Wilt is higher on your list. He only has two and he wasn't even the best player on those one of those teams.
Not sure if you Hakeem higher, but he only had two.
Not sure if you have Kobe, but he's only been responsible for 2.
Is LeBron James still the best player on the planet?
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Wilt is higher on your list. He only has two and he wasn't even the best player on those one of those teams.
Not sure if you Hakeem higher, but he only had two.
Not sure if you have Kobe, but he's only been responsible for 2.
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Huh?? How do the Lakers get better with LeBron in place of Magic.
The Lakers were showtime basketball. Run n gun. That was all because of Magic Johnson and how he pushed the offence and his unrivaled passing ability to get everyone involved.
So you go from Magic to LeBron who needs the ball in his hands, is not a PG, I dont care how much anybody ever tries to tell me he is or totally could or can totally play all 5 positions.
The pace slows down, does that push Worthy to the bench cos LeBron is at SF? Who runs the point?
No way do they win more championships.
stewie griffen
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I hate the ranking between generations tbh.
Altho how you distinguish generations... thats another question.
But for what i've seen its
Magic
Jordan
Kobe/Shaq
Lebron
(goin from generation to generation./.. ie not ranking)
Comparing Jordan to todays game.... its tough. Defense has totally change, the game is less physical, but guys are longer. Then again, the bigs in the paint are nowhere near as dominant.
I mean look at Bird. Bird in todays NBA? Damn boy. Thats the prototype stretch 4 right there.
Hakeem, Robinson and Shaq? Would absolutely destroy all current bigs.
Malone.... todays game has moved away from being post centric, so would he be as effective?
Stockton and Nash? Points have moved to more hybrid shooting guards
Russell? Would have gotten eaten alive in the 90's game
How can you possibly compare any of them
Altho how you distinguish generations... thats another question.
But for what i've seen its
Magic
Jordan
Kobe/Shaq
Lebron
(goin from generation to generation./.. ie not ranking)
Comparing Jordan to todays game.... its tough. Defense has totally change, the game is less physical, but guys are longer. Then again, the bigs in the paint are nowhere near as dominant.
I mean look at Bird. Bird in todays NBA? Damn boy. Thats the prototype stretch 4 right there.
Hakeem, Robinson and Shaq? Would absolutely destroy all current bigs.
Malone.... todays game has moved away from being post centric, so would he be as effective?
Stockton and Nash? Points have moved to more hybrid shooting guards
Russell? Would have gotten eaten alive in the 90's game
How can you possibly compare any of them
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Well I have LeBron right now around 7-10 zone.
Top six would be Jordan, Magic, Bird, Wilt, Russell, Kareem. Not in that order, but those six.
LeBron is in the next group with Kobe, Shaq, Olajuwon, Baylor, Duncan etc ...
Oscar Robertson as well of course.
Wilt did only win two titles but his records were insane. I know it was a different era though so you have to take them with a grain of salt really. Tough to rate the old guys and where they fit in. Wilt has his ridiculous stats and Russell has his 11 rings.
J Shuttlesworth
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I'll let Riley decide how to use him, but if he needed to he could run the point for the season. I think LeBron would drool over having Worthy, Kareem, Cooper, Scott and AC Green as team mates.
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Super tough to compare isnt it. As I said before Wilt and Russell dominated a league with small white guys. I mean you look at one of the great highlights of all time with Cousy running around in circles killing the clock to win another title for Boston. He is dribbling at near hip, chest height and he is clearly one handed, he cant dribble with his other hand. Any half decent player today would have stolen that ball.
But back then he was the height of ball control. So it's tough to gauge.
It gets easier I think from about Magic Johnson onwards. As the game hasnt taken that huge a stride forward since then. Maybe the league has become more of a shooters league, a weaker, smaller, less physical league. Quicker though, more athletic.
Guys like Stockton might struggle in todays game. Super smart player but he would get abused by guys like Rose, Westbrook, Lillard, Curry etc
Also you look how much smaller the league has gotten. A player over 7 feet is rare nowadays. Back in the 80s/90s you used to have at least two 7 footers on your roster.
I think you are right about Bird, what a stretch four he would make in todays game. Magic would be fine, in fact in more dominant as he loved the pace of game, loved to get up and down and was so big.
Jordan would abuse the league even more now with how weak the league has become and how anything is a foul. Jesus, he would be going to the line about 30 times a game. Not to mention when driving, it's no longer big 7 footers in his path, but 6'10 tweeners who have to be able to shoot and spread the floor. He would abuse them.
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Of course he would drool over teammates like that but it would * up the dynamic of the team. Even if Riley lets him run the point. LeBron might have certain aspects of his game that are better than Magic for sure, but no way in hell are you telling me he would be a better PG.
Magic Johnson is the absolute GOAT PG of all time, no competition. He ran that show like nobody ever could. LeBron is half the passer that Magic was. He saw things nobody could see and put the ball into places that his teammates didnt even know they themselves were even gonna be there. Then all of a sudden they had the ball and it was an easy layup and they dont quite know what just happened.
Think you are underselling Magic hugely here mate.
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Haha I dont think they win more. Maybe the same. Maybe less. Magic was a hell of a ball player.Magic is definitely a better point guard than LeBron. Still doesn't mean they wouldn't win. Make a trade of Worthy for really good point guard. I'll let Riley sort it out
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He was a great defender but he never came up against guys as explosive as Westbrook or Rose.
I think Stockton would be effective in today's game still. But not an All Star like he was back in the day.
He'd be fine. I imagine he'd score more and assist less with today's game style.
On the defensive end he did play against Isaiah Thomas, Gary Payton, Kevin Johnson, Tim Hardaway, Jason Kidd and Anthony Hardaway (off the top of my head), who were pretty explosive to the basket.
stewie griffen
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The defense from the Pistons era to today tho? Its light years away in terms of physicality.
Now its defensive systems that have evolved, but there were still great one on one defenders, even through the 90's.
Gerald Wilkins and the like, Pippen, Starks and the rest of that Knicks squad, the Davis boys, Zo, Robinson, Hakeem, Shaq, Mutombo, Bowen, Rodman, Payton, Artest before he went troppo.
Even team defence, through the Knicks and Pacers. Even the Bulls squads with Harper/Pippen/Jordan/Rodman, the Sonics with Payton and Kemp were a great defensive unit
Today we have what Bogut, M Gasol, Noah, Hibbert as true defensive anchors... its pretty shallow but then you have a lot more Iggy, Green, wing types. There's very vew true defensive capable two way point guards, its basically CP3, but then again its always been that way really.
Throw sports science into the mix, does MJ play less minutes and play more years. Does Bird deal with his back earlier? I'm not even touching Magic
All they guys that did knees and achilles in the 70's and 80's where it was a career ending injury.Lebron to do what he has done so far is amazing, throw in some luck with injuries, some playing through pain and getting out of Cleveland at the right time. That preserved him somewhat by having guys to take the load off, now he can come back and coast when he wants, then turn it on when he needs to come end of game or playoff time. To be so good for long is just exceptional.
Hell throw air travel and hotels in there, private jets, recovery suites. How do you compare a 69 game season in 1950 to an 82 game season now? Yeah there's a lot more travel, but flying a private jet vs sitting on a bus for 16 hours then playing a back to back?
Foe example, Jerry Wests's Lakers travelled 91,128 miles in 61-62 as the crow flies. In real distance travelled, thats well over the 100,000 miles mark. For comparison the 04-05 Heat travelled 78,433 miles and 74,904 in 10-11.
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Who is this Anthony Hardaway you speak of? Seems a decent player.
Also none of those guys were as explosive as say Westbrook or Rose pre injuries today. Tim Hardaway was probably closest with insane handles, really quick, difficult to guard. He was Curry before Curry even existed.
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Probably but I dont think he makes All Star teams like he was doing regularly back in the day.
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LeBron is still the best in the world by a country mile. Closest to him is Durant (when fit), and Davis is probably his biggest threat.
Curry and Harden are awesome scores and passers, but lets be honest, they are both average at best defenders. Harden at times is a liability defensively (has improved ill give him that), and Curry generally rests on defence and they play Thompson on the 1-3 positioned scoring threat, as does Harden. I dont think anyone on here can tell me a time Harden or Curry locked up the other teams best player.
Defence is grossly underrated in the NBA and there is not a player in the game currently who impacts both ends of the floor as much as LeBron. He can score just as well as anyone else in the league on any given night and is miles ahead of Curry, Harden or Durant on the other end. The 2nd and 3rd place getters for biggest impact on both ends is probably Davis and Westbrook respectively.
And for the argument in terms of LeBrons placing in the larger picture, there a few points that aren't really considered. No one on here actually watched Wilt, the big O or Bill Russell or anyone like that, so advocating them above LeBron or any other modern day player, although it may be true, is stupid. Stat sheets dont tell the whole story, none of us are really qualify (although we still will) to critique them as players, they were freaks in a league of very very average unprofessional players compared to the modern era, keep that in mind.
Comparing players across even more current eras is overrated. Arguments like "The league was tougher", "They had hand checking" and stuff like that also is pretty mute. You can make any arguments when comparing hypotheticals, for example, "You adjust to the league you play in, given that LeBron is already one of the best defenders in the game now, you telling me he wouldn't of been even better if he were able to be more physical and hand check?" or, "The league is full of stupidly athletic players, whereas Jordan was gifted athletically for his time, that part of his game would of been more average if he were playing now". Ofcourse, Jordan is the GOAT, im just giving an example of how easy it can be to distort facts when comparing cross generational players, something that i think isnt properly considered in these discussions.
Curry and Harden are awesome scores and passers, but lets be honest, they are both average at best defenders. Harden at times is a liability defensively (has improved ill give him that), and Curry generally rests on defence and they play Thompson on the 1-3 positioned scoring threat, as does Harden. I dont think anyone on here can tell me a time Harden or Curry locked up the other teams best player.
Defence is grossly underrated in the NBA and there is not a player in the game currently who impacts both ends of the floor as much as LeBron. He can score just as well as anyone else in the league on any given night and is miles ahead of Curry, Harden or Durant on the other end. The 2nd and 3rd place getters for biggest impact on both ends is probably Davis and Westbrook respectively.
And for the argument in terms of LeBrons placing in the larger picture, there a few points that aren't really considered. No one on here actually watched Wilt, the big O or Bill Russell or anyone like that, so advocating them above LeBron or any other modern day player, although it may be true, is stupid. Stat sheets dont tell the whole story, none of us are really qualify (although we still will) to critique them as players, they were freaks in a league of very very average unprofessional players compared to the modern era, keep that in mind.
Comparing players across even more current eras is overrated. Arguments like "The league was tougher", "They had hand checking" and stuff like that also is pretty mute. You can make any arguments when comparing hypotheticals, for example, "You adjust to the league you play in, given that LeBron is already one of the best defenders in the game now, you telling me he wouldn't of been even better if he were able to be more physical and hand check?" or, "The league is full of stupidly athletic players, whereas Jordan was gifted athletically for his time, that part of his game would of been more average if he were playing now". Ofcourse, Jordan is the GOAT, im just giving an example of how easy it can be to distort facts when comparing cross generational players, something that i think isnt properly considered in these discussions.
If you had written this post last year it would be true. This year however Curry has played on the opposition point guard 95% of the time. Not really sure what you want him to do.
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The only one underselling anyone here is you mate. LeBron makes his team mates better on every level. If you don't think he'd be an asset on Showtime Lakers you're dreaming.
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