Do the Liberals have any good policies?

[Maggie5]

When did I ever blame the Senate, its doing its job by acting as the House of Review for proposed legislation. I also have no issue with the federal government negotiating with senators to pass legislation, given that this forms part of the review process.

Okay, take back, blame. Just that is who the Government blames, or Labor.
Why do they have to 'battle' their policies through the Senate?

 

[Redalert]

Okay, take back, blame. Just that is who the Government blames, or Labor.
Why do they have to 'battle' their policies through the Senate?

Because the Senate is composed of a Greens/Labor voting bloc and independents. To pass legislation the federal government needs to gain the approval of either Labors/Greens or 6 of the 8 independents. This is difficult because the Labor/Greens generally oppose government bills unless they reach an agreement with the government, leaving the it to negotiate with the remaining independents, who have become increasingly fractured following the splintering of the Palmer United Party.

It becomes a battle in the sense that the federal government has to satisfy a range of interests to get most legislation passed, which is partially why it struggled to enact a lot of what it proposed during its last 1.5 years in government. I'm not trying to comment on the validity of what they proposed (it may have been correctly knocked back, depending on your opinion), but rather that it is difficult for them to pass any legislation whatsoever.

 

[Maggie5]

Because the Senate is composed of a Greens/Labor voting bloc and independents. To pass legislation the federal government needs to gain the approval of either Labors/Greens or 6 of the 8 independents. This is difficult because the Labor/Greens generally oppose government bills unless they reach an agreement with the government, leaving the it to negotiate with the remaining independents, who have become increasingly fractured following the splintering of the Palmer United Party.

It becomes a battle in the sense that the federal government has to satisfy a range of interests to get most legislation passed, which is partially why it struggled to enact a lot of what it proposed during its last 1.5 years in government. I'm not trying to comment on the validity of what they proposed (it may have been correctly knocked back, depending on your opinion), but rather that it is difficult for them to pass any legislation whatsoever.

But you see the real issue is the one you are not commenting on: the validity of what they propose.
I seriously don't believe the Senate is any real problem for any government (see past governments) to pass legislation through the Senate if the policies are are valid and for the greater good of Australians.

 

[Redalert]

But you see the real issue is the one you are not commenting on: the validity of what they propose.
I seriously don't believe the Senate is any real problem for any government (see past governments) to pass legislation through the Senate if the policies are are valid and for the greater good of Australians.

The validity of what they propose is subjective, whether you think its a good policy will vary considerably depending on who you ask and which side of politics you sit. The point I'm making is that its irrelevant, the Coalition could put forward the greatest policy in the world and they'd still have trouble satisfying the interests of the independents/Labor.

 

[Maggie5]

The validity of what they propose is subjective, whether you think its a good policy will vary considerably depending on who you ask and which side of politics you sit. The point I'm making is that its irrelevant, the Coalition could put forward the greatest policy in the world and they'd still have trouble satisfying the interests of the independents/Labor.

Agree to disagree.
If I were in power and knew that I had a policy that was not going to be acceptable to a majority, I would try and negotiate with those that I could convince (Independents)or changes that would swing them. I would do this before it went to the Senate and before the media really got hold of it.
This is a poor government with little foresight.

 

[Maggie5]

http://www.theguardian.com/australi...-be-exempt-from-tax-regulation-says-coalition
OMG Can this government get any more stupid?
Private companies such as those controlled by the billionaire mining magnateGina Rinehart will be exempt from new laws requiring the publication of their tax information because of fears this could jeopardise their safety and possibly lead to kidnappings.

What country am I in? Mexico? Colombia? Or am I on the ocean and there are pirates around?
As if people can't guess what the likes of Gina or Clive are making?
Anyway you would need a crane to kidnap either of them.
No wonder the public don't trust this government.

 

[Ice-Wolf]

http://www.theguardian.com/australi...-be-exempt-from-tax-regulation-says-coalition
OMG Can this government get any more stupid?
Private companies such as those controlled by the billionaire mining magnateGina Rinehart will be exempt from new laws requiring the publication of their tax information because of fears this could jeopardise their safety and possibly lead to kidnappings.

What country am I in? Mexico? Colombia? Or am I on the ocean and there are pirates around?
As if people can't guess what the likes of Gina or Clive are making?
Anyway you would need a crane to kidnap either of them.
No wonder the public don't trust this government.

Here is some other stupidity about it, if someone were looking at kidnapping/ransom targets now they could just choose from the high profile private companies that are exempt.

EDIT: This s**t is purely to protect the rich from public criticism of the amount of tax they actually pay.

 

[madmug]

http://www.theguardian.com/australi...-be-exempt-from-tax-regulation-says-coalition
OMG Can this government get any more stupid?
Private companies such as those controlled by the billionaire mining magnateGina Rinehart will be exempt from new laws requiring the publication of their tax information because of fears this could jeopardise their safety and possibly lead to kidnappings.

What country am I in? Mexico? Colombia? Or am I on the ocean and there are pirates around?
As if people can't guess what the likes of Gina or Clive are making?
Anyway you would need a crane to kidnap either of them.
No wonder the public don't trust this government.

Haha!

Made me think. How would it be if we came up with a policy that would assist the nations budget, health & tax those two tubbies. How about a fat tax?

All at once we would attack the obesity epidemic, diabetes, heart disease, arthritis, knee replacements etc, etc. It would assist the budget 'bottom' line & get people healthier which would reduce the pressure on the health system all at the same time!!

 

[Ratts of Tobruk]

The validity of what they propose is subjective, whether you think its a good policy will vary considerably depending on who you ask and which side of politics you sit. The point I'm making is that its irrelevant, the Coalition could put forward the greatest policy in the world and they'd still have trouble satisfying the interests of the independents/Labor.

Traditionally and in this parliament the Senate has passed policies for which there is a mandate. The majority of the Coalition's policies weren't mentioned prior to the election.

How would it be if we came up with a policy that would assist the nations budget, health & tax those two tubbies. How about a fat tax?

All at once we would attack the obesity epidemic, diabetes, heart disease, arthritis, knee replacements etc, etc. It would assist the budget 'bottom' line & get people healthier which would reduce the pressure on the health system all at the same time!!

It'd have to be a pretty big tax to stop sugar-and-water or sugar-and-water-and-grain from being cheap. I don't think behavioural change would really be achieved through a 'fat tax' since there are already large disincentives to being fat. It's not a bad time to introduce one, however, since the major Fast Food joints are already in decline through consumer choice with $10+ meal places seeming to do better than the $2 snack menu places.

Should we spend hundreds of billions on defence and new submarines, jet fighters, patrol boats, planes, helicopters, drones and bombs or should we increase our foreign aid and actively assist in disaster relief, building infrastructure, improving health and education, moving people out of poverty, and emancipating women?

Should we spend billions persecuting asylum seekers or should we join the global effort to offer displaced people fleeing war and oppression hope, safety, and a new life?

Should we be pursuing people on welfare or corporate tax evaders?

Should we be removing regulations on gambling, food labelling, alcohol and tobacco or should we be putting the health of our citizens in front of profits for international corporations and the taxation or donations they give to government and politicians?

Should we be building more roads or investing in public transport and high speed rail?

The answer to all these is we should do both, although we are already helping displaced peoples in a significant way, 'boatpeople' aside, and we should only target those on welfare who are taking advantage of the system.

Should we be making university education more expensive while we hand over a fortune to “private colleges”?

Should we be cutting wages to aged care and child care workers and defence personnel when the base pay of a federal parliamentarian has grown more than 250 per cent since 1991 with a 31 per cent pay increase awarded to parliamentarians in 2012?

Should we be spending tens of millions to “raise awareness” of domestic violence while closing refuges and defunding support groups and legal aid?

And I'd answer all these 'no', while suggesting that public sector workers seem to get paid pretty well to me.

 

[Redalert]

Traditionally and in this parliament the Senate has passed policies for which there is a mandate. The majority of the Coalition's policies weren't mentioned prior to the election.

Such as? All I can think of is the carbon tax, and that was only achieved because the PUP was united enough to reach a consensus.

 

[madmug]

Traditionally and in this parliament the Senate has passed policies for which there is a mandate. The majority of the Coalition's policies weren't mentioned prior to the election.

It'd have to be a pretty big tax to stop sugar-and-water or sugar-and-water-and-grain from being cheap. I don't think behavioural change would really be achieved through a 'fat tax' since there are already large disincentives to being fat. It's not a bad time to introduce one, however, since the major Fast Food joints are already in decline through consumer choice with $10+ meal places seeming to do better than the $2 snack menu places.

The answer to all these is we should do both, although we are already helping displaced peoples in a significant way, 'boatpeople' aside, and we should only target those on welfare who are taking advantage of the system.

And I'd answer all these 'no', while suggesting that public sector workers seem to get paid pretty well to me.

Centrelink have been targeting any free riders on welfare for years. The problem with the coalitions 'targeting' of the welfare cost is they simply vilified everyone who is on benefit. I've seen older people who feel worthless & are worried because its all they've got. After years of work, they had almost no super as they had no opportunity to get super until Keating started it off.

Young kids want work. Where is a jobs policy??????

Why couldnt he have target those people who get a pension despite having a couple of million in super & a 3million dollar house. Thats where the welfare $ is being wasted.

His attack on medicare is also a disgrace. Our GP system is very efficient. It filters out a lot of cases that would have ended up in expensive hospital stays.

Its the rash of lifestyle diseases which is costing us & stressing the medical system out. Smoking, drugs, alcohol, s**t food, heart disease, lung disease, diabetes, obesity causing arthritis etc etc etc are the real causes of rising costs. How about honestly facing that reality.

Abbott is all about class warfare. Plain & simple.

 

[Ratts of Tobruk]

Such as? All I can think of is the carbon tax, and that was only achieved because the PUP was united enough to reach a consensus.

All you can think of is the Carbon Tax? How did you miss the slogans about the mining tax and stopping the boats?

Carbon Tax and MRRT repeals and Asylum Seeker rule changes were passed with help from the Independents and PUP (PUP only had 3 senators, Muir was only half with them to begin with). FBT changes and NBN changes were other relatively high profile policies pre-election, but the Senate doesn't vote on everything and things like the NDIS and Gonski were bi-partisan. The PPL was never introduced to parliament.

 

[Gough]

http://www.theguardian.com/australi...-be-exempt-from-tax-regulation-says-coalition
OMG Can this government get any more stupid?
Private companies such as those controlled by the billionaire mining magnateGina Rinehart will be exempt from new laws requiring the publication of their tax information because of fears this could jeopardise their safety and possibly lead to kidnappings.

What country am I in? Mexico? Colombia? Or am I on the ocean and there are pirates around?
As if people can't guess what the likes of Gina or Clive are making?
Anyway you would need a crane to kidnap either of them.
No wonder the public don't trust this government.

It's not like the BRW Rich list doesn't exist. Two words sum up this government perfectly; crony capitalism.

 

[Xsess]

Because the Senate is composed of a Greens/Labor voting bloc and independents. To pass legislation the federal government needs to gain the approval of either Labors/Greens or 6 of the 8 independents. This is difficult because the Labor/Greens generally oppose government bills unless they reach an agreement with the government, leaving the it to negotiate with the remaining independents, who have become increasingly fractured following the splintering of the Palmer United Party.

It becomes a battle in the sense that the federal government has to satisfy a range of interests to get most legislation passed, which is partially why it struggled to enact a lot of what it proposed during its last 1.5 years in government. I'm not trying to comment on the validity of what they proposed (it may have been correctly knocked back, depending on your opinion), but rather that it is difficult for them to pass any legislation whatsoever.

Labor is engaged in a scorched earth policy. Using the senate to block crucial budget reform so that it can blame Abbott for the resultant fiscal disaster. Moral equivalent of the unions sabotage of the war effort in WWII.

 

[Ice-Wolf]

Labor is engaged in a scorched earth policy. Using the senate to block crucial budget reform so that it can blame Abbott for the resultant fiscal disaster. Moral equivalent of the unions sabotage of the war effort in WWII.

You mean like how it's right-wing bullshit?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-12-11/stanley-australias-secret-and-unhistorical-war/5960090

 

[Todman]

OMG Can this government get any more stupid?
Private companies such as those controlled by the billionaire mining magnateGina Rinehart will be exempt from new laws requiring the publication of their tax information because of fears this could jeopardise their safety and possibly lead to kidnappings.

Private companies accounts are that they're private: only the taxman can request access to the accounts. How would you like it if everybody's tax records are made public? Thats what you are impling if you want equality. If an individual has a private family company you want their details made public but if they don't then they could remain anonymous.

 

[Maggie5]

Private companies accounts are that they're private: only the taxman can request access to the accounts. How would you like it if everybody's tax records are made public? Thats what you are impling if you want equality. If an individual has a private family company you want their details made public but if they don't then they could remain anonymous.

Wouldn't mind if I earned over $100 million. In fact don't really care if they see it now either.

 

[Todman]

You mean like how it's right-wing bullshit?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-12-11/stanley-australias-secret-and-unhistorical-war/5960090

If you read the comments from the people on the ground at the time of the war they tend to disagree with Prof Stanley.
Union were smart enough not to write it down.

 

[Todman]

Wouldn't mind if I earned over $100 million. In fact don't really care if they see it now either.

You can earn $100 million if you set your mind to it.

 

[Maggie5]

You can earn $100 million if you set your mind to it.

Too late, not at my age and health sadly.
Still, doing some unpaid work for family though, got to keep those grey cells healthy .

 

[Xsess]

Still, doing some unpaid work for family though

How does posting endless Getup propoganda on BigFooty help your family?

 

[Xsess]

EDIT: This s**t is purely to protect the rich from public criticism of the amount of tax they actually pay.

How the left love to scream about the rich ignoring that all the heavy lifters taxation wise are in the top 20% who pay 70% of tax while 50% of Australians are net welfare beneficiaries. Without the rich where would your pay come from? Hint - its not from the lazy masses who always have there hand out for more...

 

[Maggie5]

How does posting endless Getup propoganda on BigFooty help your family?

They make the coffee, I stir the sugar.

 

[Todman]

They make the coffee, I stir the sugar.

give up the sugar, it's bad for you.

 

[Slax]

The validity of what they propose is subjective, whether you think its a good policy will vary considerably depending on who you ask and which side of politics you sit. The point I'm making is that its irrelevant, the Coalition could put forward the greatest policy in the world and they'd still have trouble satisfying the interests of the independents/Labor.

This is the biggest load of crap I've read in a long, long time. As has been seen time and again if you put forward good policy it will get through the Senate, plenty of governments have had to deal with a hostile Senate and still had no trouble passing legislation. The problem here is that there is NO good legislation coming from the Liberal party.

The lack of policies on a number of issues is alarming. The whole way of dealing with the budget crisis is purely to slash spending, but the fact is we need to increase revenue markedly as well.

The remaining manufacturing industry in this country is about to collapse with the impending closure of the automotive industry, there is no plan on how to effectively deal with massive job losses which will come from this. No instead we tell one of the remaining large manufacturing industries in the shipbuilding that they are not even being considered for a massive government tender that would provide much needed jobs. Abbott has NO employment or training plan, unemployment will continue to rise and such more funds out of the budget.

We lack any environment policy.

We have a government not interested in developing new business opportunities into developing industries. This is shown by a complete snub for anything IT with the cheap crap NBN version. Government support is so hard to get it costs nearly as much to get as you receive.