List Mgmt. GWS Giants Academy News & Discussion

[dlanod]

I remember seeing re: Lachie Weller/GC that players need to have lived in the state for 5 years to be eligible to be nominated as an academy selection.

Would parents move interstate when their kid's 13yo so they can possibly play for Richmond instead of GWS?

There might be limited examples, but you'd have to be nuts to do it for your kid's theoretical five years in the future professional sport career IMO.

 

[Colonial]

Now with these academies the Vics will hopefully be silent when our 1st 4 1st round picks are all academy boys.

Although can i get some odds that they will STILL kick up a fuss.

 

[Giant Strides]

Victorian clubs AFL academies to be established for aspiring multicultural and indigenous players
What does this mean for the GWS's academy/zone? Will southern NSW talent be inclined to move over the border because they'll be zoned to Richmond?

Does it matter if some do? I think GWS will be getting enough candidates that losing someone like that wouldn't matter. And notwithstanding the previous replies, have we seen the detail on residency requirements & times? One could expect that 'non-traditional background' would include refugees, hence making a 5 year residency requirement could preclude them being in the academy at all, rendering it pointless. So I expect that to be much more relaxed. Therefore, if someone wants to move across the border (who fits this criteria as well as GWS academy criteria) from NSW to Victoria to become a Richmond rather than GWS player, then (a) I doubt there would be too many, and (b) I say let them go.

Who's the BF poster who's a Richmond supporter and used to be always hanging s**t on GWS about not deserving the Riverina area? He might whip up support for someone to do that!

 

[Matchu]

Does it matter if some do? I think GWS will be getting enough candidates that losing someone like that wouldn't matter. And notwithstanding the previous replies, have we seen the detail on residency requirements & times? One could expect that 'non-traditional background' would include refugees, hence making a 5 year residency requirement could preclude them being in the academy at all, rendering it pointless. So I expect that to be much more relaxed. Therefore, if someone wants to move across the border (who fits this criteria as well as GWS academy criteria) from NSW to Victoria to become a Richmond rather than GWS player, then (a) I doubt there would be too many, and (b) I say let them go.

Who's the BF poster who's a Richmond supporter and used to be always hanging s**t on GWS about not deserving the Riverina area? He might whip up support for someone to do that!

That's a good point you make about refugees being unlikely to complete the 5 years required to become an academy selection. Will it be the same rules for Indigenous players? Hard to tell at this point but if they make it that players from multicultural backgrounds and Indigenous players only need to live in the Victorian zones for say two years then that could hurt the Giants. Zac Williams and Jeremy Finlayson would be examples of Indigenous players that could be lost in the future. Let's just say an Indigenous player grows up in the Riverina area and at 16 decides to move over the border and suddenly he become zone eligible for Richmond.

 

[Ichabod Noodle]

Yeah, but even when Hopper was at Ballarat he was signed onto our academy, as he had been for the previous few years. He was still doing academy stuff even when he was in Mexico. Surely you get to stay in the academy you start in - if you want - and continue to fulfil your "contract" obligations, like Hopper did.

 

[Ellie Aquitaine]

That's a good point you make about refugees being unlikely to complete the 5 years required to become an academy selection. Will it be the same rules for Indigenous players? Hard to tell at this point but if they make it that players from multicultural backgrounds and Indigenous players only need to live in the Victorian zones for say two years then that could hurt the Giants. Zac Williams and Jeremy Finlayson would be examples of Indigenous players that could be lost in the future. Let's just say an Indigenous player grows up in the Riverina area and at 16 decides to move over the border and suddenly he become zone eligible for Richmond.

Interestingly you've chosen two academy players that we picked up because no one else did. Zac was selected as a rookie and no clubs bid on Finlayson so we used a meaningless pick on him.

I would also say that there'd be a few more considerations taken into account before moving across the border because one club would have first dibs on your kid over another.

 

[dlanod]

Interestingly you've chosen two academy players that we picked up because no one else did. Zac was selected as a rookie and no clubs bid on Finlayson so we used a meaningless pick on him.

Doubly so - Williams and Steele were both overagers so had passed through the system once already before being drafted.

 

[Gigantor]

Doubly so - Williams and Steele were both overagers so had passed through the system once already before being drafted.

Once again, if it was needed, a demonstration of why the northern academies are so important, for footy generally, because it increases the player pool.

 

[Matchu]

Interestingly you've chosen two academy players that we picked up because no one else did. Zac was selected as a rookie and no clubs bid on Finlayson so we used a meaningless pick on him.

I would also say that there'd be a few more considerations taken into account before moving across the border because one club would have first dibs on your kid over another.

I was actually using Williams and Finlayson as examples of Indigenous players from the GWS zone because we were discussing the probability of refugees living in the Riverina area.

I'm sure every AFL fan will be interested to hear how these new zones will affect their own club. It may turn out to be the same situation with my club since we also share a state border with Victoria.

 

[Giant Strides]

I was actually using Williams and Finlayson as examples of Indigenous players from the GWS zone because we were discussing the probability of refugees living in the Riverina area.

I interpreted Ellie's point as being that no other clubs rushed to offer anything for Zac & Finlayson in the draft. By extension then, a club (such as Richmond) might not rush to offer them a place in an academy.

In reality, such an issue would have multiple factors playing out, including that central question of residency requirements (I've not seen something that answers my earlier question of how long it is in this new scheme). There could be an example where a player who meets the multicultural requirements is in southern NSW, gets GWS academy funding until grade 9 (age 15 approx.), then crosses into Victoria to complete school to maximise their AFL development (as did Hopper, Setterfield & Mutch). Which could make them eligible to then cross to a multicultural academy run by a traditional club, dependent on what the residency time requirement is. And Richmond seems in the box seat with areas covering Bendigo Pioneers & Murray Bushrangers TAC Cup clubs.

But hopefully the GWS academy is producing enough talent that any losses like that (surely small %) could be shrugged off. No doubt there'd be a BF stoush though!

 

[Matchu]

I interpreted Ellie's point as being that no other clubs rushed to offer anything for Zac & Finlayson in the draft. By extension then, a club (such as Richmond) might not rush to offer them a place in an academy.

In reality, such an issue would have multiple factors playing out, including that central question of residency requirements (I've not seen something that answers my earlier question of how long it is in this new scheme). There could be an example where a player who meets the multicultural requirements is in southern NSW, gets GWS academy funding until grade 9 (age 15 approx.), then crosses into Victoria to complete school to maximise their AFL development (as did Hopper, Setterfield & Mutch). Which could make them eligible to then cross to a multicultural academy run by a traditional club, dependent on what the residency time requirement is. And Richmond seems in the box seat with areas covering Bendigo Pioneers & Murray Bushrangers TAC Cup clubs.

But hopefully the GWS academy is producing enough talent that any losses like that (surely small %) could be shrugged off. No doubt there'd be a BF stoush though!

I understand that clubs weren't interested in Williams or Finlayson but that doesn't mean there won't be a gun Indigenous player coming out of southern NSW in the future. Let's use Wayne Carey as an example. I think he has an Indigenous background but I don't 100% know. Anyway, Carey grew up in Wagga Wagga and began playing Aussie rules at the age of 8. He then moved to Adelaide at the age of 13. Considering the northern academies have an under 12s program, where would Carey sit under the new system if he moved to Adelaide at the age of 13 and the Crows/Port claimed him as an Indigenous junior in their zone? How does that situation play out? How does it play out if he were to move at 15?

When you live in southern NSW and you play Aussie rules, it's pretty obvious that playing in northern Victoria is beneficial to your future so I have a feeling this is going to become an issue in the near future. You just know Richmond recruiters are going cross the border and will try to convince gun juniors to relocate to northern Victoria if it means they can secure their services a few years later. All I'm saying is that GWS will need to be weary of Richmond and potential dirty tactics playing out at the junior level.

 

[Giant Strides]

I understand that clubs weren't interested in Williams or Finlayson but that doesn't mean there won't be a gun Indigenous player coming out of southern NSW in the future. Let's use Wayne Carey as an example. I think he has an Indigenous background but I don't 100% know. Anyway, Carey grew up in Wagga Wagga and began playing Aussie rules at the age of 8. He then moved to Adelaide at the age of 13. Considering the northern academies have an under 12s program, where would Carey sit under the new system if he moved to Adelaide at the age of 13 and the Crows/Port claimed him as an Indigenous junior in their zone? How does that situation play out? How does it play out if he were to move at 15?

When you live in southern NSW and you play Aussie rules, it's pretty obvious that playing in northern Victoria is beneficial to your future so I have a feeling this is going to become an issue in the near future. You just know Richmond recruiters are going cross the border and will try to convince gun juniors to relocate to northern Victoria if it means they can secure their services a few years later. All I'm saying is that GWS will need to be weary of Richmond and potential dirty tactics playing out at the junior level.

Agree with the scenario possibility.Sure they'd counter-offer. I just think that GWS won't go too hard given you'd be dealing with kids. And presume that the academy works to raise the total skill level & numbers of possible recruits. We may grumble at losing a gun, but don't think we would throw the toys out of the cot. At least I hope not.

 

[Giant Strides]

Sorry, I didn't really answer your specific Carey examples. With respect to those, I suspect that the AFL won't have put enough thought or written rules around such moves. Nothing like the number of years served pointing to which club would get dibs. Therefore, there would be some pressure brought by clubs on the player to sign up for their academy. i.e. in the event of a move continue with GWS or swap to a Richmond/Port etc multicultural academy. No-one knows at the start of the journey whether the player is a Wayne Carey or Joe Average. However, if the residency around multicultural academies is less than normal, for example your 2 years, it is conceivable to highly rate a player (think Hopper as an example) & therefore try to persuade him to swap at age 15/16 for the 2 years required. So, yes, GWS would likely be a bit peeved to sponsor a guy for 4-5 years, which got him noticed, only to jump ship for 2 years to get into a traditional club that he liked or got promised more. I'm still of a view that the numbers of kids doing that would likely be small. And perhaps the AFL have foreseen that and put something in. But it's dealing with human nature and young kids so I doubt that they'll be too prescriptive in such matters. Que sera sera.

 

[Gigantor]

Sorry, I didn't really answer your specific Carey examples. With respect to those, I suspect that the AFL won't have put enough thought or written rules around such moves. Nothing like the number of years served pointing to which club would get dibs. Therefore, there would be some pressure brought by clubs on the player to sign up for their academy. i.e. in the event of a move continue with GWS or swap to a Richmond/Port etc multicultural academy. No-one knows at the start of the journey whether the player is a Wayne Carey or Joe Average. However, if the residency around multicultural academies is less than normal, for example your 2 years, it is conceivable to highly rate a player (think Hopper as an example) & therefore try to persuade him to swap at age 15/16 for the 2 years required. So, yes, GWS would likely be a bit peeved to sponsor a guy for 4-5 years, which got him noticed, only to jump ship for 2 years to get into a traditional club that he liked or got promised more. I'm still of a view that the numbers of kids doing that would likely be small. And perhaps the AFL have foreseen that and put something in. But it's dealing with human nature and young kids so I doubt that they'll be too prescriptive in such matters. Que sera sera.

I agree with this, the numbers that would try this sort of thing on are likely to be very small, especially when you consider the sorts of families most likely to be involved, where (and I accept I am guilty of generalising here), staying with the family for as long as possible would be encouraged.

We have had examples of families in the past trying to influence the outcome of the draft (the James Cook example comes to mind), and generally speaking:
1. others are making football decisions for the 15/16 year old, often people with football backgrounds - a scenario unlikely to play out for the sorts of kids we are talking about; and
2. as the James Cook example showed, it's usually a waste of time anyway, it's very, very rare you can pick out a 15/16 year old as being odds on favourite to become a champion (and thus warranting a higher than usual effort to attract them to their academy).

For those who don't know or can't recall the Cook example, his parents basically wrote to the what they viewed to be the lesser clubs with the highest picks, and told them that if they selected Cook, he wouldn't play for them.

Carlton ended up selecting him, at a time when Carlton was a desired location, and about 5 years later, he ended up at the Bulldogs as a bit-player.

 

[CHOPS01]

Once again, if it was needed, a demonstration of why the northern academies are so important, for footy generally, because it increases the player pool.

So true, and if this were to happen then AFL clubs would be supportive of Northern Academies as they would all reap the benefits.

Giants need to be able to attract bigger numbers to the Sydney based academy to boost numbers. Perhaps they need to look at some form of a scholarship to attract talent from other sports? Another U18 Academy player has left to go interstate, leaving only 4 under 18 players, which makes it really difficult for these boys to advance with their development as they are training with 17 and 16 year olds. Full credit to the Giants to address this by relocating Harrison McCreadie to Sydney to boost numbers. Would be great to see Giants relocate some more Wagga Academy based players to Sydney to assist with Western Sydney development so boys can have a better contested component.

 

[CHOPS01]

So true, and if this were to happen then AFL clubs would be supportive of Northern Academies as they would all reap the benefits.

Giants need to be able to attract bigger numbers to the Sydney based academy to boost numbers. Perhaps they need to look at some form of a scholarship to attract talent from other sports? Another U18 Academy player has left to go interstate, leaving only 4 under 18 players, which makes it really difficult for these boys to advance with their development as they are training with 17 and 16 year olds. Full credit to the Giants to address this by relocating Harrison McCreadie to Sydney to boost numbers. Would be great to see Giants relocate some more Wagga Academy based players to Sydney to assist with Western Sydney development so boys can have a better contested component.

If the AFL did change the Riverina zone then Giants could always just relocate more of these Wagga players to Sydney and put them through Academy at Blacktown. This would also be a huge promotion benefit as well, since the more boys drafted from Sydney would entice talented boys playing other sports to AFL. Would be a worthwhile investment for the Giants.

 

[Garlic muncher]

So true, and if this were to happen then AFL clubs would be supportive of Northern Academies as they would all reap the benefits.

Giants need to be able to attract bigger numbers to the Sydney based academy to boost numbers. Perhaps they need to look at some form of a scholarship to attract talent from other sports? Another U18 Academy player has left to go interstate, leaving only 4 under 18 players, which makes it really difficult for these boys to advance with their development as they are training with 17 and 16 year olds. Full credit to the Giants to address this by relocating Harrison McCreadie to Sydney to boost numbers. Would be great to see Giants relocate some more Wagga Academy based players to Sydney to assist with Western Sydney development so boys can have a better contested component.

Maybe he went to a area where footy is much stronger, the Victorian clubs complain about concessions and academies but many kids from non football areas like WS are attracted to the VFL, SANFL, WAFL etc, they are attracted by the strong football culture and making some coin, that is a benefit that the Northern states will probably never have.

GWS has the best zone, a traditional football area that has produced absolute champions for over 100 years, i reckon in years to come it will be somewhat scaled back, perhaps Wagga and North of that, which would still be a good zone.

 

[CHOPS01]

Maybe he went to a area where footy is much stronger, the Victorian clubs complain about concessions and academies but many kids from non football areas like WS are attracted to the VFL, SANFL, WAFL etc, they are attracted by the strong football culture and making some coin, that is a benefit that the Northern states will probably never have.

GWS has the best zone, a traditional football area that has produced absolute champions for over 100 years, i reckon in years to come it will be somewhat scaled back, perhaps Wagga and North of that, which would still be a good zone.

Yes you are right. 2 under18 players have left now for the SANFL. Why don't Giants and Swans NEAFL pay the academy boys so local product can stay in Sydney?

 

[Vic pokiesmon]

Yes you are right. 2 under18 players have left now for the SANFL. Why don't Giants and Swans NEAFL pay the academy boys so local product can stay in Sydney?

Any others u know of?.Thats a small sample.18 players were drafted from Neafl last year from memory.It seems the Neafl is producing more quality players than ever before

 

[CHOPS01]

Any others u know of?.Thats a small sample.18 players were drafted from Neafl last year from memory.It seems the Neafl is producing more quality players than ever before

Great result from NEAFL and we need it to be strong, but Sydney based academy players don't train with the NEAFL team.

With only 4 under 18 boys at WS it makes it near impossible for them to train and prepare for their draft year. We need to relocate more under 18s from Riverina to WS or look at the WS 18yo's training with the NEAFL team again?

All the players that have been drafted from the NEAFL (with the exception of Mills, Davis and co all trained with Swans seniors) have either trained with a senior team or a Victoria or Canberra Tac Cup based team. Jeremey Finlayson was drafted last year coming out of WS academy but he trained with the NEAFL team once a week, and they don't allow that anymore. It is concerning that WS based academy players have to train with 17 and 16 yo's and expect them to develop when they are not training with adequate numbers or more experienced and bigger bodied players. We have 2 academy boys at Penno but they are not permitted to train at the club as clash with academy training.

 

[Giant Strides]

http://www.gwsgiants.com.au/news/2016-02-25/giants-academy-team-announcement

The GWS GIANTS Academy congratulate all players who have been selected in the U16 and U18 teams for Game 1 of the AFL NSW/ACT Academy Series.
GWS GIANTS ACADEMY v SYDNEY SWANS ACADEMY - U16 & U18

Game 1 – Sunday 6th March at Tom Wills Oval (Sydney Olympic Park)

U/16 SQUAD

U/18 SQUAD

Further games in the Academy series will be played in the coming weeks.

• Game 2 – Saturday 19th March @ Lakeside Oval (Moore Park, Sydney)
• Game 3 - Saturday 2nd April @ Kippax Oval (Belconnen, ACT)

U18 SQUAD LIST

Jarrod BRANDER *
Matt NEAGLE
Connor BYRNE
Alex PAECH *
Fletcher CARROLL
Harry PERRYMAN
Brandon CLARK
Jack POWELL *
Isaac CUMMING
Tom RAGENOVICH
Josh DOWSE
Luke REDFERN
Sam FISHER
Nathan RICHARDS *
Ryan GARTHWAITE
Donald ROBERTS
Logan GRAY
William SETTERFIELD
Joshua HANLON
Luke SHANNON
Jack IRVINE
Nicholas SHIPLEY *
Max LYNCH
Ethan SLATER
Harrison MACREADIE
Derek SMITH
Mitch MAGUIRE
Charlie SPARGO *
Lucas MELINE
Zachary SPROULE
Brady MORTON
Jacob TURNER
Kobe MUTCH
Matthew VARDENEGA
Brendan MYERS *
Jayden WHITE

The players in bold have been mentioned earlier in this thread in relation to 2016 draft. Several of the boys named here (with a *) are potential 2017 academy draftees from what I've gathered from other sources. Jack Irvine was a GWS nominee for the 2015 draft, so presumably playing on as an overager (similar to Jack Steele & HH before him). Notable absentees from the list are Connor Owen-Auburn and Canberra's Tom Highmore (reasons unknown).

 

[CHOPS01]

Connor Owen-Auburn is injured so he will come back possibly for game 2 but definitely for game 3 of the academy series, so he will no doubt be selected for the Rams. We have lost Lyndon Hupfeild who is now in the South Australia academy. Some good depth in the Giants though and should prove to strong for the Swans academy.

 

[Giant Strides]

GWS GIANTS ACADEMY v SYDNEY SWANS ACADEMY - U16 & U18

Game 2 – Saturday 19th March at Lakeside Oval, Driver Ave, Moore Park - See more at: http://www.gwsgiants.com.au/news/20...fl-nswact-academy-series#sthash.X01u255u.dpuf

U16s start at 11am
U/16 SQUAD

U18s start at 1pm
U/18 SQUAD

Connor BYRNE
Lucas MELINE
Brandon CLARK
Brady MORTON
Jacob CONLAN
Brendan MYERS
Isaac CUMMING
Connor OWEN-AUBURN
Josh DOWSE
Harry PERRYMAN
Sam FISHER
Jack POWELL
Logan GRAY
Luke REDFERN
Joshua HANLON
Nathan RICHARDS
Tom HIGHMORE
Donald ROBERTS
Jack IRVINE
Nicholas SHIPLEY
Harrison MACREADIE
Jacob TURNER
Mitch MAGUIRE
Matthew VARDENEGA

A couple of returning names from the possible 2016 academy draft class (Highmore & Owen-Auburn) who missed the first game, but there are more kids from the first squad who will miss this game (Setterfield, Mutch, Sproule, Spargo and a clutch of the under-agers) - presumably these are the kids who go to school in Victoria. Also, the squad size reduced from 36 to 24. Will be interesting how they go in this game after being well beaten in the first game of the series.

 

[CHOPS01]

GWS GIANTS ACADEMY v SYDNEY SWANS ACADEMY - U16 & U18

Game 2 – Saturday 19th March at Lakeside Oval, Driver Ave, Moore Park - See more at: http://www.gwsgiants.com.au/news/20...fl-nswact-academy-series#sthash.X01u255u.dpuf

U16s start at 11am
U/16 SQUAD

U18s start at 1pm
U/18 SQUAD

Connor BYRNE
Lucas MELINE
Brandon CLARK
Brady MORTON
Jacob CONLAN
Brendan MYERS
Isaac CUMMING
Connor OWEN-AUBURN
Josh DOWSE
Harry PERRYMAN
Sam FISHER
Jack POWELL
Logan GRAY
Luke REDFERN
Joshua HANLON
Nathan RICHARDS
Tom HIGHMORE
Donald ROBERTS
Jack IRVINE
Nicholas SHIPLEY
Harrison MACREADIE
Jacob TURNER
Mitch MAGUIRE
Matthew VARDENEGA

A couple of returning names from the possible 2016 academy draft class (Highmore & Owen-Auburn) who missed the first game, but there are more kids from the first squad who will miss this game (Setterfield, Mutch, Sproule, Spargo and a clutch of the under-agers) - presumably these are the kids who go to school in Victoria. Also, the squad size reduced from 36 to 24. Will be interesting how they go in this game after being well beaten in the first game of the series.

This age group hasn't lost a game to the Swans Academy since U14 prior to game 1 last fortnight and with the inclusions in, we should restore the balance. The outs won't affect us, since Game 1 was a poor display and they didn't fire. Swans will go into this game full of confidence so will be an interesting game to watch down at Lakeside.

 

[CHOPS01]

GWS GIANTS ACADEMY v SYDNEY SWANS ACADEMY - U16 & U18

Game 2 – Saturday 19th March at Lakeside Oval, Driver Ave, Moore Park - See more at: http://www.gwsgiants.com.au/news/20...fl-nswact-academy-series#sthash.X01u255u.dpuf

U16s start at 11am
U/16 SQUAD

U18s start at 1pm
U/18 SQUAD

Connor BYRNE
Lucas MELINE
Brandon CLARK
Brady MORTON
Jacob CONLAN
Brendan MYERS
Isaac CUMMING
Connor OWEN-AUBURN
Josh DOWSE
Harry PERRYMAN
Sam FISHER
Jack POWELL
Logan GRAY
Luke REDFERN
Joshua HANLON
Nathan RICHARDS
Tom HIGHMORE
Donald ROBERTS
Jack IRVINE
Nicholas SHIPLEY
Harrison MACREADIE
Jacob TURNER
Mitch MAGUIRE
Matthew VARDENEGA

A couple of returning names from the possible 2016 academy draft class (Highmore & Owen-Auburn) who missed the first game, but there are more kids from the first squad who will miss this game (Setterfield, Mutch, Sproule, Spargo and a clutch of the under-agers) - presumably these are the kids who go to school in Victoria. Also, the squad size reduced from 36 to 24. Will be interesting how they go in this game after being well beaten in the first game of the series.

OH DEAR!!!!
Changing of the guard it seems with U18 Swans Academy has defeated Giants Academy again for game 2: 8.7-55 to 8.6-54
How have the Swans managed to turn it around and even get close to us yet alone win 2 games in this years series???? Previous years with this age group have been an embarrassment to the Swans on the scoreboard and justifiable by their limited recruitment zone. Giants need to look very closely at what the Swans are doing at training and preparation? What are the Swans Academy doing differently to the Giants?