Preview Changes for the Giants game

[jenny61_99]

Alex - I don't think everyone is saying it's just those players that let us down last weekend. There's no doubt though, that we expect MORE from them than the others, which is why their names surface more after a loss like that.

I don't think (at this stage) that we have insurmountable problems. The Hawthorn game was our first real test this season and put some perspective on where we really sit as a team.

 

[Freddy Bassett]

No Freddy, you enjoy reading stuff you agree with.

Bagging Walker doesn't suggest someone has a solid understanding of the game, it suggest they know how to read and follow the masses on this board.

But lets continue to bag Walker, Vince and Otten as it's easy and allows most to mask the real problems. Lets bag them out and suggest they are our only problems and expect them to win games for us when we all know - we have bigger problems that just 3 ****ing players.

Stop being a pork chop Alex... I have said for a long time, Walker is a genuine talent who has the ability to be a great of the game. But to play full forward, he needs to contest in the air. If he doesn't, he will be dropped before you know it and you will be calling for Sando's head....
He must get stronger on the lead, present more and contest in the air.. If he doesn't he will be playing for Bassett..

 

[Freddy Bassett]

Alex - I don't think everyone is saying it's just those players that let us down last weekend. There's no doubt though, that we expect MORE from them than the others, which is why their names surface more after a loss like that.

I don't think (at this stage) that we have insurmountable problems. The Hawthorn game was our first real test this season and put some perspective on where we really sit as a team.

Spot on Jenny. We lost to a likely Grand Finalist, interstate, who had a really good day out. We kicked as bad as any team probably ever has. We had more than 3 quarters of the team play below average. We lost by less than 10 goals... We have a full list to choose from.. I dont think there is too much to worry about at this stage.

 

[crows dude]

I spoke to someone who was at the game and watched Tex's game closely. He told me that time and time again Tex lead and provided a target away from Tippett but they just kept bombing it to Tippett every time. I think we need to look for other options first and then use the bomb as the get out option.

 

[cm_perfect]

One of my frustrations last year with Tip and Tex was that they would both go up in a contest and inevitably spoil each other. Many on this board complained about the same thing.

Last week we bombed to Tip on most occasions and Tex stayed off the pack...one needs to stay down and it was Tex last week

Our cleanliness of our mids was shocking last week, Tex's bad game does not rest on his shoulders alone (IMO).

Our forwards cant take a trick on this board sometimes..

 

[Freddy Bassett]

One of my frustrations last year with Tip and Tex was that they would both go up in a contest and inevitably spoil each other. Many on this board complained about the same thing.

Last week we bombed to Tip on most occasions and Tex stayed off the pack...one needs to stay down and it was Tex last week

Our cleanliness of our mids was shocking last week, Tex's bad game does not rest on his shoulders alone (IMO).

Our forwards cant take a trick on this board sometimes..

Please let me know the week it is Tex going for the marks
When and if he does, is when he will fulfill his potential and become a genuine star

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Please let me know the week it is Tex going for the marks
When and if he does, is when he will fulfill his potential and become a genuine star

So you're saying, you haven't seen any difference between how he played last year and how he is playing this year?

 

[cm_perfect]

Please let me know the week it is Tex going for the marks
When and if he does, is when he will fulfill his potential and become a genuine star

Comedy Gold

If Tex had Shoenmakers (not sure if right spelling) on him do you think we may of bombed it on his head instead ???

Do you think our mids decided to bomb it to Tip on most occasions of their own accord or do you think Sando may of had a bit of input ??

Now off for a snitty and a Pale

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

?

Do you think our mids decided to bomb it to Tip on most occasions of their own accord or do you think Sando may of had a bit of input ??

Neither, I think our mids bombed it into our forward 50 due to the pressure being applied by the Hawks. Once they improve and develop a stronger understanding of the movement patters and offensive timing, they kicks into the forward 50 will get much better. We see it against the weaker opposition but fell down against the stronger one. Give them time.

They bombed it long because it was an old habit they understood and felt safe doing.

 

[jackster83]

Would it have hurt to have pushed him further up the ground when he had gone for a while without getting involved?

Put him as a high half forward out towards the wing and if his workrate was/is the problem then he's got no where to hide. He can also play a part in improving some of the shoddy delivery Tippett has been receiving.

I'd like to see Sando show a sense of adaptibility during a game - and that means more than just Johncock being moved to the forward line.

 

[cm_perfect]

Neither, I think our mids bombed it into our forward 50 due to the pressure being applied by the Hawks. Once they improve and develop a stronger understanding of the movement patters and offensive timing, they kicks into the forward 50 will get much better. We see it against the weaker opposition but fell down against the stronger one. Give them time.

They bombed it long because it was an old habit they understood and felt safe doing.

I dont completely disagree with what you have said but I think it may of been a bit of both, it looked like they were trying to take advantage of Tip against Shoenmaker..

 

[King Elvis]

But lets continue to bag Walker, Vince and Otten as it's easy and allows most to mask the real problems.

Christ, you're such a Princess.

Vince was s**t on the weekend.

Walker wasn't worth having on the field.

Otten was crap, you think he's playing as a lock down defender, most people disagree.


Stop indulging yourself with ridiculous hyperbole; very few people have the knives out for Vince, or Otten (he needs a spell, that isn't making him a scape-goat, his form just isn't there), and you can't defend Walker's game on the weekend - unless the 'decoy forward who doesn't put in,' is a new tactic we're trying.

Last week we bombed to Tip on most occasions and Tex stayed off the pack...one needs to stay down and it was Tex last week

Our cleanliness of our mids was shocking last week, Tex's bad game does not rest on his shoulders alone (IMO).

Our forwards cant take a trick on this board sometimes..

We have numerous smaller players in our side to play the crumbing/roving forward role, we don't need a 194cm/100kg beast doing it.

And we were Tippett-centric, but Walker needs to keep his head up and not stop working if he is making unrewarded leads.

He appeared to decide that Tippett was drawing so much of the ball, that there wasn't much point in him providing an option.

 

[Cap]

I dont completely disagree with what you have said but I think it may of been a bit of both, it looked like they were trying to take advantage of Tip against Shoenmaker..

I believe that is what Sando said in his presser as well.

 

[King Elvis]

Would it have hurt to have pushed him further up the ground when he had gone for a while without getting involved?

Put him as a high half forward out towards the wing and if his workrate was/is the problem then he's got no where to hide. He can also play a part in improving some of the shoddy delivery Tippett has been receiving.

That's kinda my point.

Riewoldt does it, and Tippett is doing it - they force themselves into the game by sheer work-rate. They do a huge amount of un-rewarded running to achieve it, but that's what makes them good.

If the ball isn't coming to Tippett, he goes and gets it. He's on the flanks, running his arse off around the wings, throwing himself into packs, getting involved and contributing.

Walker doesn't - it shouldn't need to be a coaching directive for him to push up around the flanks or wings if we're struggling to get it past there; he's a pure footballer; Tippett isn't, yet he can figure it out.

We all know he's a freakish talent, probably the best on our list, but until his work-rate picks up, he's not going to fulfil it, and he's going to be incredibly frustrated.

I still can't understand how a guy who apparently has incredible fitness and smashes it on the training track, doesn't seem to do the same on the field.

When it does click for him, he'll win a Coleman.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Christ, you're such a Princess.

Vince was s**t on the weekend.

Walker wasn't worth having on the field.

Otten was crap, you think he's playing as a lock down defender, most people disagree.

Stop indulging yourself with ridiculous hyperbole; very few people have the knives out for Vince, or Otten (he needs a spell, that isn't making him a scape-goat, his form just isn't there), and you can't defend Walker's game on the weekend - unless the 'decoy forward who doesn't put in,' is a new tactic we're trying.

We have numerous smaller players in our side to play the crumbing/roving forward role, we don't need a 194cm/100kg beast doing it.

And we were Tippett-centric, but Walker needs to keep his head up and not stop working if he is making unrewarded leads.

He appeared to decide that Tippett was drawing so much of the ball, that there wasn't much point in him providing an option.

Stop kidding yourself if you believe this board is fair, even or balanced in it's assessment of our players. It's not. Never had been and never will be. The amount of OTT crap that gets posted is ****ing horse s**t and the blame is always placed on 3 or 4 key players.

Did Walker play like s**t? yes he did but he is trying to improve his overall game. Yet we still get the same bullshit. Vince has played 3 out of 4 very good game since the NAB final, yet he still deserves to be dropped according to some. It's the same player fault, every week - with or without reason or justification.

Or some could just say it's a team ****ing effort to win and lose a ****ing game of football rather than saying the same old even if it wasn't true.

 

[King Elvis]

Vince was disappointing last year.

Otten has been disappointing since his return from a knee injury.

Either of those comments over the top?

The amount of OTT crap that gets posted is ****ing horse s**t

Doesn't help when somebody posts 'Walker had a quiet day today,' and you fly off the handle in response.

Vince has played 3 our of 4 very good game since the NAB final, yet he's still deserves to be dropped according to some.

Ignore it?

Comments like that aren't worth addressing - when you fly off the handle in response to them, it can detract from the general discussion.

 

[whitey_1975]

Spot on Jenny. We lost to a likely Grand Finalist, interstate, who had a really good day out. We kicked as bad as any team probably ever has. We had more than 3 quarters of the team play below average. We lost by less than 10 goals... We have a full list to choose from.. I dont think there is too much to worry about at this stage.

Agree with both you and Jenny. He must get stronger on the lead, and use his footy smarts to lead to good places, not in front of Tipps. He needs to as he is the smarter footballer. However what Cap says is still relevant and you acknowledged that, sometimes it gets lost in another sentence that flared the old temper up (I know about that). You guys are both right.
His game on the weekend was below par, but he doesnt deserve to be dropped, unlike probably Otten. Martin, Kerridge, Smith were all below average but deserve a proper run of 3 to 4 games.
I would like to see Shaw in at Ottens expense and find a place for Special J and Lyons for a debut.
As average as Doughty has been this year I am not sure he is the one to miss, Reilly had a quite one, same as Doughty although he has been good in the first two games (dropped to rest not on form). Some interesting decisions but if Sando has some players in the gun, he must reward the good sanfl form of those outside the 25.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

That's kinda my point.

Riewoldt does it, and Tippett is doing it - they force themselves into the game by sheer work-rate. They do a huge amount of un-rewarded running to achieve it, but that's what makes them good.

If the ball isn't coming to Tippett, he goes and gets it. He's on the flanks, running his arse off around the wings, throwing himself into packs, getting involved and contributing.

Walker doesn't - it shouldn't need to be a coaching directive for him to push up around the flanks or wings if we're struggling to get it past there; he's a pure footballer; Tippett isn't, yet he can figure it out.

We all know he's a freakish talent, probably the best on our list, but until his work-rate picks up, he's not going to fulfil it, and he's going to be incredibly frustrated.

I still can't understand how a guy who apparently has incredible fitness and smashes it on the training track, doesn't seem to do the same on the field.

When it does click for him, he'll win a Coleman.

See, this is 100% horseshit.

Last year it was he doesn't chase and tackle, this years it's he doesn't do enough work to get involved and his work rate has dropped off.

Stop insinuating that all he ever does is stay in the goal square, points to the ball carrier and then demands the ball get kicked to him and if he doesn't he has a sulk. That is crap.

He leads up to the wing, center half back and all over the wing to demand the ball. He gets involved. He did it against the GC in round 1 and against the WB in round 2.

Why not ask the question, what happened round 3. Why was his performance so bad? was he injured, was he sick, was he just having a bad day but no - the insinuation was, he plays like that ever ****ing week. That's not true and the primary point of the s**t this board posts.

He had a bad game against Hawthorn, therefore he is s**t against all good sides. Another fanatic hyper-bolt posted that isn't true.

Vince wins the medal, best on ground round 1 and top 5 or 6 round 2. Has a bad game, must be dropped. Get stuffed.

Time for a redcardathon to try and improve the standard of posting and remove the stupidity that some people are allowed to get away with.

 

[crowsarethebest]

The thing with Taylor is that if he doesn't kick goals he's a complete liability out there. Same can't be said for Tippett as he can create goals by making a genuine contest. If Taylor has 0 goals next to his name at the end of a game...you can tell that he was probably one of the worst players on the ground. He needs to learn how to impact a game without kicking sausage rolls. It's a reason why Tippett's a better player at this stage.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Anyway, back on track.

Taken from the Ricky Henderson article in today's paper, Brenton Sanderson talks about this week selection.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sport...ay-not-be-enough/story-e6frecoc-1226331643086

``After a 10-goal loss, you have got to make changes,'' Sanderson said, adding ``we didn't give out too many best-and-fairest votes this week''.

``We had too many passengers, too many guys who didn't give everything they had for the full 120 minutes.

``If you're not in form, then you might be out of the side.''

I guess this will tell if the coaches see Andy Otten being in form or not.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

The thing with Taylor is that if he doesn't kick goals he's a complete liability out there. Same can't be said for Tippett as he can create goals by making a genuine contest. If Taylor has 0 goals next to his name at the end of a game...you can tell that he was probably one of the worst players on the ground. He needs to learn how to impact a game without kicking sausage rolls. It's a reason why Tippett's a better player at this stage.

See, this is another untruth towards Walker.

He gives off goal assists, he lays Sheppard, he dishes off handballs to players running past and he now lays a few tackles to keep the vall in the area. Basically he gets involved. Take the rose coloured glasses off and watch the game and you will see.

 

[crowsarethebest]

See, this is another untruth towards Walker.

He gives off goal assists, he lays Sheppard, he dishes off handballs to players running past and he now lays a few tackles to keep the vall in the area. Basically he gets involved. Take the rose coloured glasses off and watch the game and you will see.

Oh, I've watched him very closely. He does shepherd, he does 'try to tackle' (lets be honest he can't chase for s**t cause athletically he is just very slow) and do the one percecter's but for me he doesn't do it every single time. He picks and chooses when he does these things and that's where my problem with him is. He doesn't do it consistently enough. Cmon, you've got to admit that if Tippett and Walker both had 0 goals to their name that Tippett 9/10 would have the greater impact on the game. I've been a big fan of Taylor's and I've said in the past that he can be a gun. I expect him to be an elite scorer in the comp, he knows where the goals are. However at this stage I just don't think he'll turn into an 'elite' player, he'll just be an elite scorer. It's a shame as I genuinely thought it'd only be a matter of time before he turns into a superstar at AFL level but sadly I don't think it'll ever happen.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Oh, I've watched him very closely. He does shepherd, he does 'try to tackle' (lets be honest he can't chase for s**t cause athletically he is just very slow) and do the one percecter's but for me he doesn't do it every single time. He picks and chooses when he does these things and that's where my problem with him is. He doesn't do it consistently enough. Cmon, you've got to admit that if Tippett and Walker both had 0 goals to their name that Tippett 9/10 would have the greater impact on the game. I've been a big fan of Taylor's and I've said in the past that he can be a gun. I expect him to be an elite scorer in the comp, he knows where the goals are. However at this stage I just don't think he'll turn into an 'elite' player, he'll just be an elite scorer. It's a shame as I genuinely thought it'd only be a matter of time before he turns into a superstar at AFL level but sadly I don't think it'll ever happen.

I guess you've made your mind up.

 

[King Elvis]

See, this is 100% horseshit.

Last year it was he doesn't chase and tackle, this years it's he doesn't do enough work to get involved and his work rate has dropped off.

He had a bad game against Hawthorn, therefore he is s**t against all good sides. Another fanatic hyper-bolt posted that isn't true.

I think I've been pretty consistent in my concerns over his work-rate both offensively and defensively.

Also didn't say the second paragraph, but he will be exposed as a flat track bully, in the long term, if he isn't willing to work harder when things don't go his way.

That's my issue with the Hawthorn game - he didn't work hard enough, it seemed as though he put the cue in the rack because he didn't think it was going to be his day.

I wasn't happy with his Dogs game either, he's better than he showed in that game.

It seems as though, in your opinion, we aren't allowed to be critical of a players performance without it meaning we think the player in question is s**t and has no value or future

I can't say it enough, I rate Walker enormously, I think he's got the potential to win a Coleman, but he frustrates the hell out of me at the moment, because I believe his biggest single weakness is his work-rate - which should be the easiest thing for him to turn around.

On the flipside, I guess this is what it feels like to finally have a Key Position player who actually has potential.

Hawkins, Schoenmakers, Riewoldt, Hendersen are no different; the reason they get some much attention is because they are capable, but they're probably too young, mentally and physically, to fully show it.

 

[Freddy Bassett]

I guess you've made your mind up.

And you have made up yours Alex....