Oppo Camp Delusional Pearlers III

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Zephyr Effekt

Zephyr Effekt

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Mar 23, 2011
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Essendon
Kong said:
To be fair, "Buddy type levels" would mean one absolutely outstanding year followed by 3 or 4 pretty good ones.

Buddy's still not a stain on Lloyd, Lockett, Carey, Dunstall etc.

Heck, he's even for a fair way to catch Richo.
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To bad we cant compare Buddy to those players because the game as changed so much & positions are now irrelevant. :rolleyes:
 

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That's barking mad in my books, but... mmkay.
 
The only downside to trading hurls for buddy is the effect it would have on the other players from a team standpoint. Hurls seems popular among the boys too. As much as you would love buddy I would miss hurley bigtime as I have become quite fond of the polar bear. While judd has been very good even great for carlton its no gaurantee of a premiership when you trade out a very good young player for a star. Hurley wont ever be as good as buddy but he could be just as valuable to us.

Ps if you ever want to troll HAD, buddy is a major weakness just sayin : )
 
BrewSmackerVeiny said:
Pleae ignore my newbness, but some reasons would be delicious....
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But of course (do it in a Connery accent; awesome stuff):

1) Hurley is three years younger than Buddy. Whilst you can't assume anything on the longevity of players, you would to make the determination that the sum output of Buddy, with three years less to play would exceed that of Hurley.
2) Hurley is part of Essendon's leadership group, and has often been touted as a potential future captain. Franklin, whilst being included in the leadership group at Hawthorn is unlikely to be considered as a potential captain at the Hawks.
3) Hurley gets just as much of the ball as Franklin does. What he doesn't do is hit the scoreboard as frequently - and this needs to be worked on.
4) How much would Franklin cost? More than the touted amount we have just signed Hurley for. How much more do you value Franklin's output against Hurley's? Not as much as I'm thinking, thats for sure.
5) Franklin is DRASTICALLY over-rated. A couple of weeks ago I got accused of picking on him after he had a poor game (poor little sobbing Hawthorn princesses; "leave Buddy alone!!" *tears*)- well he just had a good one, can I point out the obvious now? He is an extremely inconsistent player who does not deserve some of the ridiculous levels of praise he recieves - and certainly does not warrant the extreme $'s he would command in this hypothetical trade.
 

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I agree with everything except about him being overrated. The man is a star and a proven finals performer, yes he is inconsistent but its not as bad as you think it is, you dont often see him have really poor games like cyril for example. But everything else you are correct especially about the cost off getting him and not just financially.
 
vast said:
I agree with everything except about him being overrated. The man is a star and a proven finals performer, yes he is inconsistent but its not as bad as you think it is, you dont often see him have really poor games like cyril for example. But everything else you are correct especially about the cost off getting him and not just financially.
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No doubt, let me qualify the statement about his abilities - he is a VERY good player. Certainly one of the best forwards going around today (arguably the best) and a potentially game winning performer.

BUT he is NOT this messianic superstar that some (not all) Hawks fans would like to believe. The entire reason this long, multi-thread crap keeps going on was because I blasphemed in expressing the opinion that I would much prefer to keep Hurley than trade him for Franklin when the relative abilities and consequences of the trade are considered.

Responses started out with the typical "LOL" and so on; but as I offered rational reason after rational reason as to why I would not make this trade (and people DON'T have to agree with me BTW), they got angrier and angrier. I couldn't possibly be serious that I value a small number of players at Essendon enough that I consider them 'untradable', even for the GREAT and MAGNIFICENT Buddy Franklin. A man so awesome he craps the Hudson's and Coleman's of the world.

Not that you can compare Hudson and Coleman to Franklin, because they were 'different' players to Buddy (so the stats don't count). And yeah, can't compare him to Lloyd (cause he was a full forward and that's unfair) or Richo (who because he played in a poorer side than Buddy was the constant focal point)........ delusional - and exactly why I started this thread. :D
 
jade_00 said:
But of course (do it in a Connery accent; awesome stuff):

1) Hurley is three years younger than Buddy. Whilst you can't assume anything on the longevity of players, you would to make the determination that the sum output of Buddy, with three years less to play would exceed that of Hurley.
2) Hurley is part of Essendon's leadership group, and has often been touted as a potential future captain. Franklin, whilst being included in the leadership group at Hawthorn is unlikely to be considered as a potential captain at the Hawks.
3) Hurley gets just as much of the ball as Franklin does. What he doesn't do is hit the scoreboard as frequently - and this needs to be worked on.
4) How much would Franklin cost? More than the touted amount we have just signed Hurley for. How much more do you value Franklin's output against Hurley's? Not as much as I'm thinking, thats for sure.
5) Franklin is DRASTICALLY over-rated. A couple of weeks ago I got accused of picking on him after he had a poor game (poor little sobbing Hawthorn princesses; "leave Buddy alone!!" *tears*)- well he just had a good one, can I point out the obvious now? He is an extremely inconsistent player who does not deserve some of the ridiculous levels of praise he recieves - and certainly does not warrant the extreme $'s he would command in this hypothetical trade.
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I just discovered this thread and boy is the irony deeeeeellllliiiiiiicccccccccciouuuuusssssss.

Franklin does everything better than Hurley at the moment.

And why do you lie so much anyway? Hurley gets just as much of the ball as Buddy does? Franklin 19.6 possessions a game, Hurley 13.6 possessions a game. LOL.

Anyway Franklin is:

#1 in the comp for goals
#1 in the comp for score assists
#1 in the comp for goal assists
#1 in the comp for score involvements
#1 amongst KPF for tackles
#1 amongst KPF for disposals
#1 in the comp for shots on goal
#5 in the comp for contested marks

He is smashing Hurley and all other KPFs in pretty much every facet of the game. He is not just doing things well, but he's pretty much leading the whole comp in nearly every important category for a KPF and you say he is inconsistent? I mean, dude, what more can he do? He's on the way to winning more All Australians, more Coleman medals and more big games than Michael Hurely could only dream about. it's time to admit you're wrong. Lying about stats and things that happen is not a good look.

And lol at Kong saying Buddy has played 3 pretty good years. He was top 3 in the comp last year according to most people and polled 20 brownlow votes from 19 games, all whilst averaging 18 touches a game whilst kicking 82 goals. Irony is deeelllliiiicccccccious.
 
Kong said:
This sentance alone is ironic in itself.

You've posted in this thread before, under an alias, telling us all how cool HAD was in real life and how everybody wanted to be like him, remember? :thumbsu:
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:) Did I? I can't actually remember that. I was probably drinking.
 
Didn't you know though, Kong? Necromancer Beth is actually an 18 year old girl who has never heard of this mysterious PassiveAgressiveDonk character.
 
Necromancer Beth said:
I just discovered this thread and boy is the irony deeeeeellllliiiiiiicccccccccciouuuuusssssss.

Franklin does everything better than Hurley at the moment.

And why do you lie so much anyway? Hurley gets just as much of the ball as Buddy does? Franklin 19.6 possessions a game, Hurley 13.6 possessions a game. LOL.
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Hurley has a career average of 14.9 disposals a game against Franklins 15.0.

Marks, both at 5.3pg

Franklin substantially higher goals pg - so basically exactly what I said.

See, here it is:

jade_00 said:
3) Hurley gets just as much of the ball as Franklin does. What he doesn't do is hit the scoreboard as frequently - and this needs to be worked on.
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Am I to understand, that after screeching like stuck pigs when I questioned his output after a poor game, you now want to talk about his stats after a good game? :D

Necromancer Beth said:
Anyway Franklin is:

#1 in the comp for goals
#1 in the comp for score assists
#1 in the comp for goal assists
#1 in the comp for score involvements
#1 amongst KPF for tackles
#1 amongst KPF for disposals
#1 in the comp for shots on goal
#5 in the comp for contested marks

He is smashing Hurley and all other KPFs in pretty much every facet of the game. He is not just doing things well, but he's pretty much leading the whole comp in nearly every important category for a KPF and you say he is inconsistent? I mean, dude, what more can he do? He's on the way to winning more All Australians, more Coleman medals and more big games than Michael Hurely could only dream about. it's time to admit you're wrong. Lying about stats and things that happen is not a good look.
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Wait, wait. You mean to tell me Buddy is the best forward in the game today?

How did I miss that!?

No wait:

jade_00 said:
No doubt, let me qualify the statement about his abilities - he is a VERY good player. Certainly one of the best forwards going around today (arguably the best) and a potentially game winning performer.
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Who is more foolish, the troll, or the troll who trolls him?
 
Lord Nicholson said:
Who is more foolish, the troll, or the troll who trolls him?
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Personally, I think the troll who trolls the troll, who is trolling the troll, is worse than both.
 
jade_00 said:
Hurley has a career average of 14.9 disposals a game against Franklins 15.0.

Marks, both at 5.3pg

Franklin substantially higher goals pg - so basically exactly what I said.
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The way you make it sound is that Hurley is as good as Franklin at everything bar kicking goals.

Franklin is superior at contested marking ( yes he is taking double the cm's Hurley is this year ), tackles way more than Hurley, sets up more scores and goals than anyone in the comp etc etc etc. So according to your logic, once Hurley starts doubling and tripling his output in these categories, he might be close to the "extremely inconsistent and drastically overrated" player Lance Franklin is. Oh, he will also have to start ripping it up in big games like Buddy has. Kicking bags of 7s & 8s in finals, kicking great finals goals at crunch times and all that. Maybe then he will be close to the drastically overrated Lance Franklin. I really hope you can see the irony of the thread title here.
 
Kong said:
Haha, jade_00, if you came to me with some of the stuff that you post towards others, I would probably have added you to the ignore list by now. :p
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He's bad but not as bad as Call me Cake.

The difference between most trolls and Call Me Cake is that most people just take the piss. CMC actually believes what he posts and he is usually more wrong and more opinionated than a right-wing shock jock from Sydney.
 
Necromancer Beth said:
The way you make it sound is that Hurley is as good as Franklin at everything bar kicking goals.

Franklin is superior at contested marking ( yes he is taking double the cm's Hurley is this year ), tackles way more than Hurley, sets up more scores and goals than anyone in the comp etc etc etc. So according to your logic, once Hurley starts doubling and tripling his output in these categories, he might be close to the "extremely inconsistent and drastically overrated" player Lance Franklin is. Oh, he will also have to start ripping it up in big games like Buddy has. Kicking bags of 7s & 8s in finals, kicking great finals goals at crunch times and all that. Maybe then he will be close to the drastically overrated Lance Franklin. I really hope you can see the irony of the thread title here.
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I don't think you are missing it, because you aren't an idiot - but I have never disputed that Franklin was a better player. I must admit though, I do take a great deal of delight in recalling a couple of newspaper articles a few years back (and the accompanying dribble from Hawthorn fans) that were proclaiming him as possibly the greatest player in the game's history. The bloke isn't even the best forward of the last 20 years let alone the best player in history. Of course, that is an obvious statement now.

I've offered several good reasons as to why I would not trade Hurley for Franklin - all of which you have chosen to ignore to mash the keyboard with what is effectively "BUT FRANKLIN IS A BETTER PLAYER LOL". Yeah...... do you want me to re-quote the numerous posts where I have said the same thing? Or do you want to try addressing some of the rational reasons I presented for not liking this hypothetical trade.

I love your use of this years stats though - very compelling argument. Franklin clearly has it all over Hurley.

Let's talk about Watson and Hodge. I'm sure you'll find it enlightening.
 
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