Last in 2015, First in 2016

[Mateyman]

 

[mike123]

We'll finish to 4 injury permitting.

 

[Thirteen]

Anyone be happy to finish last next year?
This is assuming we can do it in such a way that it doesn't poison our club or players like our close neighbours down the road.

Realistically if injuries don't go our way similar to 2014 we could finish last without tanking.

So finish last, get Dangerfield through free agency, deal with GWS on Cameron or we pick him up for nothing with first pick in the Preseason draft, and have draft pick 1 in the National draft?

Would you be happy with a year of developing youngsters and pain, if it meant success in 2016?

Pies á la 1977, but one step better?


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Love your enthusiasm!!

 

[CFC2010]

Full respect to the Hawks and Cats (yes they had father sons) who did it the way it should be.
No players complaining about their wage and losing arguably their best players and still winning premierships!

The Lions/Bears are the best team I have witnessed in the back-back-back years but even that team had help from the AFL.

We are not the Saints or Demons (lol yin and yang!) so tanking or accepting mediocrity should not be in our vocabulary.

BUT we are Collingwood and we always do things the hard way.
We shouldn't be content with "A" premiership ever and unfortunately I think as club we have been (1990) and are (2010) at the moment.

I really hope this mentality changes but finishing last to me just means we are going backwards as a club!

 

[76woodenspooners]

I think this is what happens when folks (inside and outside the club) get fixated on the whole "the club exists to win Premierships" thing.

That leads to all kinds of crazy "whatever it takes" mentality ... Essendon getting into trouble with PEDs, Melbourne getting into trouble with tanking, Carlton getting into trouble with the salary cap breaches.

IMHO, the fundamental purpose of the club should be something like "To be a football club that the members and fans can be proud of".

Of course winning premierships contributes to that, but there's a lot more the club can do to make us proud of them.

So to address the question in the OP ...

Q: "Would you be happy to finish last?"

A: No way! Yes, I understand there are prizes given for last, but there's no pride in finishing last.

Last is for losers

Imagine the taunts from your Carlton mates ... Do you think that is worth the number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine the smirk from your St Kilda mates when they beat us ... Do you think that worth the number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine Caro and Robbo's articles about us in a wooden spoon year! ... Do you think that is worth a number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine sitting through a crap game of footy at the MCG in the middle of winter and it's raining and we're getting flogged - imagine nearly all the season like that ... Do you think that's worth a number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine getting trolled mercilessly on BigFooty by opposition supporters week after week - or worse, imagine they pity us - or even worse still, they ignore us as irrelevant ... Do you think any of that's worth a number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

The only advantage to coming last is that there might be a naïve little tacker out there who thinks that winning the woodenspoon is a good thing (winning is winning, right?) and so picks Collingwood as his team ... hence my username

 

[Jombob1986]

 

[jonbe54]

Dave m8 I already lived through the shame and utter desolation of finishing last in '76 when we had no choice in the matter.

Finish last on purpose???????

NEVER.

 

[mike123]

I think this is what happens when folks (inside and outside the club) get fixated on the whole "the club exists to win Premierships" thing.

That leads to all kinds of crazy "whatever it takes" mentality ... Essendon getting into trouble with PEDs, Melbourne getting into trouble with tanking, Carlton getting into trouble with the salary cap breaches.

IMHO, the fundamental purpose of the club should be something like "To be a football club that the members and fans can be proud of".

Of course winning premierships contributes to that, but there's a lot more the club can do to make us proud of them.

So to address the question in the OP ...

Q: "Would you be happy to finish last?"

A: No way! Yes, I understand there are prizes given for last, but there's no pride in finishing last. Last is for losers.

Imagine the taunts from your Carlton mates ... Do you think that is worth the number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine the smirk from your St Kilda mates when they beat us ... Do you think that worth the number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine Caro and Robbo's articles about us in a wooden spoon year! ... Do you think that is worth a number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine sitting through a crap game of footy at the MCG in the middle of winter and it's raining and we're getting flogged - imagine nearly all the season like that ... Do you think that's worth a number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine getting trolled mercilessly on BigFooty by opposition supporters week after week - or worse, imagine they pity us - or even worse still, they ignore us as irrelevant ... Do you think any of that's worth a number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

The only advantage of coming last is that there might be a naïve little tacker out there who thinks that winning the woodenspoon is a good thing (winning is winning, right?) and so picks Collingwood as his team ... hence my username

Finally some sense.

 

[Horaceg]

If every wooden spoon gave as a premiership I'd happily finished last every second year.


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It's about earning a premiership, trying not to win goes against everything I have ever been taught, throwing games for the sole purpose of gaining and advantage is not right. IMHO, will leave it at that.

 

[wednesdaywarrior]

I agree to a point. But money gets you players regardless. Tom Boyd is a perfect example of cash over hope.
I think if you sell the concept of underperformance and can grab 2 or 3 key players with this notion, the others players coming too and cash that it can happen.
But you're right, and players chase success for unders too!


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True dat.

Didaicos - close to best username on BF!

Conceded. Boyd and Griffin were both exceptions in that they moved for $. It seems in each case there was also extreme workplace staleness (Griffin) and familiarity with other young players (Boyd).

But as some have suggested, the Dogs have probably played a big hand with Boyd and committed a sizeable chunk of TPP on one so far untried player. This is not a risk that you should have to take if you are a club that more naturally draws free agents through hope of success. Sydney were able to play a similar hand with Franklin because they had COLA.

The best way I reckon to draw free agents is the build something good and they will come model. If we look like we are a stable club moving in the right direction with good coaches and facilities where you will be looked after and have a chance to succeed, they will come.

That's why in addition to seeming like we are doing well on field we also need to start seeming like we have stability off field. Hopefully no more moody adolescents, celebrities and rat packers packing up and leaving. If we haven't properly replaced Geoff Walsh in player welfare we need to sort that out. We need to stop every second player getting injured, we need to give the appearance of professionalism and stability. The best way to do this is to BE professional and stable.

 

[Lord Wilberforce]

I wouldn't be happy, but the added benefits would make it a lot more bearable than finishing 10th.

For all those saying we should never tank, well, we don't have to. We are well on our way to being a bottom 4 club on our own.

Buckley has already brought the pain, so it's about time that we got some gain!

 

[CFC2010]

I think this is what happens when folks (inside and outside the club) get fixated on the whole "the club exists to win Premierships" thing.

That leads to all kinds of crazy "whatever it takes" mentality ... Essendon getting into trouble with PEDs, Melbourne getting into trouble with tanking, Carlton getting into trouble with the salary cap breaches.

IMHO, the fundamental purpose of the club should be something like "To be a football club that the members and fans can be proud of".

Of course winning premierships contributes to that, but there's a lot more the club can do to make us proud of them.

Think back to the moments of pride in 2015 ... Tom Langdon in his first game turning Balentine inside out ... Cory Gault kicking his first goal - straight as a a die - from a set shot in the forward pocket ... ANZAC day ... Beating Carlton (yet again) with a lacklustre Thomas ... Beating Port ... Checking out the gems on the Collingwood Forever website ... Eddie and the senior management getting up in front of the members to give an honest and candid account of the season ... Our youngsters' gutsy win with only one on the bench against GWS ... Our VFL team qualifying for finals for the first time in many years.

So to address the question in the OP ...

Q: "Would you be happy to finish last?"

A: No way! Yes, I understand there are prizes given for last, but there's no pride in finishing last. Last is for losers.

Imagine the taunts from your Carlton mates ... Do you think that is worth the number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine the smirk from your St Kilda mates when they beat us ... Do you think that worth the number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine Caro and Robbo's articles about us in a wooden spoon year! ... Do you think that is worth a number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine sitting through a crap game of footy at the MCG in the middle of winter and it's raining and we're getting flogged - imagine nearly all the season like that ... Do you think that's worth a number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

Imagine getting trolled mercilessly on BigFooty by opposition supporters week after week - or worse, imagine they pity us - or even worse still, they ignore us as irrelevant ... Do you think any of that's worth a number 1 draft pick? Me neither!

The only advantage of coming last is that there might be a naïve little tacker out there who thinks that winning the woodenspoon is a good thing (winning is winning, right?) and so picks Collingwood as his team ... hence my username

Sorry 76Woodenspooners but my dream was to witness a Pies premiership. I was standing behind the goals in 2010 when the ball bounced towards Milne and the truth is I nearly vomited because I had already thought that he would kick the winning goal!

Fortunately for me everybody jumped up at that second and I finally realised that it did not happen and the rest is history as they say.

BUT and it is a big BUT I am not satisfied with just one. Call me greedy if you like but we follow a club that is in the "business" to win premierships. I am sorry to sound heartless but everything else is irrelevant to me.

I loved the atmosphere and passion of Footy at Vic Park and will hold it dear to my heart but we are not a charity and I know premierships are very hard to come by, but what should always be our number one goal is a PREMIERSHIP!

End of story for me anyway!

 

[DIDAIC0S]

It's about earning a premiership, trying not to win goes against everything I have ever been taught, throwing games for the sole purpose of gaining and advantage is not right. IMHO, will leave it at that.

The post you quoted doesn't say anything about throwing games.

It's says that if after every wooden spoon we were guaranteed a premiership that I'd be happy to get wooden spoons all the time cos that would mean we were also getting flags.


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[76woodenspooners]

Sorry 76Woodenspooners but my dream was to witness a Pies premiership. I was standing behind the goals in 2010 when the ball bounced towards Milne and the truth is I nearly vomited because I had already thought that he would kick the winning goal!

Fortunately for me everybody jumped up at that second and I finally realised that it did not happen and the rest is history as they say.

BUT and it is a big BUT I am not satisfied with just one. Call me greedy if you like but we follow a club that is in the "business" to win premierships. I am sorry to sound heartless but everything else is irrelevant to me.

I loved the atmosphere and passion of Footy at Vic Park and will hold it dear to my heart but we are not a charity and I know premierships are very hard to come by, but what should always be our number one goal is a PREMIERSHIP!

End of story for me anyway!

Why do you want Collingwood to win Premierships? (Sincere question)

 

[CFC2010]

Because that means my team is the the BEST!

When it comes to sport they only give a gold medal to one person.

Unfortunately when it comes to sport everything else after that is irrelevant!

Like I said......and I don't want to sound rude but everything else after that is irrelevant

P.S Just like Sydney this year.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Because that means my team is the the BEST!

And the reason you want your team to be the best is for bragging rights, for self pride and all those good things?

So what's wrong with the club's purpose to "be a club its members and supporters could be proud of?"

That's kind of like winning premierships, isn't it? But more, so much more!

-----

Let me put it this way: if a banned substance came along that could improve players' performances by 20% and it was guaranteed completely undetectable. Guaranteed the club would never get caught. Nobody would know - except you. It would massively improve our chances of winning a premiership. Would you want the club to take it?

I'd answer an emphatic "No" to that ... It's not just about winning.

 

[TradeDraft]

And the reason you want your team to be the best is for bragging rights, for self pride and all those good things?

So what's wrong with the club's purpose to "be a club its members and supporters could be proud of?"

That's kind of like winning premierships, isn't it? But more, so much more!

-----

Let me put it this way: if a banned substance came along that could improve players' performances by 20% and it was guaranteed completely undetectable. Guaranteed the club would never get caught. Nobody would know - except you. It would massively improve our chances of winning a premiership. Would you want the club to take it?

I'd answer an emphatic "No" to that ... It's not just about winning.

Clubs are all about making $$$$ now and they are more Business/Cooperation than a Sporting club

 

[CFC2010]

And the reason you want your team to be the best is for bragging rights, for self pride and all those good things?

So what's wrong with the club's purpose to "be a club its members and supporters could be proud of?"

That's kind of like winning premierships, isn't it? But more, so much more!

-----

Let me put it this way: if a banned substance came along that could improve players' performances by 20% and it was guaranteed completely undetectable. Guaranteed the club would never get caught. Nobody would know - except you. It would massively improve our chances of winning a premiership. Would you want the club to take it?

I'd answer an emphatic "No" to that ... It's not just about winning.

Like I have told you in the past. I really started following the Pies during the Tony Shaw days. I is in the OLD Ponsford Stand as a general admission member and we lost pretty much every week. Jason Wild still gives me nightmares but I still went every week. That is why 2010 as a Legend Member it was is so much more pleasurable for ME!

I don't want my club to cheat like Essendon but I want them to aspire to be more successful than the Hawks/Cats.

Is that too much to ask for?

 

[CFC2010]

Clubs are all about making $$$$ now and they are more Business/Cooperation than a Sporting club

Yes they are Dave but if they don't aim to win the Cup what is the point in all that money when they are a Club at the end of the day?

 

[TradeDraft]

Yes they are Dave but if they don't aim to win the Cup what is the point in all that money when they are a Club at the end of the day?

Of Course they aim for the Cup as it means more Members and more $$$$

 

[76woodenspooners]

Like I have told you in the past. I really started following the Pies during the Tony Shaw days. I is in the OLD Ponsford Stand as a general admission member and we lost pretty much every week. Jason Wild still gives me nightmares but I still went every week. That is why 2010 as a Legend Member it was is so much more pleasurable for ME!

I don't want my club to cheat like Essendon but I want them to aspire to be more successful than the Hawks/Cats.

Is that too much to ask for?

We're not disagreeing.

We both want our club to win Premierships.

I'm just suggesting that premierships should be borne of some higher purpose ... The means to the end; rather than the end itself.

 

[jjsmitty8]

Make it your sig, copy it and save it in your files, screen shot it, whatever. We will absolutely, definitely, 100% guaranteed NOT finish last in 2015. I am certain of this.

 

[sirene]

Yeah, nah....ABSOLUTELY NOT!
Out of curiousity OP, do you go to games?
I personally go to games to see our team win. That excites me, that is my passion. If I had the thought; "I hope we lose", I really can not see myself, dressing myself, my kids; paying for parking, food, beer.....just can not see my passion surviving a loser mentality.
Of course I would love a premiership, but I can not see myself loving to watch a team that does not play their heart out.....maybe just me....

 

[CFC2010]

Of Course they aim for the Cup as it means more Members and more $$$$

Dave we have enough $$$$$ and members $$$$ that the money becomes irrelevant to me.

What I am trying to say Dave is that the Premiership is the Clubs only purpose! At the moment we all agree Eddie has established a very successful business model..........just follow that up with premierships and if he wanted to start a new religion I would be willing to sign up! LOL

 

[76woodenspooners]

Clubs are all about making $$$$ now and they are more Business/Cooperation than a Sporting club

Of Course they aim for the Cup as it means more Members and more $$$$

Why do you think the club are focused on making money?

For normal businesses it's so they can pay the shareholders (the owners) profits.

Collingwood are not allowed to do that.

Dave, you're a member, so you're kind of like an owner, except that it is against the law for Collingwoof to pay you profits.

Eddie and the board are volunteers (the don't get paid). Players salaries are capped. Football department spending is becoming capped.

So what's the point of the club being focussed on money?