Bruce Francis

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Gigantor said:
I have never had the full interim report.

At one stage Bruce Francis had a blog with large slabs of the interim report and associated evidence quoted.

It is no longer accessible, and unfortunately, I only have very small bits copied.
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So you accuse others of jumping to conclusions with incomplete information and have readily done the same. That's disappointing.
 
Gigantor said:
More broadly, on many occasions in the interim report, ASADA simply presume Thymosin = Thymosin Beta 4, and on that basis, conclude from the evidence that TB4 was used/transported, or whatever, even if the documentation being referenced refers to Thymosin (or other similar name).
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But the latest 'rehash' (if it's even legit, who knows where it came from) clearly states that XXXXXXX was injected with what he understood to be TB4. It's not what ASADA understood, it is what XXXXXXX understood.
 
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blue harvest said:
But the latest 'rehash' clearly states that XXXXXXX was injected with what he understood to be TB4. It's not what ASADA understood, it is what XXXXXXX understood.
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The player was told that the thymosin he received was TB4. He saw others receive the same drug. This completes the chain from China to Essendon to the players. Checkmate.
 
blue harvest said:
But the latest 'rehash' clearly states that XXXXXXX was injected with what he understood to be TB4. It's not what ASADA understood, it is what XXXXXXX understood.
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It's ASADA's summary of the evidence.

Given ASADA's form with the interim report, prudence suggests that we wait to see what the evidence actually is, rather than accept ASADA's portrayal of what they think it means.

It's worth repeating:
  1. the quoted text does not actually say what people are thinking it says; and
  2. it contains a gross error of fact which has been carried over from the interim report, casting much doubt on everything in that quote.
 
Anyone who has ANY IDEA at all about Evidence would know that Investigators can not change words in statements of witnesses. They could not say TB4 if the player stated Thymosin.

Only a complete FOOL would think they could/would. The player would be as big a FOOL if they signed it if that is what they did.
 
Tazmania said:
Whenever I see the words El Paso I have the old Marty Robins song playing in my head.

Out in the West Texas town of El Paso
I fell in love with a Mexican girl.
Night-time would find me in Rosa's cantina;
Music would play and Felina would whirl.
Blacker than night were the eyes of Felina,
Wicked and evil while casting a spell.
My love was deep for this Mexican maiden;
I was in love but in vain, I could tell.
One night a wild young cowboy came in,
Wild as the West Texas wind.
Dashing and daring,
A drink he was sharing
With wicked Felina,
The girl that I loved.
So in anger I
Challenged his right for the love of this maiden.
Down went his hand for the gun that he wore.
My challenge was answered in less than a heart-beat;
The handsome young stranger lay dead on the floor.
Just for a moment I stood there in silence,
Shocked by the FOUL EVIL deed I had done.
Many thoughts raced through my mind as I stood there;
I had but one chance and that was to run.
Out through the back door of Rosa's I ran,
Out where the horses were tied.
I caught a good one.
It looked like it could run.
Up on its back
And away I did ride,
Just as fast as I
Could from the West Texas town of El Paso
Out to the bad-lands of New Mexico.
Back in El Paso my life would be worthless.
Everything's gone in life; nothing is left.
It's been so long since I've seen the young maiden
My love is stronger than my fear of death.
I saddled up and away I did go,
Riding alone in the dark.
Maybe tomorrow
A bullet may find me.
Tonight nothing's worse than this
Pain in my heart.
And at last here I
Am on the hill overlooking El Paso;
I can see Rosa's cantina below.
My love is strong and it pushes me onward.
Down off the hill to Felina I go.
Off to my right I see five mounted cowboys;
Off to my left ride a dozen or more.
Shouting and shooting I can't let them catch me.
I have to make it to Rosa's back door.
Something is dreadfully wrong for I feel
A deep burning pain in my side.
Though I am trying
To stay in the saddle,
I'm getting weary,
Unable to ride.
But my love for
Felina is strong and I rise where I've fallen,
Though I am weary I can't stop to rest.
I see the white puff of smoke from the rifle.
I feel the bullet go deep in my chest.
From out of nowhere Felina has found me,
Kissing my cheek as she kneels by my side.
Cradled by two loving arms that I'll die for,
One little kiss and Felina, good-bye.
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Haven't heard that in years. Thanks.

Heard Marty and his backing singers on every line. :cry:
 
Gigantor said:
It's ASADA's summary of the evidence.

Given ASADA's form with the interim report, prudence suggests that we wait to see what the evidence actually is, rather than accept ASADA's portrayal of what they think it means.

It's worth repeating:
  1. the quoted text does not actually say what people are thinking it says; and
  2. it contains a gross error of fact which has been carried over from the interim report, casting much doubt on everything in that quote.
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You've never had the full interim report, how do you know ASADA's form? You have been given one persons interpretation of it. What if they were just selectively quoting?
 
Gigantor said:
It's ASADA's summary of the evidence.

Given ASADA's form with the interim report, prudence suggests that we wait to see what the evidence actually is, rather than accept ASADA's portrayal of what they think it means.

It's worth repeating:
  1. the quoted text does not actually say what people are thinking it says; and
  2. it contains a gross error of fact which has been carried over from the interim report, casting much doubt on everything in that quote.
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Do you even know what a summary of evidence is
 
Wha
Gigantor said:
It's ASADA's summary of the evidence.

Given ASADA's form with the interim report, prudence suggests that we wait to see what the evidence actually is, rather than accept ASADA's portrayal of what they think it means.

It's worth repeating:
  1. the quoted text does not actually say what people are thinking it says; and
  2. it contains a gross error of fact which has been carried over from the interim report, casting much doubt on everything in that quote.
Click to expand...
What do you think the gross error of fact is?
 

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Ancient Tiger said:
The player was told that the thymosin he received was TB4. He saw others receive the same drug. This completes the chain from China to Essendon to the players. Checkmate.
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So player originally believes he was getting good Thymosin or vitamins or whatever, and during his interview they say 'no no no, you were given TB4' and he just goes 'okay then, my understanding is I was given TB4 and so was everyone else'.

lol
 
Gigantor said:
With quite extensive quotes from the Interim Report.
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That was re written by Bruce Francis, you have never seen the original interim report.

So how the hell can you claim someones evidence is simply a re hash of said report.

Can you not understand why you are not taken seriously.
 
blue harvest said:
So player originally believes he was getting good Thymosin or vitamins or whatever, and during his interview they say 'no no no, you were given TB4' and he just goes 'okay then, my understanding is I was given TB4 and so was everyone else'.

lol
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It could have been a player that was told he was given thymosin and that it was thymosin beta 4. The latter has only been released at the eleventh hour to avoid persecution of the player and to keep his anonymity.
 
Gigantor said:
The players defense contains an admission that they were injected with a substance.

Was that sentence meant to have made some sort of sense?
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It is a crucial part of the case. We know for a FACT players were injected. We also know for a fact the schedules. Th players admissions on this are very important. And it makes perfect sense.
 
Gigantor said:
With quite extensive quotes from the Interim Report.
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Bruce Franicis admits himself that he condensed the 430+ pages of the interim report into 46 pages, leaving out bits he did not deem relevant, thus leaving only those that support his argument.

Is this not exactly what he (and you) accuse ASADA of doing in manipulating evidence?

How many relevant quotes that ASADA is using in their report that he has delated that ASADA consider vital? How much evidence has ASADA collected or sorted through since the interim report was released?

He's selectively quoting arguments that support his, only publishing his summary of the interim report, not the whole report.

So what if he is quoting the interim report selectively cherry picking quotes? Hes not giving access to the whole report to his readers is determine the truth.

I will also be very surprised if ASADA was allowed to use the charter and Alavi transcripts without giving the defence the full version in line with standard evidence practice for it to be accepted.

Would expect BF to do the same do we can evualte his arguments
 
Gigantor said:
"Apparently", so you don't know for sure?

I am offering the view that it is a re-hash of what's in the interim report.

Some agree, some disagree.

ASADA has already demonstrated a propensity for poetic license in summarising the evidence it has on hand.

Furthermore, the bit we are looking at actually contains one gross error of fact, which must cast doubt on all of it (and I'm sure the defence will be on hand to point that out).
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This is not a rehash from the interim report.
 
Lion of Panjshir said:
Can someone please PM me the supposed smoking gun? I'm a bit confused here.
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smoking-gun.jpg
 
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