Discussion on Pick #14 - Jake Lever

[headache1]

This is where we miss Otten & Shaw

If Shaw could ever get his body right, he could be a decent match up for the Stringer types. I tend to think he'd slaughter Otten though. Not because I think Otten is no good, but I just don't think he'd be able to keep up with Stringer.

 

[MRB37]

We need another inside midfielder (Gore) ........sure of course we did

Then again not convinced we needed Wigg either .....but looking at the final draft there's no-one else i would have preferred

I thought we should have taken a look at Oscar McDonald, who's a 197cm, 94kg defender (younger brother of Melbourne's Tom McDonald). Everyone tipped him to go to Melbourne at 25 or the Bullies at 26 and he slipped all the way to #53 and we passed him with the Wigg and McGovern picks. They might not have wanted to go for 2 key defenders with the first 2 picks and figured we'd have the spot covered with just Lever.

Still, at least Wigg does have a good kick with his left boot, so they may have gone into the pick thinking he was the one guy left who had genuine weapon to his game and could develop the rest of his game from there.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

If Shaw could ever get his body right, he could be a decent match up for the Stringer types. I tend to think he'd slaughter Otten though. Not because I think Otten is no good, but I just don't think he'd be able to keep up with Stringer.

Stringer beat Hartigan by smarts ...not pace

He just looked quicker because Hartigan is so slow of thought .....Stringer is not a quick player

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I thought we should have taken a look at Oscar McDonald, who's a 197cm, 94kg defender (younger brother of Melbourne's Tom McDonald). Everyone tipped him to go to Melbourne at 25 or the Bullies at 26 and he slipped all the way to #53 and we passed him with the Wigg and McGovern picks. They might not have wanted to go for 2 key defenders with the first 2 picks and figured we'd have the spot covered with just Lever.

Still, at least Wigg does have a good kick with his left boot, so they may have gone into the pick thinking he was the one guy left who had genuine weapon to his game and could develop the rest of his game from there.

Loved the Mich McGovern pick which was only a handful of picks later ......and Dear

Yes we could have gone another tall but probably Wigg was ultimately best available at that pick

 

[NTRabbit]

Yeah, we don't need any kpp defenders...

Jake stringer fluked his 6 goals...

We win the midfield with pace and precision, and what Stringer does or doesn't do is irrelevant.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

We win the midfield with pace and precision, and what Stringer does or doesn't do is irrelevant.

So do you think we have more of a list problem with our midfield or kpp defenders?

Keep on digging...

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Stringer beat Hartigan by smarts ...not pace

He just looked quicker because Hartigan is so slow of thought .....Stringer is not a quick player

Which is why we missed Cheney!

 

[Cleric]

Kelly IMO will be the Crows version of Collingwoods Alan Toovey .....not gifted, certainly not footy sexy but ....

Listening to Bickley talk about him he said that he doesnt have too much skill or talent but he goes in hard and gives everything.

 

[Red mist]

If Shaw could ever get his body right, he could be a decent match up for the Stringer types. I tend to think he'd slaughter Otten though. Not because I think Otten is no good, but I just don't think he'd be able to keep up with Stringer.

Agree. Otten wouldn't be able to deal with Stringer. No way.

 

[Cleric]

Wouldn't it be irrelevant since we rated Wigg ahead of Gore at the time of the draft?

Its always fun to pit your thoughts on young talent against the clubs. Not in hindsight, but before the bounce so to speak.
For 2 years I have been saying Siggins wont make it. Hamish and co thought he would. Its all apart of being a football follower.

 

[headache1]

Stringer beat Hartigan by smarts ...not pace

He just looked quicker because Hartigan is so slow of thought .....Stringer is not a quick player

He doesn't have electrifying pace by any means, but for his size, he's not slow, and he is quite agile. Otten was slow, and wasn't overly agile before any of his knee injuries, and I can't see him returning any quicker than he was before his latest one unfortunately.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

He doesn't have electrifying pace by any means, but for his size, he's not slow, and he is quite agile. Otten was slow, and wasn't overly agile before any of his knee injuries, and I can't see him returning any quicker than he was before his latest one unfortunately.

Still a better player than hartigan though as has footy smarts.

Hope hartigan learns to play better within his limitations & finds his confidence.

 

[NTRabbit]

So do you think we have more of a list problem with our midfield or kpp defenders?

We absolutely do, and this has been evident for a few years. Anyone saying otherwise is living in a fantasy land - our midfield has just three A graders in it in Dangerfield, Sloane and Smith, and Smith still spends half his time on the back flank. Beyond that we've got nobody else coming through who will be anything more than a Richard Douglas or Tyson Edwards level support act, just a fading Scott Thompson.

Insert genuine additional quality into our midfield and who we have as a partner for Talia becomes irrelevant so long as they can do the fundamentals.

Look at all the recent premiers, who have Hawthorn had in defence? Sydney? They've all been built on powerful midfields, even Geelong with Scarlett and Taylor were operating in luxury land due to their midfield rather than relying on them both.

 

[headache1]

Still a better player than hartigan though as has footy smarts.

Hope hartigan learns to play better within his limitations & finds his confidence.

No, I can't see Otten giving Stringer roughly 5 metres of space when the ball is coming into the forward line.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

We absolutely do, and this has been evident for a few years. Anyone saying otherwise is living in a fantasy land - our midfield has just three A graders in it in Dangerfield, Sloane and Smith, and Smith still spends half his time on the back flank. Beyond that we've got nobody else coming through who will be anything more than a Richard Douglas or Tyson Edwards level support act, just a fading Scott Thompson.

Insert genuine additional quality into our midfield and who we have as a partner for Talia becomes irrelevant so long as they can do the fundamentals.

Ok, hawks got it wrong chasing Gibson, then lake, then frawley.

They should have persisted with schoenmakers

 

[Red mist]

We absolutely do, and this has been evident for a few years. Anyone saying otherwise is living in a fantasy land - our midfield has just three A graders in it in Dangerfield, Sloane and Smith, and Smith still spends half his time on the back flank. Beyond that we've got nobody else coming through who will be anything more than a Richard Douglas or Tyson Edwards level support act, just a fading Scott Thompson.

Insert genuine additional quality into our midfield and who we have as a partner for Talia becomes irrelevant so long as they can do the fundamentals.

Look at all the recent premiers, who have Hawthorn had in defence? Sydney? They've all been built on powerful midfields, even Geelong with Scarlett and Taylor were operating in luxury land due to their midfield rather than relying on them both.

Height and speed. These two are key IMO. Look what the top 4 teams mid fields are like. All over 190 odd.

 

[NTRabbit]

Ok, hawks got it wrong chasing Gibson, then lake, then frawley.

They should have persisted with schoenmakers

You only need one decent KPD to be a bulwark in those minutes when the midfield loses focus; Hawthorn did not have one, so went and got one in Lake, and it worked well for them. Lake is going to retire end of this season, so they went and got a replacement in Frawley. Schoenmakers is completely irrelevant to this discussion, as is Gibson considering he is not now nor has he ever been a KPD.

In the mean time they won their premierships with their midfield.

 

[Paladin]

We absolutely do, and this has been evident for a few years. Anyone saying otherwise is living in a fantasy land - our midfield has just three A graders in it in Dangerfield, Sloane and Smith, and Smith still spends half his time on the back flank. Beyond that we've got nobody else coming through who will be anything more than a Richard Douglas or Tyson Edwards level support act, just a fading Scott Thompson.

Insert genuine additional quality into our midfield and who we have as a partner for Talia becomes irrelevant so long as they can do the fundamentals.

Look at all the recent premiers, who have Hawthorn had in defence? Sydney? They've all been built on powerful midfields, even Geelong with Scarlett and Taylor were operating in luxury land due to their midfield rather than relying on them both.

Well your very wrong about our midfield. B.Crouch will be the best of the lot - nearly is already when he is on the park.

 

[rossi]

Bock

They asked for someone who wasn't a prick.

 

[SydCrow]

We absolutely do, and this has been evident for a few years. Anyone saying otherwise is living in a fantasy land - our midfield has just three A graders in it in Dangerfield, Sloane and Smith, and Smith still spends half his time on the back flank. Beyond that we've got nobody else coming through who will be anything more than a Richard Douglas or Tyson Edwards level support act, just a fading Scott Thompson.

Insert genuine additional quality into our midfield and who we have as a partner for Talia becomes irrelevant so long as they can do the fundamentals.

Look at all the recent premiers, who have Hawthorn had in defence? Sydney? They've all been built on powerful midfields, even Geelong with Scarlett and Taylor were operating in luxury land due to their midfield rather than relying on them both.

B Crouch

 

[Rory Walkerfield]

Well your very wrong about our midfield. B.Crouch will be the best of the lot - nearly is already when he is on the park.

Obvious issue here.

 

[Paladin]

B Crouch

Matt will be a ripper as well - can hardly say we just have support acts coming through.

 

[Mattrox]

We win the midfield with pace and precision, and what Stringer does or doesn't do is irrelevant.

You can never win the midfield 100% of games. And when you do lose that aspect, you must defend and rebound.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Ok, hawks got it wrong chasing Gibson, then lake, then frawley.

They should have persisted with schoenmakers

If we he had Hodge, Mitchell, Lewis, Hill, Riolo, Smith... running through our midfield then yeah sure, let's tidy up that defence

 

[NTRabbit]

Well your very wrong about our midfield. B.Crouch will be the best of the lot - nearly is already when he is on the park.

No, he won't

B Crouch

Brad Crouch has a ceiling of the Douglas/Edwards variety. Good support act, but still leaves us needing genuine A graders.

Matt Crouch is the same as CEY, or Lyons, or any of a number of midfielders - honest days work in their specialty, which is certainly what you want, but enough deficiencies to mean they'll always be in the bottom half of your midfield group.

You can never win the midfield 100% of games. And when you do lose that aspect, you must defend and rebound.

One quality KPD and some good ball users in the back half able to hold them off until the midfield regains the ascendancy is enough. If ou keep spending on more and better defenders at the expense of midfield, you're never going to have enough midfield control for long enough to be an actual premiership contender.

Remember when we had the best KPD duo in the league in Rutten and Bock at their prime, a great balance of stopping power and rebound? How well did that work for us against the superior West Coast midfield in those prelims?