Lions Privacy Breach

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Quigley

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 23, 2006
8,701
10,317
Bangalla
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
I note that the Lions are trying to sweep the Pinskier privacy breach under the carpet. I would encourage everyone make as much noise as they can. The actions of the club to date on this matter have been quite simply appalling.

Below is the gist of my complaint to the Office of the Australian Information Commissioner. I would encourage others to consider doing something similar. I have tried to get the club to do better but they have stonewalled.

In September 2013 I was contacted by email by a Dr Henry Pinskier who was soliciting support for a campaign to appoint directors at a scheduled EGM. I am a member of the Brisbane Lions and I am given to understand that all members were contacted by Dr Pinskier who is unrelated to the club but is a known associate of at least one Lions director, Cameron Millner. Dr Pinskier claimed to have gained the email addresses from unnamed, but legal sources but he could not have done so for either myself or for many other members (this is apparent from online discussions on BigFooty and other fan sites). The only place I use my work email for AFL related matters is with my membership with the Brisbane Lions and so the only place Dr Pinskier could have gotten my email address is from the club or a party to whom the club has given my details.

Therefore I have great concerns that Dr Pinskier and others would have access to the full membership date including personal information such as my address, credit card numbers, date of birth etc. The fact that Dr Pinskier has my email address that could only have come from the club in these circumstances is very strong prima facie evidence that the Brisbane Lions have breached the Privacy Act. There is simply no other explanation that is rationally possible.

The Club claims to have investigated the matter and released the following statement:

Friday 8 November 2013
Club Statement

The Brisbane Lions have completed an investigation into emails distributed to some club members by Dr Henry Pinskier.
The review by the Club’s integrity officer found no evidence at this point in time to suggest data had been given to any person outside the Club.
The investigation involved interviews with a range of staff and a review of the Club’s mail server.
Lions Chairman Bob Sharpless said he and other Directors was satisfied with the result of the investigation.
Mr Sharpless met with Dr Pinskier and is satisfied the email addresses were acquired independently from sources outside the Club.
“My discussions with Dr Pinskier showed his businesses have the capabilities to generate an email list from publically available information,” said Mr Sharpless.
“I am happy with the thoroughness of the Club’s investigation and the Board is satisfied with its findings.”
The Club has no further comment to make at this stage.
Clare Pettyfor
Media Officer
Brisbane Lions AFC
Tel: 07 3335 1729 Mob: 0412 635 741 Email: cpettfyor@lions.com.au

I had complained the the club but was not contacted during the supposed investigation. No members who expressed similar concerns were contacted as far as I am aware. I note from the wording of the above statement that it would appear that the club did not question directors (who are known associates of Dr Pinskier), did not investigate other server downloads of the membership data (just the mail server) nor did they investigate third parties who had access to the information (e.g. mailhouse service providers, the AFL etc). In short it appears that very little has been done to investigate what I would consider a very serious breach of the privacy of members.
 
Below is a related snippet The Lion's Roar just emailed to their list:

2. Members' privacy concerns.

We are dissatisfied with the club's findings of the internal investigation regarding the mass e-mail of members by Dr Henry Pinskier in the lead up to the EGM. Our view has been informed and reinforced by voluminous feedback we've received from irate members on the issue. These members received emails from Dr Pinskier to email addresses which had only ever been provided uniquely to the Brisbane Lions. Other members were addressed by name/email address combinations registered uniquely with the Brisbane Lions (eg wife's name / husband's email address). Furthermore, emails were sent segmented by State - ie different emails were sent to those who lived in Victoria vs Queensland.

As accomplished internet techies, the co-founders of The Lion's Roar do not accept that it is possible to garner the level of detail demonstrated in the emails from social media or social networking, as has been claimed. The club and the AFL is governed by the Privacy Act and under no circumstances should a third party have access to members' contact details without their express consent.

We believe members deserve better than an announcement buried on the club’s website late on a Friday night, with a few paragraphs giving the club the all clear.

We intend to put questions to the Board about this at the AGM and we would encourage other attendees to do the same. After all the recent unrest, this is an opportunity for the Board to start with a clean slate and to engage transparently with members. We sincerely hope they take that chance. The health of our club depends on it.
 
Yes, received that email not long ago..

...very pleased and thankful to TLR people for their work in dealing with the club on our behalf.....and asking the questions that need to be asked...the continued presence and pressure of TLR will hopefully make the club far more accountable than has been done in the past..

..and that they realise their members DO have a voice and expect to be heard and consulted.

..again, well done LTR:thumbsu:
 

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Well the list was obtained from somewhere, and I now believe that it actually could have come from outside our club.

I am just not sure if or how to bring it up at the AGM.
 
Whether it was the club or not, it was clearly a membership data base that was used. I hate how the club has accepted that he somehow got this info from social media, it's a bit of a slap in the face.
 
How have you come to that view CTD? How could any external entity compile an accurate Lions membership list with location data?

I think CTD is referring to the fact that the AFL also have the list, so it could be someone linked to the AFL proper (and not the Lions).
 
I don't know who has the data base, but I highly doubt it's something only our club has. AFl, whatever company makes the membership packs and probably some major sponsors could probably get the details.

I'm sure some of us here has parents or a relative who is a member of the Lions, yet has little to no online foot print that you could connect them as a member, living in a particular state and know the first name of.
 
Oh, and don't forget that they are contacted on the email address which is the one registered with the club. Must be lotto like chances of nailing every members correct registered email address with information found publicly online. But remember, they weren't perfect, they contacted Pies members by mistake... Not pies supporters, nor lions supporters but not members, they hit members.
 
I don't know who has the data base, but I highly doubt it's something only our club has. AFl, whatever company makes the membership packs and probably some major sponsors could probably get the details.

I'm sure some of us here has parents or a relative who is a member of the Lions, yet has little to no online foot print that you could connect them as a member, living in a particular state and know the first name of.

The thing is that the club remains responsible for our data though and they should be doing everything they can to find out where the leak has come from.
 
How have you come to that view CTD? How could any external entity compile an accurate Lions membership list with location data?

As Skoob mentioned the AFL has our list, and in fact I found out the AFL has the power to modify my personal details on the Lions membership database without the Lions knowing.

It happened to me, so I know it as fact. I updated my personal details with the Lions, through our membership department and the details were changed back by the AFL due to the fact my Lions details did not match the details that the AFL held with my completely separate AFL membership.

I don't know how the privacy breach happened, but would be surprised if it were a sponsor as I would be surprised if info they received a broken down list of full members over season tickets etc..


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My point is that if the Club says they don't know how our list was leaked, they may be telling the truth.

We need Mulder and Skully to sort thus out for us. :)


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The thing is that the club remains responsible for our data though and they should be doing everything they can to find out where the leak has come from.
Whilst this bit is true, and their statement regarding the "investigation" was pissweak, and they need to come up with something better, I believe the AFL owns the information and certainly have it all. The fine print also allows them to share aspects of the member data with other clubs and third parties.
As posted elsewhere, as per the privacy statement, concerns should be lodged with the AFL ;
12 Privacy complaints
Please direct all privacy complaints to the AFL’s Privacy Officer. At all times, privacy complaints:
  • will be treated seriously;
  • will be dealt with promptly;
  • will be dealt with in a confidential manner; and
  • will not affect your existing obligations or affect the commercial arrangements between you and the AFL.
The AFL’s Privacy Officer will commence an investigation into your complaint. You will be informed of the outcome of your complaint following completion of the investigation.
The AFL and club can do with our personal information, anything it wants allowable by law;
7 Use & Disclosure of Personal Information
The AFL collects and discloses your personal information for purposes including, without limitation:
  • to verify your identity;
  • to improve AFL Online;
  • to provide, and to assist AFL Clubs with providing products and services to you, to manage and account for the products and services, and to improve the products and services;
  • to manage AFL and AFL Club’s relationship(s) with you;
  • to provide you with information about events, products and/or services that may interest you;
  • to facilitate the internal business operations of the AFL and the AFL’s Clubs;
  • to promote and market AFL events, products or services; and
  • to enable corporate partners and sponsors of the AFL, including AFL Clubs and the AFL’s digital rights partner Telstra, as well as their related bodies corporate, to market and promote their products and services to you.
  • to our third party service providers in connection with any of the above.
The AFL and AFL Clubs may also disclose personal information where it is otherwise permitted to do so by law.
I,m not a lawyer, so the Privacy Act reads like a Dr Seuss book to me, but there seems to be a fair scope of how organisations can share information.
In short;
a. I don't think any laws have been broken here, but,
b. It is more than fairly reasonable that members expect and deserve a truthful explanation of how Pinskier may have obtained this information. Even if it is beyond the control of either the AFL or Lions,
members should be advised of the likely or possible means the information was shared.
c. For the club to claim to have completed a thorough investigation and support the explanation given by Pinskier is unacceptable regardless of propriety.
 
I've been a bit out of this for a while, but after the Lions statement came out I emailed them immediately with my reasons why I think it's rubbish (some of you may recall, I had a unique email address set up just for correspondence with the Lions, and that's what got emails sent to it).

End result was that I actually received a phone call from the club and spoke for a good 10 or 15 minutes about the matter, and they took me through all the evidence and even read to me some statements from their investigation - and for what it's worth, I do believe the club is not at fault here. What I did learn from this conversation though, was that as some of you have already alluded to, is that the AFL has this membership database - in fact all our memberships are processed into the one database. I checked this out by visiting a few other club membership websites - Adelaide, Sydney, Collingwood (then deleted my browser history quick *ing smart) - and discovered that they all run through the same website.

This has been confirmed to me recently by two emails that I received from the AFL about the opportunity to attend the NAB draft on the Gold Coast - one of these emails was sent to my lions-specific email address - the other was sent to one I used for a Q-Clash facebook competition back in 2012 some time.

TL;DR, I believe the AFL is the one with the loose lips - not the Lions. It might also explain why that initial reply email he was sending around was talking about how they had sent early emails off to Collingwood supporters too.

edit: ruddy, hehe - that's definitely not what I typed! :p
 
Well hello...

Telechoice Customer Records found in Bushland Shipping Container

Channel 9's A Current Affair television show will at 7pm tonight (23 April 2015) announce that a shipping container found in a block of land in Hastings, Victoria, has been found to contain an as-yet unnamed telco’s customer records.

ACA describes it has a ‘giant shipping container found dumped in local bushland with all your personal details.’

Customer records included the Brisbane Lions, a political party, a government authority and many individuals with their bank details, home addresses, passports, Medicae cards and licence photocopies amongst the records.
 

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