over Parker who was rated a lot higher prior to the draft and now showing why.

 

[Cevap_Rolls]

Matt Rosa toying with the idea of Free Agency.
Rumour has it we were interested last year but couldnt get the deal done.

Any interested? Dont know much about him apart from he can be a little inconsistent.

 

[MR]

I'd love us to go after Kreuzer this year. Wouldn't cost more than an early second rounder + steak knives, (Mcevoy went for 18 + Savage) or maybe even a straight swap for Vickery. He can actually play forward, a much better ruckman and athletic enough to allow us to play three forwards. A three pronged forward line of Riewoldt, Griffiths and Kruezer sounds pretty good to me. He has excellent skills and can see him in the long term taking our No.1 ruckman position.

In terms of uncontracted players who I wouldn't mind having a look at
Bennell - Would cost us the sun and stars but is rightly ours anyway.
S. May - Would go for half of what Frawley is asking for but would probably give same output
M. Gleeson - This kid can play. Since he's getting a bit of game time, maybe a second rounder.
Jaksch, Plowman, O'Rourke - All young guns who can play a role in our side
Bob Murphy - I know it would be short term, but he could solve our problems on the half-back line and give us a deadly three-pronged attack of elite kickers in him, Deledio and Houli. Offer him a two year deal with the first year front-loaded and tell him that he'll likely use his second season to teach youngsters. Look at how well Chapman is going for the Dons.

 

[Cevap_Rolls]

I'd love us to go after Kreuzer this year. Wouldn't cost more than an early second rounder + steak knives, (Mcevoy went for 18 + Savage) or maybe even a straight swap for Vickery. He can actually play forward, a much better ruckman and athletic enough to allow us to play three forwards. A three pronged forward line of Riewoldt, Griffiths and Kruezer sounds pretty good to me. He has excellent skills and can see him in the long term taking our No.1 ruckman position.

In terms of uncontracted players who I wouldn't mind having a look at
Bennell - Would cost us the sun and stars but is rightly ours anyway.
S. May - Would go for half of what Frawley is asking for but would probably give same output
M. Gleeson - This kid can play. Since he's getting a bit of game time, maybe a second rounder.
Jaksch, Plowman, O'Rourke - All young guns who can play a role in our side
Bob Murphy - I know it would be short term, but he could solve our problems on the half-back line and give us a deadly three-pronged attack of elite kickers in him, Deledio and Houli. Offer him a two year deal with the first year front-loaded and tell him that he'll likely use his second season to teach youngsters. Look at how well Chapman is going for the Dons.

Suggested earlier on that we should have done the Vickery and Kruezer deal last year. Doing it next year defeats the purpose of bringing Hampson to the club so i cant see it happening.

Bennell - MMMMMM Yes please. But * me what would we cost? They lack key forwards Vickery and our first? Only other players that would get it done would be off limits Jack, Deledio, Martin
S.May - Interesting but GC would want too much for him
M.Gleeson - Never heard of him
GWS players- Do we have the currency to trade with them. Unless we offloaded some players to other clubs for early draft picks
Bob Murphy- We would need to be in intention for a flag to get him. If we are going to bring in players to teach our youth i would rather we brought premiership players. Im thinking Sewell could be handy.

 

[NZ_Tiger]

The blues would trade their number 1 draft pick for a second rounder? No chance, he loves the club and they would have to eat a big pile of humble pie if they let him go. Blowing a number 1 pick is a massive loss of face and the money men behind the blues wouldn't let him move unless they could be seen as the clear winners in the trade.

For us we are swapping Vickery for a 3rd, quality 1st choice ruck who, one game aside, can't play forward. Plus the injury risk with him is immense, it seems likely he'll never be the same.

 

[TigerTime88]

The blues would trade their number 1 draft pick for a second rounder? No chance, he loves the club and they would have to eat a big pile of humble pie if they let him go. Blowing a number 1 pick is a massive loss of face and the money men behind the blues wouldn't let him move unless they could be seen as the clear winners in the trade.

For us we are swapping Vickery for a 3rd, quality 1st choice ruck who, one game aside, can't play forward. Plus the injury risk with him is immense, it seems likely he'll never be the same.

Agree with this.

Would like us to go hard at GWS youngsters.

 

[pebblestone]

Good points tf , I sense the lunar eclipse of FA will arrive 7-8 years into the GC Gws time in the league with any number of young Vic's eligible to return home free of charge. They will be looking to trade prior to this happening...so agreed , a good place to focus

I reckon gws more so. I mean if I was a 25yo super fit bloke earning 350k or more living on the gold coast with a bunch of mates, I'd be pretty happy there I reckon. Especially if they're winning flags.

 

[sante]

Matt Rosa toying with the idea of Free Agency.
Rumour has it we were interested last year but couldnt get the deal done.

Any interested? Dont know much about him apart from he can be a little inconsistent.

No way. He's a nothing player. Griggesque

 

[Cevap_Rolls]

No way. He's a nothing player. Griggesque

Griggesque 2011-2012 or Griggesque 2013-2014?

 

[Bojangles17]

I reckon gws more so. I mean if I was a 25yo super fit bloke earning 350k or more living on the gold coast with a bunch of mates, I'd be pretty happy there I reckon. Especially if they're winning flags.

That's not a given by any means , I suspect there will be quite a few that entertain the idea of finishing their career playing on the mcg most weeks, after all that s what they dreamt about right

 

[Livonski]

Suggested earlier on that we should have done the Vickery and Kruezer deal last year. Doing it next year defeats the purpose of bringing Hampson to the club so i cant see it happening.

Bennell - MMMMMM Yes please. But **** me what would we cost? They lack key forwards Vickery and our first? Only other players that would get it done would be off limits Jack, Deledio, Martin
S.May - Interesting but GC would want too much for him
M.Gleeson - Never heard of him
GWS players- Do we have the currency to trade with them. Unless we offloaded some players to other clubs for early draft picks
Bob Murphy- We would need to be in intention for a flag to get him. If we are going to bring in players to teach our youth i would rather we brought premiership players. Im thinking Sewell could be handy.

Kreuzer, Bob Murphy and Brad Sewell FFS you have got to be kidding.
They'll be lucky to play 20 more games between them.
Makes Grigg and Houli look like grand theft.

 

[Cevap_Rolls]

Kreuzer, Bob Murphy and Brad Sewell FFS you have got to be kidding.
They'll be lucky to play 20 more games between them.
Makes Grigg and Houli look like grand theft.

No never suggested Kreuzer or Murphy.
Said if wanted to go for Kreuzer than last year would have made more sense.
Never wanted Murphy only stated if we were going to go down the path of finding a player for 2 years with experience I would rather a premiership player. Only said Sewell because he could be desisted come seasons end.

Don't underestimate what a premiership player could do for our club. They don't need to play 22 games and be bog. Just being used for depth and being around at training would make a huge.development to the younger boys.

If our club is too tight to pay up for quality and we keep on recruiting hacks than I would rather those hacks came from Hawks, Cats, Pies and Swans rather than Dee's, Blues and Crows.

 

[Barry_Badrinath]

No to the trade for Kreuzer. If we want him FA at the end of next year is the way. He's too injury prone to trade picks or Vickery for.

Plus, Carlton are gonna be shithouse next year. Judd's going to retire this year and will fall in a massive hole. Let the magnitude of the required rebuild really sink in.

 

[tigs2010]

Don't underestimate what a premiership player could do for our club. They don't need to play 22 games and be bog. Just being used for depth and being around at training would make a huge.development to the younger boys.

He he he.