Junction Oval (and St Kilda's potential relocation)

[bombersfan4000]

We aren't moving back to Moorabbin, our VFL team will be based out of there.

We aren't the ones pushing for the JO development, but if the club thinks that it is a better deal than Seaford then there is no reason we shouldn't move. No club would turn down an option to improve their situation.

they agreeded to take the money for seaford signed a long term lease for seaford.

just because some one offers a better deal you cant just up and move.
money is being used to upgrade morabbin
and more money is proposed to be used to up grade the junction oval

eg at what point will the saints stop expecting hand outs

 

[Periphery]

they agreeded to take the money for seaford signed a long term lease for seaford.

just because some one offers a better deal you cant just up and move.
money is being used to upgrade morabbin
and more money is proposed to be used to up grade the junction oval

eg at what point will the saints stop expecting hand outs

As long as a new tenant is found for Seaford and the Frankston council is happy there is nothing stopping us from moving if it is a good deal for us. The AFL have got state govt support in finding a new tenant for Seaford.

We aren't expecting hand outs. The club has publicly stated that they are more than happy to stay at Seaford if JO doesn't happen. The Saints had nothing to do with proposing the JO development so how can that be seen as us "expecting hand outs"?

 

[sverik25]

they agreeded to take the money for seaford signed a long term lease for seaford.

just because some one offers a better deal you cant just up and move.
money is being used to upgrade morabbin
and more money is proposed to be used to up grade the junction oval

eg at what point will the saints stop expecting hand outs

We're not expecting handouts, the Junction Oval redevelopment was proposed without us asking for it. The AFL is simply seeking a way to free up the MCG from Cricket Victoria during March, and thought that they could further justify a JO redevelopment with a St Kilda presence there. St Kilda didn't go to the AFL asking for a Junction Oval redevelopment for them.

 

[My North]

Junction Oval will be good for St Kilda, St Kilda coming back home

 

[Silent Alarm]

they agreeded to take the money for seaford signed a long term lease for seaford.

just because some one offers a better deal you cant just up and move.
money is being used to upgrade morabbin
and more money is proposed to be used to up grade the junction oval

eg at what point will the saints stop expecting hand outs

Moorabbin would've been upgraded anyway, it's for the senior and junior leagues down there and a VFL side. If St Kilda had no intention to move it would've happened. If St Kilda were in Launceston it would've happened. If the Sandringham Zebras wanted to play out of there and no Saints VFL existed, the upgrade would've happened.

I think it's cricket wanting the Junction and the AFL have just jumped on board. The Saints are always going to get on that bandwagon if they can. It all sounds a long way off happening anyway. It's all "the AFL have put down $10 mil.... if the government put down $20... and then there still needs to be another $20 mil..." It's like saying that Fremantle Oval will host AFL because the WA Footy Commission want to be based there and they've got $20 mil, and the government will put down $10 mil, and Freo will put down $10 mil, but then needing another 60 million... and then it becoming the story that Freo will start playing at Parry Street. Ludopicrous.

 

[The_Reaper]

Moorabbin would've been upgraded anyway, it's for the senior and junior leagues down there and a VFL side. If St Kilda had no intention to move it would've happened. If St Kilda were in Launceston it would've happened. If the Sandringham Zebras wanted to play out of there and no Saints VFL existed, the upgrade would've happened.

I think it's cricket wanting the Junction and the AFL have just jumped on board. The Saints are always going to get on that bandwagon if they can. It all sounds a long way off happening anyway. It's all "the AFL have put down $10 mil.... if the government put down $20... and then there still needs to be another $20 mil..." It's like saying that Fremantle Oval will host AFL because the WA Footy Commission want to be based there and they've got $20 mil, and the government will put down $10 mil, and Freo will put down $10 mil, but then needing another 60 million... and then it becoming the story that Freo will start playing at Parry Street. Ludopicrous.

Nah. It's the AFL that wants cricket to have the Junction Oval.

 

[bombersfan4000]

Nah. It's the AFL that wants cricket to have the Junction Oval.

pretty much it. the government wants stkilda there as well to sign the cheque for the money.

whats strange is the Victorians government, spends almost nothing on those suburban grounds where in NSW its almost an open book

 

[The_Reaper]

pretty much it. the government wants stkilda there as well to sign the cheque for the money.

whats strange is the Victorians government, spends almost nothing on those suburban grounds where in NSW its almost an open book

I just find it amazing that the MCG is the only first class standard cricket venue in Victoria when Wagga Wagga has a first class standard venue

 

[Teagueeee15]

I just find it amazing that the MCG is the only first class standard cricket venue in Victoria when Wagga Wagga has a first class standard venue

I would have thought the Junction Oval would have that first class standard. It hosted the shield final only a few years ago.

 

[The_Reaper]

I would have thought the Junction Oval would have that first class standard. It hosted the shield final only a few years ago.

Apparently not because Victoria won't be able to host shield games there during the cricket world cup

 

[bombersfan4000]

I just find it amazing that the MCG is the only first class standard cricket venue in Victoria when Wagga Wagga has a first class standard venue

its staggering when you consider the many different venues the NSW blues play at in North sydney, bankstown, Drummoyne, Newcastle, canberra & the sydney sixers are playing at spotless stadium this year.

mean while down in vic MCG and the rest is not up to scratch.
its wierd as victoria should have more venues than NSW because of the dominate football code uses ovals not rectangular fields
the vic government is useless in investing in suburban facilities

 

[The_Reaper]

its staggering when you consider the many different venues the NSW blues play at in North sydney, bankstown, Drummoyne, Newcastle, canberra & the sydney sixers are playing at spotless stadium this year.

mean while down in vic MCG and the rest is not up to scratch.
its wierd as victoria should have more venues than NSW because of the dominate football code uses ovals not rectangular fields
the vic government is useless in investing in suburban facilities

I mean Newcastle and Canberra makes sense- Newcastle has 500,000 people and Canberra has over 300,000 and is the national capital.

But it's pretty strange that Victoria only has the MCG

 

[bombersfan4000]

I mean Newcastle and Canberra makes sense- Newcastle has 500,000 people and Canberra has over 300,000 and is the national capital.

But it's pretty strange that Victoria only has the MCG

its the Victorian government and lack of investment in suburban grounds.
even some of the old AFL or vfl club grounds would make perfect grounds, the vic parks, morabbin or windy hill or one of the VFL grounds, those grounds the traditional teams have moved away from to new training facilities, there are stands, change rooms & facilities. grounds could easily hold 10k to 15k
or even optus oval carlton train most of the prese season in the surrounding grounds 20k plus. western oval
those grounds wouldn't need much money as well as a drop in pitch to be up to scrach

 

[Kwality]

The Vic Govt are kicking $mils into the MCG run by a suburban cricket club, nothing left for Cricket Vic.

Whats the go in Geelong, A-League game(s) early Jan 2015 I understand, why wouldn't cricket offer up a drop in pitch? A BBL team based there is probably the sticking point with 2 x Melbourne teams a CricVic preferred scenario.

Be aware Geelong Council is local not State Govt. Fair dinkum local government is a rare commodity.

 

[Periphery]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...l-cash-injection/story-fni5f22o-1227060662748

The joint plan has been costed at up to $74 million, but Sports Minister Damian Drum says a figure just shy of $60 million is achievable.
Cricket Victoria, in partnership with Cricket Australia, has stumped up $10 million, a figure matched by the AFL.

Even if the government’s injection is raised to $25 million, it still leaves the project $15 million shy at the lowest cost estimate.

Drum remains hopeful of further contributions from the MCC, Port Phillip council, amateur football club Old Melburnians and the AFL, but said the shortfall might still need to be filled by benefactors.

“We will ask … is it worth anything, on top of initial contributions, to have an MCG that is available to be leased out for other events as soon as blockbuster cricket competitions are off the MCG,” Drum said.

“(And) does cricket have some rich benefactors who are prepared to put in some cold cash into a high-quality, futuristic training venue for the state’s elite cricketers?”

Drum said he had “officially given up” on the possibility of Federal Government funding, but said the AFL continued to lobby Canberra.

He denied cricket would be a poor relation in a joint deal.

“Cricket will have full use of the Junction Oval 12 months a year,” he said.

Prominent St Kilda supporters include trucking magnate Lindsay Fox, Jayco Caravans boss Gerry Ryan and restaurateur Frank van Haandel.

St Kilda is not playing an active role in negotiations but is understood to be happy the AFL is making the running. CV and St Kilda bosses have had discussions in recent weeks.

The Saints are believed to be keen on retaining links with Seaford, where long-term lease arrangements would need to be dramatically altered.

Drum said he didn’t fear voter backlash in the marginal state seat of Frankston and would not “try to keep St Kilda in a place they would rather move from”.

 

[Silent Alarm]

New South Wales doesn't really have many stadiums. Obviously Canberra's in the ACT, but Wollongong and the Central Coast are both bigger than Geelong, while Newcastle's twice the size of those cities. All three of those places have nice grounds, but you'd probably say K-Park's much nicer and more modern (can anyone tell me how these grounds are? I imagine them all pretty much full versions of that stand on the wing at K-Park, 'the Claw' they call it down there) so that's unsurprising. If Bendigo and Ballarat were twice the size and hosting soccer or footy, they'd have grounds like that too.

Meanwhile in Sydney, almost every single stadium is built, redeveloped, or changed through politics.

It's why Kogarah has a beautiful little ground built almost totally from scratch ten years ago but hosts, what, 7 rugby games a year? And one soccer match if it's lucky?

Up in Manly, the only political party that'll ever be in party is the Liberal party. That's why the rugby side up there play in squalor. I don't even like rugby let alone hear anything about it, but that place is decried constantly. The sightlines are terrible, it's a hodgepodge of contradicting designs, there's no public transport... the only reason they still use it is because it's probably a bad look for Manly NRL – imagine being seen as the soulless, city-dwelling, suburb-ditching club if you played every game at the SFS or Homebush?

It's all politics in Sydney. Wasn't the ground rationalisation in Melbourne essentially enforced by the VFL? If it wasn't, we'd probably have a few grounds dotted around the city. I couldn't really imagine a professional club playing out of Moorabbin or Windy Hill, but hey, I still believe Vic Park could home a 30,000 capacity stadium and the potential of Optus Oval is limitless.

 

[bombersfan4000]

New South Wales doesn't really have many stadiums. Obviously Canberra's in the ACT, but Wollongong and the Central Coast are both bigger than Geelong, while Newcastle's twice the size of those cities. All three of those places have nice grounds, but you'd probably say K-Park's much nicer and more modern (can anyone tell me how these grounds are? I imagine them all pretty much full versions of that stand on the wing at K-Park, 'the Claw' they call it down there) so that's unsurprising. If Bendigo and Ballarat were twice the size and hosting soccer or footy, they'd have grounds like that too.

Meanwhile in Sydney, almost every single stadium is built, redeveloped, or changed through politics.

It's why Kogarah has a beautiful little ground built almost totally from scratch ten years ago but hosts, what, 7 rugby games a year? And one soccer match if it's lucky?

Up in Manly, the only political party that'll ever be in party is the Liberal party. That's why the rugby side up there play in squalor. I don't even like rugby let alone hear anything about it, but that place is decried constantly. The sightlines are terrible, it's a hodgepodge of contradicting designs, there's no public transport... the only reason they still use it is because it's probably a bad look for Manly NRL – imagine being seen as the soulless, city-dwelling, suburb-ditching club if you played every game at the SFS or Homebush?

It's all politics in Sydney. Wasn't the ground rationalisation in Melbourne essentially enforced by the VFL? If it wasn't, we'd probably have a few grounds dotted around the city. I couldn't really imagine a professional club playing out of Moorabbin or Windy Hill, but hey, I still believe Vic Park could home a 30,000 capacity stadium and the potential of Optus Oval is limitless.

thats my problem with the NSW and victorian governments, NSW there seems to be an endless pool of money handed to venues, & the vic government are a bunch of tight wads
aside from the 3 major stadiums, ANZ, SCG & Allianz,
there is parramatta, spotless stadiums & a several club grounds that are only used 11 times a year as well as a few other grounds that will see
a few games year, that still receive funding. there is also a few proposed grounds, penrith expect to receive 300 million for a 40k seater, as well as proposed venues in liverpool & blacktown

in general for most sporting events crowds in NSW/ sydney are crap at best.

if the vic government was anything like the NSW government, we would still have a few club grounds vic park & optus & possibly one other & this endless problem with cricket victoria having the MCG at the start or the AFL season would have been delt with years ago

 

[Silent Alarm]

thats my problem with the NSW and victorian governments, NSW there seems to be an endless pool of money handed to venues, & the vic government are a bunch of tight wads
aside from the 3 major stadiums, ANZ, SCG & Allianz,
there is parramatta, spotless stadiums & a several club grounds that are only used 11 times a year as well as a few other grounds that will see
a few games year, that still receive funding. there is also a few proposed grounds, penrith expect to receive 300 million for a 40k seater, as well as proposed venues in liverpool & blacktown

in general for most sporting events crowds in NSW/ sydney are crap at best.

if the vic government was anything like the NSW government, we would still have a few club grounds vic park & optus & possibly one other & this endless problem with cricket victoria having the MCG at the start or the AFL season would have been delt with years ago

Nah, it's about the state of grounds – in Victoria, no one expects grounds to be developed because it's pointless. Everyone knows AFL has two great stadiums, the rugby and soccer do... that's all that matters. In Sydney, the condition is that all teams have a local ground. If you don't maintain that local stadium in a volatile political area, then what? Then you lose the vote. It's not money, just politics

 

[The_Reaper]

New South Wales doesn't really have many stadiums. Obviously Canberra's in the ACT, but Wollongong and the Central Coast are both bigger than Geelong, while Newcastle's twice the size of those cities. All three of those places have nice grounds, but you'd probably say K-Park's much nicer and more modern (can anyone tell me how these grounds are? I imagine them all pretty much full versions of that stand on the wing at K-Park, 'the Claw' they call it down there) so that's unsurprising. If Bendigo and Ballarat were twice the size and hosting soccer or footy, they'd have grounds like that too.

Meanwhile in Sydney, almost every single stadium is built, redeveloped, or changed through politics.

It's why Kogarah has a beautiful little ground built almost totally from scratch ten years ago but hosts, what, 7 rugby games a year? And one soccer match if it's lucky?

Up in Manly, the only political party that'll ever be in party is the Liberal party. That's why the rugby side up there play in squalor. I don't even like rugby let alone hear anything about it, but that place is decried constantly. The sightlines are terrible, it's a hodgepodge of contradicting designs, there's no public transport... the only reason they still use it is because it's probably a bad look for Manly NRL – imagine being seen as the soulless, city-dwelling, suburb-ditching club if you played every game at the SFS or Homebush?

It's all politics in Sydney. Wasn't the ground rationalisation in Melbourne essentially enforced by the VFL? If it wasn't, we'd probably have a few grounds dotted around the city. I couldn't really imagine a professional club playing out of Moorabbin or Windy Hill, but hey, I still believe Vic Park could home a 30,000 capacity stadium and the potential of Optus Oval is limitless.

Yet Wagga Wagga has a first class standard cricket ground whilst Victoria only has the MCG (and presumably Docklands).

I do wonder if Cricket Victoria is crying wolf a bit by saying that the Junction isn't first class standard. I refuse to believe that Wagga Wagga has better cricket facilities.

 

[Kwality]

Yet Wagga Wagga has a first class standard cricket ground whilst Victoria only has the MCG (and presumably Docklands).

I do wonder if Cricket Victoria is crying wolf a bit by saying that the Junction isn't first class standard. I refuse to believe that Wagga Wagga has better cricket facilities.

Don't be fooled by WAs facilities - the Vic Govt pump money into the Melbourne Cricket Club for the MCG, not Aussie Rules footy, not cricket - they hide behind a club that cares nothing for cricket & see AFL fans as cash cows.
Many Victorians believe the MCC is cricket in Victoria like the WACA or the SACA. It is to cricket what Willy is to the VFL.

 

[bombersfan4000]

Don't be fooled by WAs facilities - the Vic Govt pump money into the Melbourne Cricket Club for the MCG, not Aussie Rules footy, not cricket - they hide behind a club that cares nothing for cricket & see AFL fans as cash cows.
Many Victorians believe the MCC is cricket in Victoria like the WACA or the SACA. It is to cricket what Willy is to the VFL.

the Vic government, puts pretty much stuff all money in to the stadium. the MCG is what is it is because of the AFL, hence why there are contracts in place that so many finals & the grand final must be played there until 2037

its in NSW that seem to be very fond of handing out money to various stadiums, even though they might see a hand full of games every year.

 

[Silent Alarm]

the Vic government, puts pretty much stuff all money in to the stadium. the MCG is what is it is because of the AFL, hence why there are contracts in place that so many finals & the grand final must be played there until 2037

its in NSW that seem to be very fond of handing out money to various stadiums, even though they might see a hand full of games every year.

It might sound nice but it could seriously affect and jeopardise a club. Imagine, say, the Western Oval. Let's say it hasn't had a discernible update since 2004, the Bulldogs are losing money because last season, people weren't willing to trek out their as the ground was falling apart, cold, the toilets at half the areas were local-level. The Bulldogs are relying on their (I'm guessing) very safe Labor seat to get two new stands, proper toilets, everything like that. But the Labor party never offer: why would they? People in Footscray will vote for them regardless. The new Western Oval would be something Labor would only whip out should the Liberals, somehow, climb up into contention.

So, the Bullies are left to consider two things: upgrading the stadium themselves, moving to another suburban ground, moving to Etihad...

Ultimately, this'll be the end of a lot of grounds in Sydney.

There are some good photos of the concourse and inside here, too: http://www.austadiums.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2708&start=300

Now, this thing was developed in like 2010 for St George-Illawarra to use six, seven times a year. Which is absolutely ludicrous. I can bet in 15 years, this thing might be the training ground for the Dragons NRL at the absolute most. I cannot see the NRL patronising local grounds when all they do is offer unprofessional environments. The clubs will slowly go to the SFS, Homebush, Parramatta... clubs'll play one to two games, then get no funding to develop them, and then we'll see what happened to Vic Park, Western Oval, and Optus... they'll slowly go.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jubilee_Oval#Criticism

 

[bombersfan4000]

It might sound nice but it could seriously affect and jeopardise a club. Imagine, say, the Western Oval. Let's say it hasn't had a discernible update since 2004, the Bulldogs are losing money because last season, people weren't willing to trek out their as the ground was falling apart, cold, the toilets at half the areas were local-level. The Bulldogs are relying on their (I'm guessing) very safe Labor seat to get two new stands, proper toilets, everything like that. But the Labor party never offer: why would they? People in Footscray will vote for them regardless. The new Western Oval would be something Labor would only whip out should the Liberals, somehow, climb up into contention.

So, the Bullies are left to consider two things: upgrading the stadium themselves, moving to another suburban ground, moving to Etihad...

Ultimately, this'll be the end of a lot of grounds in Sydney.

There are some good photos of the concourse and inside here, too: http://www.austadiums.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2708&start=300

Now, this thing was developed in like 2010 for St George-Illawarra to use six, seven times a year. Which is absolutely ludicrous. I can bet in 15 years, this thing might be the training ground for the Dragons NRL at the absolute most. I cannot see the NRL patronising local grounds when all they do is offer unprofessional environments. The clubs will slowly go to the SFS, Homebush, Parramatta... clubs'll play one to two games, then get no funding to develop them, and then we'll see what happened to Vic Park, Western Oval, and Optus... they'll slowly go.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jubilee_Oval#Criticism

the NSW government has stated that it wants to stop surbaban ground funding.
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sp...f-major-stadiums/story-fni3fbgz-1226986971004.
but who knows how despite the local pollies are to keep their seats.
but like in the photos they have several of the suburban stadiums similar to jubilee, brookevale, Leichart ovall, remondis stadium, penrith, who have had millions pumped in to them for years, something the victorian/ federal government never did

there are teams like the west tigers who are on their last leg, a financial time disaster & no fans, along with the council, have applied for funding to upgrade cambletown stadium, one of two of their home grounds

looking through all of them, makes you rather jealous that the AFL doesn't use them any more, but in hindsight the AFL did outgrow them decades ago.
The bit i cant fathom for years those old AFL suburban grounds where left there to rot, junction oval & morabbin, only recently having plans announced to be fixed up.

Now we have cricket Victoria who couldn't find an alternative venue that is of first class standard, so play a shield game, in a state filed with ovals not rectangular fields

 

[speedybundy]

Simonds Stadium is first class standard, I think they'll probably play those matches during the WC there (it should be being utilized during the WC anyway).

 

[The_Reaper]

Simonds Stadium is first class standard, I think they'll probably play those matches during the WC there (it should be being utilized during the WC anyway).

Simonds Stadium doesn't have the nets facilities or the actual dimensions to be first class standard.