How should the world deal with ISIS?

[Mofra]

I think the Kurds will fight them forever. I think the west must supply them with everything they can and give them massive air support. There lies a problem , the west perhaps should be bombing the hell out of ISIS, where it can, and at great lengths , but one or two or three nations can't commit to such savage warfare from the sky if only a handful will do it. Everyone who hates this middle age nutcase army must commit to its utter destruction (if that's possible). If they all don't then even Americas actions from the sky will be limited as well. Because America is really the only one that throws its own people into the fray where they lose thousands of soldiers, they carry the weight.

It's a difficult political situation re: Kurdistan - the US needs to balance the needs of keeping Turkey on-side while supporting (arguably) their best ally in Iraq, also noting the Kurds are the largest group of displaced people in the world without a recognized fully autonomous homeland (more than Palestine for example).

Turkey's regional issues in the East were cited as a major stumbling block when partition of Iraq along Kurdish/Sunni/Shia lines was mooted post Gulf War 2.

 

[awaremind]

Yeah nah.

Oh really just remind me what happened to the last president that seriously challenged the establishment ?

 

[medusala]

What a deeply moronic thing to say.

Satire went over your head?

.

Yeah nah.

You seriously think he has much say in foreign policy? His administration is every bit as hawkish (if not more so than Bush). Plenty of the same people behind the scenes. Look at Nuland and Ukraine and neocon connection.

 

[awaremind]

Apparently they are training them !

 

[CountryRace]

The most brilliant propagandist technique will yield no success unless one fundamental principle is borne in mind constantly - it must confine itself to a few points and repeat them over and over. --Joseph Goebbels

 

[Slax]

I think it has reached a point of mass bombings of the major cities that they control. inflict massive damage on the towns and it will impact morale heavily and cause unrest in the power base. This will force them to deal with these issues, thus weakening them on the front line allow advances to be made to reclaim territory. Having civil disorder at home makes it impossible to control the rest of the region.

 

[MaddAdam]

I think it has reached a point of mass bombings of the major cities that they control. inflict massive damage on the towns and it will impact morale heavily and cause unrest in the power base. This will force them to deal with these issues, thus weakening them on the front line allow advances to be made to reclaim territory. Having civil disorder at home makes it impossible to control the rest of the region.

Yes, that tactic worked a treat in Iraq in 2003.

 

[Slax]

Yes, that tactic worked a treat in Iraq in 2003.

Why not that is what created IS, so whatever comes from it can't be any worse.

The whole problem that is IS, has been caused by the USA lead campaigns against Iraq and Libya. Both campaigns were really brought at the behest of Saudi Arabia. Both Iraq and Libya were far more tolerant of religious minority, far more supportive of women's rights and had good infrastructure, Libya had much better infrastructure than parts of Eastern Europe. But because of ideology, the reliance on Saudi Arabian oil and the fact that both Iraq and Libya were very vocal against Israel, the USA helped it mates who are much bigger tyrants out and created to third world countries for no real reason.

If the West really cared about the oppression of minority groups and human rights like it has claimed to allow invasions in certain countries then it should be overthrowing the biggest ones in the Middle East in Saudi Arabia and Qatar, but they prefer to look at other targets like Iran and demonised them even though they are much more secular and democratic than Saudi Arabia. It is also even more poignant in the fact that the biggest source of funds for IS comes from Saudi Arabia, but the USA won't take action against them to stop the flow of funds.

And Australia blindly follow the USA on foreign policy. The sooner we develop our own foreign policy agenda the better off Australia will be.

 

[MaddAdam]

Why not that is what created IS, so whatever comes from it can't be any worse.

Yes it can be worse, and it will be.

The whole problem that is IS, has been caused by the USA lead campaigns against Iraq and Libya. Both campaigns were really brought at the behest of Saudi Arabia. Both Iraq and Libya were far more tolerant of religious minority, far more supportive of women's rights and had good infrastructure, Libya had much better infrastructure than parts of Eastern Europe. But because of ideology, the reliance on Saudi Arabian oil and the fact that both Iraq and Libya were very vocal against Israel, the USA helped it mates who are much bigger tyrants out and created to third world countries for no real reason.

If the West really cared about the oppression of minority groups and human rights like it has claimed to allow invasions in certain countries then it should be overthrowing the biggest ones in the Middle East in Saudi Arabia and Qatar, but they prefer to look at other targets like Iran and demonised them even though they are much more secular and democratic than Saudi Arabia. It is also even more poignant in the fact that the biggest source of funds for IS comes from Saudi Arabia, but the USA won't take action against them to stop the flow of funds.

And Australia blindly follow the USA on foreign policy. The sooner we develop our own foreign policy agenda the better off Australia will be.

I'm not sure where to start on that.

 

[Slax]

Yes it can be worse, and it will be.

How, the current group are beheading those of other faiths, enslaving women as sex slaves and mass murdering those from other branches of the Islam. They are trying to develop chemical weapons and will have no issue in using them either, happy to recruit anyone and use them as suicide boomers, are brainwashing kids as young as they can so they can use them to help fight for them. So not sure how we can get a group worse.

 

[awaremind]

Yes it can be worse, and it will be.



I'm not sure where to start on that.

Care to actually explain why they shouldn't make sacrifices (deploy ground troops) to clean up the mess they made ?

 

[Docker Alyssa]

I think they should send a really convincing world peace powerpoint presentation.

It will work. World peace is undeniable.

 

[CountryRace]

 

[Major Colvin]

There are alarming parellels between the origins of ISIS and the Khmer Rouge (and probably other murderous regimes which have been galvanised by US-led intervention)

In both cases the borders neighbouring country (Syria and Cambodia) have been weakened due to the chaos ensued due to an unwarranted, illegal intervention by the US in both Vietnam and Iraq.

The bombing of Cambodian allowed the Khmer Rouge to garner support against the US-backed Cambodian govt.

The US invasion installed a Shia regime that disciminated against Sunni's. Added to that Iran funded Shia militias (tacitly supported - or at least, not discouraged by the US) to further allow Al-Quada and then ISIS to recruit significantly in Western Iraq. Syria's civil war has also created a loss of control in eastern Syria allowing ISIS to carve out an enormous piece of territory in both countries.

The Khmer Rouge self-imploded fairly quickly but not before carrying out one of the most horrific genocides in history. ISIS as a regime are still in their infancy - but they are better resourced and coordinated. They have access to social media allow them to recruit internationally.

The problem is too great and complex now that no government is willing to touch it. If you somehow decapitated ISIS, it would likely grow three more heads eat away at the outer perimeters of the middle East

It would fair to say that any foreign invasion, almost always leads to the rise of internal extremism. Of course the same goes for the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, the CIA training of bin Laden to repel then. It also gave rise to the Taliban.

 

[FPPF]

U.S. Concerns Grow About Turkish Bombardment of Kurdish Separatists
Ankara government has yet to turn its firepower on Islamic State

http://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-con...bombardment-of-kurdish-separatists-1439422676

Take note of how a major US publication like the Wall Street Journal is referring to a listed terrorist organization, the PKK, as separatists.
As long as they fighting against one of Washington's enemies and it's benefiting Washington, they aren't terrorists anymore.


US military official: 'We were outraged' when Turkey pulled a fast one right after the anti-ISIS deal

Documents and flash drives seized during the Sayyaf raid reportedly revealed links “so clear” and “undeniable” between Turkey and ISIS “that they could end up having profound policy implications for the relationship between us and Ankara,” a senior western official familiar with the captured intelligence told the Guardian.

The US, meanwhile, is moving away from its $500 million Syrian train-and-equip program and embracing a partnership with the YPG — Syrian Kurds who are closely allied with the PKK.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/us-military-official-were-outraged-141600922.html


Uncle Sam doesn't forget or forgive betrayal. Turkey better hope that the US never finds an alternative to Incirlik airbase or stops making strategic plans involving that airbase, because the last decade or so of betrayals by Turkey will come back to bite them in the ass in a very nasty manner. There's already US officials questioning whether Turkey is really an ally and whether they belong in NATO.

 

[The Speaker]

Questions should've been raised about Turkey years ago.

 

[rowie343]

 

[Mofra]

Care to actually explain why they shouldn't make sacrifices (deploy ground troops) to clean up the mess they made ?

When has the US "cleaning up their own mess" actually made things better?

There is a long and proud history of US foreign policy turning disaster into catastrophe. I wouldn't trust the US to clean a bathroom, let alone the quagmire of Iraq.

 

[awaremind]

When has the US "cleaning up their own mess" actually made things better?

There is a long and proud history of US foreign policy turning disaster into catastrophe. I wouldn't trust the US to clean a bathroom, let alone the quagmire of Iraq.

Well whatever they are actually doing there at the moment isn't doing much good thats for sure.

 

[FPPF]

There's now reports that Russia is about to undertake a military Intervention in Syria against the terrorists.

If this is true it's going to suck big time for ISIS and the rest of the cabal of Islamic terrorists pretending to be Syrian opposition fighters.

Russia doesn't pussy foot around.
And importantly they aren't playing both sides here like the west is..arming/training the terrorists then on the other hand "bombing" them.
A Russian intervention actually will go after the terrorists.

I guess Russia has decided enough Is enough and won't sit back now, if this is true.

The news is on ynet an Israeli news site. Phone won't let me post the link.

 

[FPPF]

And now on RT they are saying, quoting Russian government/military officials as saying there has been no deployment to Syria nor is it on their agenda to do so.

Such a shame.

 

[FPPF]

http://www.news.com.au/world/russia...t-assad-in-syria/story-fndir2ev-1227514971494

The Russian's are sending more hardware to Syria for Assad.

In regards to the earlier post about the reports that Russia was sending warplanes and troops to get directly involved, this response from the Americans...bloody priceless and hilarious. Of course some people in here will not see the hypocrisy and double standards and continue bashing just on Russia.
You know who you are.

While not elaborating on or confirming the accuracy of those reports, the State Department said Kerry made clear to Lavrov that such actions “could further escalate the conflict, lead to greater loss of innocent life, increase refugee flows and risk confrontation” with the anti-Islamic State coalition operating led by the US that is carrying out strikes in Syria.

So Russian intervention in Syria will escalate the crisis, but American/NATO intervention in Ukraine is ok?
* right off.
These people aren't even trying to be subtle anymore. And the scariest part is that there's people who are stupid enough in the world who can't see it. Sadly they are the people who get to vote for these buffoons.

 

[FPPF]

Looks like the reports of Russian troops in Syria is true to an extent so far.
US intelligence is saying according to the telegraph that the Russians are setting up and airbase in Latakia.

And Putin has apparently said it's "premature" to talk of a Russian intervention. Hinting?

Apparently the Russians have also requested over flight rights from several countries for this month.

There's apparently also videos of Russian combat troops in Syria..or at least soldiers speaking Russian. There was also photos posited on twitter I think apparently showing a Russian drone flying above a western/coalition fighter jet.


Really hope the Russians get directly involved. They aren't playing both sides of the terrorist/rebel, so they won't hesitate to cripple them as unlike our side they don't have any vested interests besides supporting Assad and ensuring Syria doesn't fall to pro western backed terrorists.
Which could help end the war there and stem the tide of refugees fleeing the fighting.
And Assad would have to remain In power for the tide to be stemmed because the terrorists if they get a hold of Syria the flow of people will increase. Leaders like Assad and Saddam, while dictators and capable and guilty of many wrongs are infinitely many times better then the alternative of having Islamic terrorists running countries. And are more easier to deal with as they aren't in a hurry to become martyrs and meet 72 virgins like the terrorists. Get rid of Assad and we will have another Iraq and Libya, probably something worse given how it's spawned the likes of ISIS, and has the involvement of many other loser terrorists

 

[Fletched]

Assad has to go at some point though, he turned peaceful protests into an all out civil war not to mention using chemical weapons on his own civilians

It would be easy to topple him now while he's weak. Then ISIS can be dealt with afterwards

 

[The Speaker]

Assad has to go at some point though, he turned peaceful protests into an all out civil war not to mention using chemical weapons on his own civilians

They're still investigating who used the chemical weapons. The most likely answer is that at the very least both the government and the main opposition have done so.