Broken promises

[AM]

If you want to see something that could have come from the lips of Sir Humphrey check out Malcolm on tonight's 7.30 Report trying to weasel out of the above Abbott pre-election promise not to cut funds to the ABC and SBS.

 

[Xsess]

It's not a cut, it's an efficiency dividend.

Its a cut and Abbott was stupid stating there wouldn't be any.

Many in the public support squeezing efficiencies out of the public service but the gotcha! "lie" will be replayed over and over and over and might get traction (but nowhere near to the extent of the bareface "no carbon tax" betrayal).

 

[madmug]

Its a cut and Abbott was stupid stating there wouldn't be any.

Many in the public support squeezing efficiencies out of the public service but the gotcha! "lie" will be replayed over and over and over and might get traction (but nowhere near to the extent of the bareface "no carbon tax" betrayal).

Do you wanta bet? nocutstotheabcnocutstotheabcnocutstotheabcnocutstotheabcnocutstotheabcnocutstotheabcnocutstotheabcnocutstotheabcnocutstotheabcnocutstotheabcnocutstotheabcnocutstotheabc.

Thats just the start

 

[sherb]

Its a cut and Abbott was stupid stating there wouldn't be any.

Many in the public support squeezing efficiencies out of the public service but the gotcha! "lie" will be replayed over and over and over and might get traction (but nowhere near to the extent of the bareface "no carbon tax" betrayal).

A lie is a lie, unless you believe that there ARE degrees of honesty.

And Abbott is as big a liar, if not the biggest, I've seen in Australian politics.

He is doing politics (and politicians) in this country no favours with his disregard for honesty.

 

[Mofra]

"We will put a price on carbon" (pre-election) = ermahgahd Gillerd is a liar! Argh!

"No cuts to the ABC or SBS" = 'efficiency dividend' are not cuts.

Gotta love one-eyed apologists, upset that the most unbiased media source in the country continues to provide people information.

 

[madmug]

A lie is a lie, unless you believe that there ARE degrees of honesty.

And Abbott is as big a liar, if not the biggest, I've seen in Australian politics.

He is doing politics (and politicians) in this country no favours with his disregard for honesty.

Yes but what makes it worse is the hand on heart shyte he gave us before the last election, all the shyte about the adults running the place. He has shown us what a lying psycho embarassing FWIT piece of shyte he is.

He is destroying the LNP.

 

[Xsess]

"We will put a price on carbon" (pre-election) = ermahgahd Gillerd is a liar! Argh!

"No cuts to the ABC or SBS" = 'efficiency dividend' are not cuts.

Gotta love one-eyed apologists, upset that the most unbiased media source in the country continues to provide people information.

“No carbon tax in a government I lead”
“No cuts to the ABC or SBS” - both broken promises and lies.

 

[Jiska]

"We will put a price on carbon" (pre-election) = ermahgahd Gillerd is a liar! Argh!

"No cuts to the ABC or SBS" = 'efficiency dividend' are not cuts.

Gotta love one-eyed apologists, upset that the most unbiased media source in the country continues to provide people information.

You also forgot to mention the Howard lie:


Let's visit broken promises (excluding the ABC cuts):
1. Tony Abbott: no new taxes, no cuts to health or education (2014)

“What you’ll get under us are tax cuts without new taxes,” Abbott said in 2012. He later vowed “no cuts to education, no cuts to health”. Abbott won the 2013 election and in his first budget cut funding for schools and hospitals by $80 billion and introduced a new deficit tax, plus a $7 GP tax. Will Abbott survive? The Coalition has taken a big hit in the polls, and Abbott’s popularity is in the death zone.

As health minister before the 2004 election, Abbott gave “an absolutely rock solid, iron-clad commitment” not to change the Medicare safety net. After the election the Coalition raised the safety net. “I am very sorry that that statement back in October has turned out not to be realised by events,” Abbott said, “but this is a government which, in the end, has based its whole record … on economic responsibility”. Sounds familiar?

2. Julia Gillard: no carbon tax (2011)

“There will be no carbon tax under the government I lead.” This phrase, uttered on TV just before the 2010 election, is one of the most famous in recent political history (some Coalition staffers have it as their ringtone). Gillard formed a minority government and introduced a carbon tax (her words). This proved terminal; the opposition and media hounded her until she lost the leadership in 2013. The carbon tax backflip added to perceptions of Gillard that she was untrustworthy because she had “knifed” Kevin Rudd (venomous shock jock Alan Jones dubbed her “Juliar”).

3. John Howard: never ever on a GST (1999)

There would “never ever” be a GST, John Howard said in 1995. In 1999 he brought one in. And Howard got away with it; he went on to win two elections, and the ALP dropped its opposition to the GST. Dickenson says the broken GST promise didn’t really hurt Howard, although his creation of “core and non-core promises” (which was not initially about the GST) did affect his credibility somewhat.

"No cuts to the ABC or SBS" = 'efficiency dividend' are not cuts.

Efficienct dividends are not cuts; who are you trying to kid, mister one-eyed apologist.[/quote]
reduce the amount or quantity of.
"buyers will bargain hard to cut the cost of the house they want"
synonyms:reduce, cut back/down on, decrease, lessen, retrench, diminish, trim, prune, slim down, ease up on;More
rationalize, downsize, slenderize, economize on;
mark down, discount, lower;
informalslash, axe
"the government is likely to cut public expenditure"
antonyms:increase

 

[AM]

You also forgot to mention the Howard lie:

Let's visit broken promises (excluding the ABC cuts):
1. Tony Abbott: no new taxes, no cuts to health or education (2014)

“What you’ll get under us are tax cuts without new taxes,” Abbott said in 2012. He later vowed “no cuts to education, no cuts to health”. Abbott won the 2013 election and in his first budget cut funding for schools and hospitals by $80 billion and introduced a new deficit tax, plus a $7 GP tax. Will Abbott survive? The Coalition has taken a big hit in the polls, and Abbott’s popularity is in the death zone.

As health minister before the 2004 election, Abbott gave “an absolutely rock solid, iron-clad commitment” not to change the Medicare safety net. After the election the Coalition raised the safety net. “I am very sorry that that statement back in October has turned out not to be realised by events,” Abbott said, “but this is a government which, in the end, has based its whole record … on economic responsibility”. Sounds familiar?

2. Julia Gillard: no carbon tax (2011)

“There will be no carbon tax under the government I lead.” This phrase, uttered on TV just before the 2010 election, is one of the most famous in recent political history (some Coalition staffers have it as their ringtone). Gillard formed a minority government and introduced a carbon tax (her words). This proved terminal; the opposition and media hounded her until she lost the leadership in 2013. The carbon tax backflip added to perceptions of Gillard that she was untrustworthy because she had “knifed” Kevin Rudd (venomous shock jock Alan Jones dubbed her “Juliar”).

3. John Howard: never ever on a GST (1999)

There would “never ever” be a GST, John Howard said in 1995. In 1999 he brought one in. And Howard got away with it; he went on to win two elections, and the ALP dropped its opposition to the GST. Dickenson says the broken GST promise didn’t really hurt Howard, although his creation of “core and non-core promises” (which was not initially about the GST) did affect his credibility somewhat.


Efficienct dividends are not cuts; who are you trying to kid, mister one-eyed apologist.

reduce the amount or quantity of.
"buyers will bargain hard to cut the cost of the house they want"
synonyms:reduce, cut back/down on, decrease, lessen, retrench, diminish, trim, prune, slim down, ease up on;More
rationalize, downsize, slenderize, economize on;
mark down, discount, lower;
informalslash, axe
"the government is likely to cut public expenditure"
antonyms:increase

Howard broke so many promises he had to turn them into "core" and "non core".

 

[telsor]

You also forgot to mention the Howard lie:

3. John Howard: never ever on a GST (1999)

There would “never ever” be a GST, John Howard said in 1995. In 1999 he brought one in. And Howard got away with it; he went on to win two elections, and the ALP dropped its opposition to the GST. Dickenson says the broken GST promise didn’t really hurt Howard, although his creation of “core and non-core promises” (which was not initially about the GST) did affect his credibility somewhat.

I don't actually count that as a lie, because after changing his view/policy, he went to an election stating what the new policy was before implementing it.

While I agree 'never ever' was a bit strong, I'm OK with politicians changing their mind, so long as they go into an election having announced said change.


On the ABC, I note that a lot of the announced 'cuts' are actually the ABC redirecting funds from 'old' media to 'new' (digital), so would have happened anyway.

 

[sherb]

I don't actually count that as a lie, because after changing his view/policy, he went to an election stating what the new policy was before implementing it.

Of course it was a lie, it became a lie the minute Howard made it part of Coalition policy.

John Howard: "No, there's no way that a GST will ever be part of our policy."

Journalist: "Never ever?"

John Howard: "Never ever. It's dead. It was killed by the voters in the last election"

 

[telsor]

Of course it was a lie, it became a lie the minute Howard made it part of Coalition policy.

John Howard: "No, there's no way that a GST will ever be part of our policy."

Journalist: "Never ever?"

John Howard: "Never ever. It's dead. It was killed by the voters in the last election"

Can a politican never change their mind, or a party it's policies?

I say, once they've gone to an election with the new policy, previous contradictory promises are invalid.


Or do you think both Libs and ALP are still guilty of any promises they made with respect to the white Australia Policy, because back in the day, they both undoubtedly made comments in support?

 

[sherb]

Can a politican never change their mind, or a party it's policies?

I say, once they've gone to an election with the new policy, previous contradictory promises are invalid.


Or do you think both Libs and ALP are still guilty of any promises they made with respect to the white Australia Policy, because back in the day, they both undoubtedly made comments in support?

Howard promises the GST will not becomes part of Coalition policy.

Three years later Howard makes GST part of Coalition policy.

Howard lied, as much as you like to try to spin it otherwise.

 

[telsor]

Howard promises the GST will not becomes part of Coalition policy.

Three years later Howard makes GST part of Coalition policy.

Howard lied, as much as you like to try to spin it otherwise.

So any policy change is a lie and politicians are never allowed to change their minds....

 

[telsor]

Howard promises the GST will not becomes part of Coalition policy.

Three years later Howard makes GST part of Coalition policy.

Howard lied, as much as you like to try to spin it otherwise.

John Curtin (ALP), 1939...
"This country shall remain forever the home of the descendants of those people who came here in peace in order to establish in the South Seas an outpost of the British race."

Has the ALP changed that policy? Did they lie to do so? After all, he said 'forever'.

 

[sherb]

So any policy change is a lie and politicians are never allowed to change their minds....

Maybe you should ask Julia Gillard that.

I'm not going to change your mind re Howard, so I'll let you read Alan Ramsey's article about the GST lie.

Not that I expect it to open your eyes.

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/08/17/1092508474312.html

 

[telsor]

Maybe you should ask Julia Gillard that.

I'm not going to change your mind re Howard, so I'll let you read Alan Ramsey's article about the GST lie.

Not that I expect it to open your eyes.

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/08/17/1092508474312.html

As I said, my view is based on what the people voted for.

Changing the policy then getting voted in is legit.
Changing policy a couple of days after getting voted in isn't.

 

[sherb]

As I said, my view is based on what the people voted for.

Changing the policy then getting voted in is legit.
Changing policy a couple of days after getting voted in isn't.

If Howard wasn't lying in 95, the GST would not have become part of Coalition policy.

All you are doing is fudging the criteria so that in your mind Howard didn't lie and Gillard did.

Thought you were better than that.

 

[sherb]

As I said, my view is based on what the people voted for.

Changing the policy then getting voted in is legit.
Changing policy a couple of days after getting voted in isn't.

There's one other thing you need to consider regarding Howard's GST lie - he made it before the 1996 election.

No way was he going to leave the door open to the possibility of a GST going into the 96 poll, after Hewson got knocked off with a GST as part of his policy in 93.

So it was just a panicked, arse-saving exercise on his part to help him get into power.

 

[AM]

What Abbott actually said...

Was:

 

[telsor]

Was:

Curious how your edit starts mid comment...Here's the full version.

 

[AM]

Thanks for the confirmation!

Even though I posted it earlier in the thread.

 

[telsor]

Thanks for the confirmation!

Even though I posted it earlier in the thread.

I just did it without the 'useful' editing out of him prefacing his remarks with a reference to Hockey's previous statements.

 

[Lester Burnham]

Yeah, I was just questioning whether you genuinely believed it was Abbott 'bad' and Gillard 'worse'. Your gave two reasons why you thought Gillard was worse and I suggested that you still may have been looking at the situation with bias.

It is pretty remarkable just how similar your above comments are about the quote being cut off and people who said the 2nd half of Gillard's Sunrise comment was 'but I am determined to put a price on Carbon'. There couldn't be a clearer example of how bias colours people's views.

How are the comments similar? A comment - that Abbotts's quote was cut off - is true. People saying - the 2nd half of Gillard's Sunrise comment was 'but I am determined to put a price on Carbon' - is false.

 

[sherb]

Yep! And as I said I'd posted it before. The Hockey comment is a sideshow. The main event are Abbott's clear and unambiguous statements. Many of which he made on other occasions and the absolute hypocrisy of the very same man who said in 2011:

Spot on.

There was no doubt at to what Abbott was saying at all. Absolutely none.

And now the lie has been exposed, both the government and its supporters are desperately clutching at straws.