Is Shoey in our best 22?

[bEnJi]

Perhaps he is an easy target and he is coming back from a long term serious injury but with Gibbo back, Litherland performing well, Lake and Spangher due back soon and Stratton and Birchall down in defence I just don't see how he fits in.

I like him as a forward a lot more, it just seems he has the pressure off and plays his natural game but he just doesn't seem to have the confidence to become a reliable AFL defender. Even his disposal out of defence which is meant to be a strong part if his game is very shaky times. Rough, Jack, Hale, Ceglar, McEvoy are ahead of him in the pecking order up forward.

I hope we target Frawley as he would be big upgrade from Shoe imo. I would look at trading him in a package to perhaps GWS for one of their young mids who doesn't get much of a to like number 2 pick Jono Rourke


If all players were available I think we would line up best like this

Stratton Lake Gibson
Burgoyne Spangher Birchall
Smith Mitchell Hill
Rioli Roughead Puopolo
Bruest Gunston Hale
McEvoy Lewis Hodge
Shiels Suckling Duryea Simpkin

Sewell Litherland Ceglar Langford Shoenmakers Cheney

 

[Brishawk]

This couldn't just be in the best 22 thread?

Shoey is ahead of Sphanger for best 22 in my opinion. Better one on one defender and plays forward too.

 

[walhawk]

This couldn't just be in the best 22 thread?

Shoey is ahead of Sphanger for best 22 in my opinion. Better one on one defender and plays forward too.

Agree. Keep it one thread. Shoe may or may not be best 22 but will be in our finals team.

 

[Hawker55]

Schoey was outstanding on Tippett on Saturday night. Why on earth would this thread come up now? He knows his role and plays it well. Based on form he's ahead of Lake in our best 22.

 

[threesixpio]

Hmmm. When Lake comes back do we need either Schoey or Spanger? Same team as the other night but Lake in. I loved our team the other day. Might depend on who we are playing.

 

[TeamPlayer23]

This couldn't just be in the best 22 thread?

Shoey is ahead of Sphanger for best 22 in my opinion. Better one on one defender and plays forward too.

Sorry but I disagree with you on this one.. I'll be much more confident with Spangher in defence than Schoey from what ive seen so far this year, just my honest opinion...
Good thread by the way, benji. you've made some interesting points...
Especially if the club is targeting Frawley..

 

[Glasgow Hawk]

 

[Randy Campbell]

Yes.
He is in our best 22.

 

[Taskmaster]

Shoey for most part did a good job on Tippett. Just a few errors, but will admit is improving. But once Lakey and Spang come back, Shoey will be a potent forward!!

On a side note, great to see Stratts back to near his best!!

 

[QuietB]

Did Lake make any errors the last time he played?

Schoenmakers is not there on Saturday night and the Hawks do not win. Fact.

He is a best 22 player. It might be forward, it might be back, but he is best 22 every single week.

Get behind him FFS.

A more interesting question is why is Jordan Lewis the most underrated player in the AFL? He will not get a look in for AA, but he is better than half the darlings that will get in ahead of him.

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

Not for mine.

FF: Gunston - Hale - Puopolo
HF: Breust - Roughie - Rioli
Ce: Hill - Mitchell - Smith
HB: Birchall - Gibson - Burgoyne
FB: Hodge - Lake - Stratton

Ru: McEvoy
RR: Lewis
Ro: Shiels

I/C: Litherland, Sewell and two of Suckers, Spang, Langers and Hartung

 

[tige19]

He fought well against Tippet in the 2nd half. Long term there are concerns with him as he has not improved as a defender, I think eventually we will see him up front in the forward line.

 

[Randy Campbell]

He fought well against Tippet in the 2nd half. Long term there are concerns with him as he has not improved as a defender, I think eventually we will see him up front in the forward line.

A 23 year old, who just had a year off for a knee.
What do people expect from him.

 

[Wittman10]

I though he had an okay night on Saturday, I can recall one mark early where he was badly out of position, and one or two times where he coughed up the pill, but aside from that he was fairly sound. A couple of the marks Tippett took he had no chance of stopping, and he seemed to win more of the one on one battles against him. I still think he's a better proposition up the ground - he looks a lot more confident between the arcs than deep defense. With Lake or Spangher back I think he will look a much better player.

 

[SHAKESPEARE]

This thread is a trap.

I'm pleading the 5th

 

[hawksalltheway]

Yes.
He is in our best 22.

 

[Dinner Plate]

This thread is a trap.

 

[hawksalltheway]

Swans mids were getting time to fire in some pretty $weet delivery to Tiprat in the first half...not much Shoe can do there...
thought he fought on well, definitely won some man on man key battles when the heat was on...and his disposal out of defence is pretty solid...think he has Spang beaten in that area....but Spang probably better 1 on 1...and throws his body in alot more....might come down to match ups....which is a pretty good problem to have

just how many goals were kicked on Shoe Saturday night..?

 

[Flukey!]

I am pretty sure he is, but why is he so focused on making body contact and not just attacking the ball?
That is one think he could definitely learn from Lake.

 

[seysearles]

If all players were available I think we would line up best like this

Stratton Lake Gibson
Burgoyne Spangher Birchall
Smith Mitchell Hill
Rioli Roughead Puopolo
Bruest Gunston Hale
McEvoy Lewis Hodge
Shiels Suckling Duryea Simpkin

Sewell Litherland Ceglar Langford Shoenmakers Cheney

Does include Whitecross and Anderson?

 

[seysearles]

I think it's his body size and height that keeps him in the team more than his performances. We don't have many guys that can play his role (yet). Spangher is really the only other guy and he is equally as flawed. He is a serviceable player but could very easily be dislodged from his spot by the emergence of a guy like Heatherly. Would be reluctant to trade him until Heatherly showed that he is a player though or unless the deal was too good to turn down (ie a very good young mid).

 

[OhhhhhCyril]

It's a shame that Poor Shoey is such an easy scape goat. I think most of us forget that he plays on guys a hell of a lot bigger than him and there is only so much we can expect. I understand its frustrating and I vent it like so many others, but lets not forget he was drafted as a forward and in time, I am hoping he gets his chance in his true position.

Is Shoey in our best 22, yes he is.

 

[Off The Couch]

Yes, yes he is

 

[Main Man]

I'm not being critical of Schoenmakers here and yes he was the only option we had on Saturday (he was ordinary but had a crack) but in my opinion he is surplus to our needs in 2014 if all that are expected to return this year do.

My best 22 come finals:

B: Stratton, Lake, Gibson
HB: Litherland, Spangher, Birchall
C: Hill, Hodge, Smith
HF: Burgoyne, Roughead, Bruest
F: Rioli, Gunston, Puopolo
R: Ceglar, Mitchell, Lewis

IC: McEvoy, Sewel, Sheils, Suckling

Obviously Hale could replace one of the ruckman if form warrants and then you have a whole host of mid/backs like Simpkin, Duryea, Woodard, Langford, Hallahan and Hartung who can play a role then Schoemakers is there for Key position back up, I have him behind Spangher (he can also swing forward like he did first final last year) but even Spangher is borderline in that team particularly is there is no match up for him.

It is all very well saying yes Schoenmakers is best 22 but who does he replace in that team? Some would argue Spangher but as I said there is no guarantees that spot is even there to be filled and I have far greater confidence in Spangher's ability to at least influence the contest.

I don't see him playing as a defender and if they want to play him as a forward then he needs to be made to earn it like so many (Litherland for example) others have, play him forward at Box Hill and make him demand a game rather then being given one at the expense of someone more deserving.

 

[Suckling2Gunston]

Perhaps he is an easy target and he is coming back from a long term serious injury but with Gibbo back, Litherland performing well, Lake and Spangher due back soon and Stratton and Birchall down in defence I just don't see how he fits in.

He is an easy target because people are stupid, quite simply. They look at the one-on-one against Tippett where Franko delivered it perfectly and think "omg hes so bad how does he play?" but no-one mentions the contests he affected well, the fact he set up quite a few counter attacks and delivered the ball at an okay standard.

I like him as a forward a lot more, it just seems he has the pressure off and plays his natural game but he just doesn't seem to have the confidence to become a reliable AFL defender. Even his disposal out of defence which is meant to be a strong part if his game is very shaky times. Rough, Jack, Hale, Ceglar, McEvoy are ahead of him in the pecking order up forward.

I hope we target Frawley as he would be big upgrade from Shoe imo. I would look at trading him in a package to perhaps GWS for one of their young mids who doesn't get much of a to like number 2 pick Jono Rourke

If we do land Frawley, it'll be at the expense of Lake, not Schoe. I can't see Lake going around again and even if he did, we'd be one injury away from being incredibly short on key backs. No chance of us trading Schoenmakers and no chance GWS accept that trade either.

If all players were available I think we would line up best like this

Stratton Lake Gibson
Burgoyne Spangher Birchall
Smith Mitchell Hill
Rioli Roughead Puopolo
Bruest Gunston Hale
McEvoy Lewis Hodge
Shiels Suckling Duryea Simpkin

Sewell Litherland Ceglar Langford Shoenmakers Cheney

See, this is what I don't get. You don't like Schoenmakers, yet you rate Spangher as best 22? Why are Schoe's mistakes highlighted with no remorse yet when Spangher turns it over, doesn't affect a contest, lets the forward get goal-side, or any other act of stupidity you just accept it?