Eastern FL - Division 2 2017

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Haha, I am staggered fatside hasn't appeared, he was always good for material. Mustn't know about this place


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I see a bloke who works with much and he's battling apparently. I was one to hang a lot of s**t on him, but I hope he gets better soon. Think there's a few more mental scars than physical ones he's battling.
 
Still here boys - Been on BF for a while when talking about Qld footy - you guys know sweet FA about that end of Australia.. :). This forum is obviously a lot quieter and we don't discuss anything but the actual division. Liked talking about stuff such as Neale Daniher and his issues - remarkable man and then Open Mike with Wally Eustace - that was heart breaking but up lifting at the same time. Funny week in footy I thought.
 
Can anyone tell me why there is only one game this weekend. Obviously First Div wouldn't play due to the Metro game representitives, but why don't Div 3 and 4 play this weekend and have their rest next round. That way you could still go and see a local game somewhere reasonably close.
 
Not sure it will be that great a game unfortunately Cliff - the Vic Metro should win by 10+ goals if fair dinkum. The QAFL side will be alright but a number of blokes not playing for various reasons and the comp is nowhere near as strong as say EFL Div 1 let alone a combined side of metro comps.
 
As you know bob, very vague on efl footy. Was surprised though after watching parts of 2 games last month just how small the grounds actually are (Balwyn, Blackburn) compared to up this way. Makes for good contested footy.
 
smy1305 said:
Not sure it will be that great a game unfortunately Cliff - the Vic Metro should win by 10+ goals if fair dinkum. The QAFL side will be alright but a number of blokes not playing for various reasons and the comp is nowhere near as strong as say EFL Div 1 let alone a combined side of metro comps.
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And so it was to be - 14 goals to the Metro side and they look like they could have won by 20 if they had kicked straight. Was a silly idea - obviously someone from up here thought the QAFL is a far better comp than it actually is or has no idea of the relative strength of the Vic comps.
Would suggest QAFL is no better than Div 2 EFL actually.
 
Spot on FS. I can't believe how some of those kicks missed in the last quarter. Big ground with even bigger goal posts. Were there many at the ground, looking from the webcast it didn't look to be many at all. Umpiring was good though.
 

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Umpiring up here is pretty good actually Cliff at the higher standards - all guys aspiring to be at AFL level and generally pretty young. Yeah it is a big ground Burpengary - you would be pleased to know that it was built for $15 million a couple of years back with a large % coming from AFL coffers.. :D
 
Guys and Girls umpiring as well FS. I'm not sure if she is the same girl who umpired the EFL and WRFL game a a couple of months ago. Looked a bit like her.
 
Not sure if you guys have seen the comments of the East Burwood president in the local Leader lamenting current player remuneration levels. I need to declare I am a VAFA man and not entirely across the intricacies of the EFL, other than knowing it is an outstanding competition.

The comments of the EB president left me a touch perplexed as the apparent indifference towards excessive player payments did not stop them offering big $ to a number of our senior players pre the 2014 season. We had already been gutted by paying comps and thankfully most of those approached by EB knocked back the offers. EB did however settle on a couple of fringe players and promised match payments that any reasonable person would consider to be way over the odds. Despite what Mr. Peak says this had nothing to do with “players’ assessment of their own abilities being exaggerated” it was entirely about them contacting players with no links to their club and making them offers.

Undaunted EB came back again this pre-season and made very generous (read ridiculous) offers to a couple of our best young players. Perhaps the fact that the two blokes they lured across last season (now back at our club) had not yet been paid made the decision to resit the offers a bit easier.

I am not that naive to suggest that clubs should rely entirely on players they develop themselves and I’m not even sure if this person was in charge last year. Perhaps it has now dawned on him that the model used freely by his own club for so long is flawed but the comment does reek of hypocrisy to me.
 
Rooster 24 said:
Not sure if you guys have seen the comments of the East Burwood president in the local Leader lamenting current player remuneration levels. I need to declare I am a VAFA man and not entirely across the intricacies of the EFL, other than knowing it is an outstanding competition.

The comments of the EB president left me a touch perplexed as the apparent indifference towards excessive player payments did not stop them offering big $ to a number of our senior players pre the 2014 season. We had already been gutted by paying comps and thankfully most of those approached by EB knocked back the offers. EB did however settle on a couple of fringe players and promised match payments that any reasonable person would consider to be way over the odds. Despite what Mr. Peak says this had nothing to do with “players’ assessment of their own abilities being exaggerated” it was entirely about them contacting players with no links to their club and making them offers.

Undaunted EB came back again this pre-season and made very generous (read ridiculous) offers to a couple of our best young players. Perhaps the fact that the two blokes they lured across last season (now back at our club) had not yet been paid made the decision to resit the offers a bit easier.

I am not that naive to suggest that clubs should rely entirely on players they develop themselves and I'm not even sure if this person was in charge last year. Perhaps it has now dawned on him that the model used freely by his own club for so long is flawed but the comment does reek of hypocrisy to me.
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To be fair on Peak, he came into the Job after the former President stood down and you have taken his views from what transpired before his tenure which had nothing to do with him. As for VAFA clubs being gutted, you can't have it both ways as many VAFA clubs approach quality players across all leagues and divisions offering them Jobs, Scholarships and some for their children, Rent Payments Covered, Loan Payments Covered, House renovations, swimming pools, shares and I can keep writing and it's all under the bullshit pretence that they don't get paid $$. Waverley Blues recruited heavily out of Ammo's this year how about bitching about them. Last time I looked Clubs can approach players and offer them money, in the end the players decide. As for the two blokes that went back all I can say is I am thankful they resisted as I would have been pissed off if they were paid over the odds as well as they are not that good. Too many spuds getting good dollars for my liking across many clubs. If the Points system comes in that should help and I hope we go a step further and have the ATO look at VAFA and their Clubs books.

Here's the article, http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/.../story-fngnvmqa-1227384621022#social-comments
 
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eflreceiver said:
To be fair on Peak, he came into the Job after the former President stood down and you have taken his views from what transpired before his tenure which had nothing to do with him. As for VAFA clubs being gutted, you can't have it both ways as many VAFA clubs approach quality players across all leagues and divisions offering them Jobs, Scholarships and some for their children, Rent Payments Covered, Loan Payments Covered, House renovations, swimming pools, shares and I can keep writing and it's all under the bullshit pretence that they don't get paid $$. Waverley Blues recruited heavily out of Ammo's this year how about bitching about them. Last time I looked Clubs can approach players and offer them money, in the end the players decide. As for the two blokes that went back all I can say is I am thankful they resisted as I would have been pissed off if they were paid over the odds as well as they are not that good. Too many spuds getting good dollars for my liking across many clubs. If the Points system comes in that should help and I hope we go a step further and have the ATO look at VAFA and their Clubs books.

Here's the article, http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/.../story-fngnvmqa-1227384621022#social-comments
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Was not meant as a personal dig at Peak and I did preface by saying that I was unsure if he was in the job last year. Was also not intended as VAFA v EFL thing or even as a swipe at East Burwood. While I take your point it just struck me as odd that a club actively involved in offering what I consider to be outrageous amounts of $ to play in a local suburban football competition would then come out and criticise the system. A system that it seems they probably helped to create and still actively participate in, or until recently anyway.

In regard to your other points - 3 players from our club moved to Waverley Blues in 2014 however they are on a pittance compared to what EB offered the others. I also don’t see their president in the local media lamenting player payments.

This is a tired argument but in regard to the VAFA paying players. I have been involved with a relatively strong VAFA club for 4 decades and while we use our networks to find employment for a handful of players we have never had the capacity to do anything beyond that. However I am not that ignorant to say that it has not gone on across the league in the past. In fact it probably still does and most in the VAFA would welcome a means to investigate and stamp it out. But if you think that VAFA clubs are awash with money then you are sadly mistaken and the myth that scholarships are provided is absolute crap. Old Xavs, the most powerful and well-connected club in the VAFA by a fair margin waived goodbye to its 3 best players who joined EFL clubs is year. Do you think that would happen if they could offer the type of inducements your are suggesting?

Anyway I did not get on her to defend the VAFA. Our comp is far from perfect but it’s all I have known since the late 70s. There are pros and cons for amateur and semi professional leagues and we both have many of the same challenges. I also completely agree with your last sentence “Clubs can approach players and offer them money, in the end the players decide”. This is spot on and goes to the heart of what I am saying as when you use the free market to your advantage it seems a bit rich to then turn around and complain when it bites you on the arse!
 
Rooster, whatever you believe regarding outrageous player payments, it's fiction.
What I did find interesting was at the end of the article, that support for the introduction of a statewide player contract was higher within the EFL than the 83% of clubs statewide. Which suggests that Rob Peake isn't alone in his opinion on player payments.
 
Rooster 24 said:
Undaunted EB came back again this pre-season and made very generous (read ridiculous) offers to a couple of our best young players. Perhaps the fact that the two blokes they lured across last season (now back at our club) had not yet been paid made the decision to resit the offers a bit easier.

Perhaps it has now dawned on him that the model used freely by his own club for so long is flawed but the comment does reek of hypocrisy to me.
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I hope the boys did get paid in the end, if not that is extremely disappointing for the club and the league.

Your last line is not lost on many within the competition, some of the comments on Facebook pages tend to reflect this. I did find some comments within the article a little strange.

'He estimates that about a decade ago, a team in the second division would have been unlikely to pay any player more than $100 a game.' “Now, you have clubs in the second division paying two or three grand.”

The unlikely payment of $100 a game a decade ago in 2nd Division is completely inaccurate, and quite a way for what was occurring at the time. Certainly not at the levels of todays extreme heights but remember Donvale won the 2nd Division flag in 2001. If someone believes it was unlikely that any of their players were on less than $100 a game then they are in fantasy land or just creating a flawed point to support a current position.

The Rams did land one of the more heavily chased players in any metropolitan league this season very much to the surprise of many. While this signing was not completed on Robs watch, many clubs will look with interest come 2016 as to the comings & goings at the club.

All that said Rob has done a lot of great work for the League and is taking on a thankless task trying to pick up the club from their lowest position. If in his position 99.9% would be saying the same things.
 
Yeah well written Rooster - EB are a club full of hypocrisy bc as some of "older" guys know they were right among the action when it came to enticing retired AFL players to their footy club in the 90's. The wheel has turned a half cycle and they are crying poor a bit now. Yep, different folk involved, no doubt different philosophies but I think there would be next to no sympathy for their plight because they were one of the fore runners in spending what they didn't have.
I think the biggest blight on local footy is exactly what you are saying - the incredibly high amounts of money paid to good, average footballers. if getting a 4 figure income from playing suburban footy is considered "fair compensation" then the game has gone mad. If paying half of this is considered "average" then same - its madness. Blokes just don't get it and this stems from the top at most footy clubs to the bloke sitting on the pine each week thinking he is hard done by on $250/wk.
Yep clubs can offer whatever they like but if we think our foreign friends are paying too much for local property then I would suggest looking at some local footy clubs for the equivalent mindset; unfortunately, unlike property, it is for a short term gain that ends up in a massive "footballing bubble". The sooner this rubbish is removed from the game the better for ALL footy clubs - a points system might not be perfect but it is a hell of a lot more perfect than some toothless salary cap.

As for your example re Old Xavs Rooster - touche to you. Like you said, if those sort of inducements were common place then blokes would be falling over themselves to get among it - unless of course they were of the same mindset as myself that believes the public system creates a far more rounded citizern than our elite private schools ever will be able to... :)
 
I love all the rhetoric about what EB did in the past. * me, in 1939 Germany invaded Poland and started WWII but I drive a Mercedes these days. What EB did in the past doesn't make Rob Peaks statements wrong or a load of hypocrisy. We all know ALL clubs have poached players with the lure of dollars. I remember when Noble Park came into the EFL, player payments jumped simply because Noble Park had a Sporting Club and could pump dollars into their football team so other clubs had to keep up with them. Then Balwyn came in and the Player Payments jumped again as they have some great benefactors who back their club to the hilt and have dollars to burn. The Clubs had to respond and East Burwood tried and couldn't and now they are heading down. Vermont had more foresight and purchased the Wantirna Hill Club and are still going and despite their spin they are still spending around $300K per year on the football side. Scoresby forked out money it didn't have and have followed East Burwood. Croydon and Mitcham did the same before them and we all remember Donvale which we nearly lost and thankfully they are back. Blind Freddy can see the money Doncaster, and Norwood have spent to win a flag and once that money stops they will follow the others as they have no income stream. The point Rob Peak Peak made is a valid point, the player payments are unsustainable hence Football Victoria are looking at the points system. Local Football has changed so much in 10 years due to money I no longer get to know players as I know the likelihood that they will change clubs the following year is high because they will be offered more money. Feel free to attack the Rams and Peak but you are shooting the messenger.
 
Rooster 24 said:
Was not meant as a personal dig at Peak and I did preface by saying that I was unsure if he was in the job last year. Was also not intended as VAFA v EFL thing or even as a swipe at East Burwood. While I take your point it just struck me as odd that a club actively involved in offering what I consider to be outrageous amounts of $ to play in a local suburban football competition would then come out and criticise the system. A system that it seems they probably helped to create and still actively participate in, or until recently anyway.

In regard to your other points - 3 players from our club moved to Waverley Blues in 2014 however they are on a pittance compared to what EB offered the others. I also don’t see their president in the local media lamenting player payments.

This is a tired argument but in regard to the VAFA paying players. I have been involved with a relatively strong VAFA club for 4 decades and while we use our networks to find employment for a handful of players we have never had the capacity to do anything beyond that. However I am not that ignorant to say that it has not gone on across the league in the past. In fact it probably still does and most in the VAFA would welcome a means to investigate and stamp it out. But if you think that VAFA clubs are awash with money then you are sadly mistaken and the myth that scholarships are provided is absolute crap. Old Xavs, the most powerful and well-connected club in the VAFA by a fair margin waived goodbye to its 3 best players who joined EFL clubs is year. Do you think that would happen if they could offer the type of inducements your are suggesting?

Anyway I did not get on her to defend the VAFA. Our comp is far from perfect but it’s all I have known since the late 70s. There are pros and cons for amateur and semi professional leagues and we both have many of the same challenges. I also completely agree with your last sentence “Clubs can approach players and offer them money, in the end the players decide”. This is spot on and goes to the heart of what I am saying as when you use the free market to your advantage it seems a bit rich to then turn around and complain when it bites you on the arse!
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My son is currently playing Div 1 Ammo's and he get's his Mortgage paid, my two nephews have been employed at 20K higher per year than those who do the same job and if they leave their club the mortgage payments stop and the nephews jobs will cease, but hey you're right they don't get match payments. You are correct VAFA clubs are not awash with money but there are benefactors behind them just like local football clubs. As for the Players who left Old Xavs, seriously s**t example as if I am not mistaken they went to Balwyn, no matter what inducements were offered they would have been doubled as that is what Balwyn does. What Balwyn want Balwyn get.
 
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