Luke Hodge or Sam Mitchell

[Procrastinator35]

Stats don't tell the whole story, just look at Dane Swan and Cyril Rioli.

Don't get me wrong, Gibbo was good but he didn't have the impact of a Hodge, Lewis or Mitch. To put it in context, the ball went inside forward 50 for the Swans 44 times yet Buddy still managed to kick 4.2 on Gibbo.

From memory, Buddy kicked at least 2 of his goals on Lake & Spangher....Seem to remember both of em riding Buddy into the turf after he marked & goaled....That's the way we roll these days, by rotating our blokes in defence, forward & the midfield!

Gibbo was easily the best defender on the ground!

 

[cryptor]

Stats don't tell the whole story, just look at Dane Swan and Cyril Rioli.

Don't get me wrong, Gibbo was good but he didn't have the impact of a Hodge, Lewis or Mitch. To put it in context, the ball went inside forward 50 for the Swans 44 times yet Buddy still managed to kick 4.2 on Gibbo.

Only kicked one on Gibson.

First one on Lake (elbow into the ear).
Second one on Lake (with Gibbo rushing back to go 3rd up).
Third one on Gibson (delivered low and taken on the lead, not much he could do).
Fourth one on Lake (holding the jumper).

 

[seysearles]

I am not sure I agree with the "Hodge's best is better than Mitchell's best" argument. Sam Mitchell's best is bloody incredible. I personally think that he is one of the best players to ever pull on the brown and gold colours. Both players have been a very very very big part of our renaissance since 2007 but Mitchell has done it way more often and just as well in my opinion. Hodge as a symbol and a leader is a wonderful figurehead to have in the team but as a player I would take Mitch every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

Sam Mitchell (Career Brownlow votes: 178)



Luke Hodge (Career Brownlow votes: 115)

 

[heh]

Hodge flashier
Mitch more consistent.

 

[Brishawk]

If you take out the two seasons of hodge being injured has Mitchell really being that much more consistent? I think hodge suffers on this point because he doesn't play the same position week in week out or even throughout a match. Hodge has consistently been the best in the position he has played in thus 3 AA. Unlucky not to get another aa in 2014 and 2013 too. Was clearly better on hbf than Mackie in 2013!

Hodge is the answer to any problem. Kicks goals, saves goals, heck he even played ruck such is his ability to compete anywhere anytime.

And he is just about the most inspirational player I have ever seen. Smother and tackle to save the game against port. Wow! In the first quarter of the 2014 gf scores were close and a team had just kicked a goal (I think us). We had been good but not great to that point. Hodge goes into the middle and lands a massive tackle. The intensity of that tackle sparked a shift in the entire team. From that moment on we smashed them in tackles. Breust did his big hit only a minute or so later and the rest is history.

And no one plays better on the biggest stage. Has been awarded votes in 3 of his 4 grand final appearances. We won all 3. Both are legends but have to go hodge as he wins us the games and has sacrificed his personal statistics more for the team than any other player.

 

[bris tarangau]

If you take out the two seasons of hodge being injured has Mitchell really being that much more consistent? I think hodge suffers on this point because he doesn't play the same position week in week out or even throughout a match. Hodge has consistently been the best in the position he has played in thus 3 AA. Unlucky not to get another aa in 2014 and 2013 too. Was clearly better on hbf than Mackie in 2013!

Hodge is the answer to any problem. Kicks goals, saves goals, heck he even played ruck such is his ability to compete anywhere anytime.

And he is just about the most inspirational player I have ever seen. Smother and tackle to save the game against port. Wow! In the first quarter of the 2014 gf scores were close and a team had just kicked a goal (I think us). We had been good but not great to that point. Hodge goes into the middle and lands a massive tackle. The intensity of that tackle sparked a shift in the entire team. From that moment on we smashed them in tackles. Breust did his big hit only a minute or so later and the rest is history.

And no one plays better on the biggest stage. Has been awarded votes in 3 of his 4 grand final appearances. We won all 3. Both are legends but have to go hodge as he wins us the games and has sacrificed his personal statistics more for the team than any other player.

Fully agree, BH. Is Hodge now the games best Mr Fix It and how does that compare with past players?
Hodge's versatility has made Clarko re-modelled this team into more versatile unit.

 

[Davo23]

Mitchell.

Natalie Portman.

I think I'm leaning more towards this.

Jennifer Lawrence has the great personality, but Natalie Portman is more intelligent.




As for Hodge or Mitch, I don't have a clue!

 

[MinerBoy]

My avatar. My favourite ever Hawk. Brishawk summed it up really well for me. Nothing against Mitch, but I'd let the wifey have a go at Hodgey.

 

[heh]

Hodge definitely has form dips though, not just injuries.
Whereas Mitch doesn't seem to have the dips very often.
So I will go against the tide of man love and pick Mitchell.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Mitchell's overall record in finals gets overlooked due to the fact he is so heavily tagged in Grand Finals, with 2014 being the obvious exception....Hodge has had no such tactic to deal with on GF day!

If you were to calculate the amount of times for which both have been in the best 3 players in finals, then Mitchell actually edges it 11/8 overall, with Mitch having played 1 more final than Luke.

Mitch has been named in the best half dozen 13 times to Hodges' 11.

If you calculate their standings in the annals of Hawk Finals history, then Mitchell's 13 games named as best, ranks right up there alongside the likes of Platten, Matthews & Knights....all of whom only trail Michael Tuck on 15.....Next best are Hodge & Ayres on 11 each. Followed by Sewell, Scott & Kel Moore on 10; with Dipper 9 & Lewis 8, making up the top dozen finals performers in our history.

People often overlook the fact, that it is Sammy who usually dominates both the Qualifying & Preliminary finals, in order to get us to the big dance in the first place. Which explains why such a heavy premium is placed on tagging him out of GF'S by our opponents!

No one could argue the fact that Hodge is the superior player in terms of skill/class: Both in the air, or on the ground, in terms of general field kicking range & goal kicking ability.

But to argue that Hodge's finals record is superior to Mitch's, is in fact, a misnomer!

 

[Rowie6]

I would take Hodgey just on his leadership and what he does in the heat of the battle.

 

[Davo23]

I would take Hodgey just on his leadership and what he does in the heat of the battle.

You mean, like kissing opposition players?

That's taking leadership too far!

 

[flinchfree]

No one could argue the fact that Hodge is the superior player in terms of skill/class: Both in the air, or on the ground, in terms of general field kicking range & goal kicking ability.

I'd argue it.
Don't think Hodgey has anywhere near Mitchell's kicking skills, or handball skills, or evasive skills.
Skill/Class = Mitch
Inspiration = Hodge.

While Hodge has turned up in GF's, he's missed out against some others (we shall not name) more often than he'd be comfortable with. He also manages to turn quiet 1st halves into timely 2nd halves that kind of wipe away early consternation.

I'd take Mitch, but only because his skill set is harder to find.

Go on, start booing..

 

[cryptor]

I'd argue it.
Don't think Hodgey has anywhere near Mitchell's kicking skills, or handball skills, or evasive skills.
Skill/Class = Mitch
Inspiration = Hodge.

While Hodge has turned up in GF's, he's missed out against some others (we shall not name) more often than he'd be comfortable with. He also manages to turn quiet 1st halves into timely 2nd halves that kind of wipe away early consternation.

I'd take Mitch, but only because his skill set is harder to find.

Go on, start booing..

He was saying his skill/class was better than Mitchell's in the air, on the ground, and that his kicking range and goal kicking were better. All of which I'd agree with except for the on the ground part. Not entirely sure what he was referring to exactly. Only thing I reckon Hodge is better at on ground level is going in hard for a contested ball (not that Mitch doesn't do that, but Hodge does it with complete reckless abandon for his own well being and puts some opposition stars on the back foot).

 

[Blaze Storm]

Mitchell.

Natalie Portman.

Mitchell in the middle and Hodge downfield.

Ditto for Nat Portman and Jen Lawrence respectively

 

[Procrastinator35]

I'd argue it.
Don't think Hodgey has anywhere near Mitchell's kicking skills, or handball skills, or evasive skills.
Skill/Class = Mitch
Inspiration = Hodge.

While Hodge has turned up in GF's, he's missed out against some others (we shall not name) more often than he'd be comfortable with. He also manages to turn quiet 1st halves into timely 2nd halves that kind of wipe away early consternation.

I'd take Mitch, but only because his skill set is harder to find.

Go on, start booing..

Fair Point flinchfree....Perhaps I would have been better off saying in terms of his outside game.....Can't remember the last time I saw Mitch kick a 60 meter drop punt pass either left or right footed down a team-mates throat....Not to mention snaffle a goal from over 40 meters out....Or out mark an opposition opponent in the air who has 10-15kgs & 4 inches advantage!....anyhow I digress

Would never argue about Sammy's elite ball-use & retention skills in & under nor around the ground.....IMO, He is second to none in the competition in terms of these skills either on his left or right hand sides without a doubt. Though Hodge is equally adept in the middle as he is down back or forward of center.

Both are champions, & if pressed, much like you, I'd still take Sammy over Hodge for his overall consistency....But just to re-iterate, Hodge is the better natural athlete, with far more flexibility & with better ground coverage & range in his kicking/marking abilities.

 

[Agent Smith]

If you take out the two seasons of hodge being injured has Mitchell really being that much more consistent? I think hodge suffers on this point because he doesn't play the same position week in week out or even throughout a match. Hodge has consistently been the best in the position he has played in thus 3 AA. Unlucky not to get another aa in 2014 and 2013 too. Was clearly better on hbf than Mackie in 2013!

Hodge is the answer to any problem. Kicks goals, saves goals, heck he even played ruck such is his ability to compete anywhere anytime.

And he is just about the most inspirational player I have ever seen. Smother and tackle to save the game against port. Wow! In the first quarter of the 2014 gf scores were close and a team had just kicked a goal (I think us). We had been good but not great to that point. Hodge goes into the middle and lands a massive tackle. The intensity of that tackle sparked a shift in the entire team. From that moment on we smashed them in tackles. Breust did his big hit only a minute or so later and the rest is history.

And no one plays better on the biggest stage. Has been awarded votes in 3 of his 4 grand final appearances. We won all 3. Both are legends but have to go hodge as he wins us the games and has sacrificed his personal statistics more for the team than any other player.

Nailed it. It's great that Mitchell has earned the title of the extractor but Hodge was the one to sacrifice his on-ball game to go back into defence and shore it up in 2008, which was what won us the flag that year. Only recently has Mitchell gone back to play as a HBF, but if Hodge had the opportunity to play mid throughout his career, then many people would probably be changing their votes. I have Hodge edging out Mitchell, ever so slightly.

 

[cryptor]

Love that thing Hodge does where he will steal the ball from a stoppage just outside 50, turn and throw it on the outside of his boot. We then get to see the dirtiest mongrel torp float through the big sticks as it spins wildly on every axis. Opposition fans cry "fluke!", but he does it far too often every season for it to be. He did it twice against Collingwood in the same game at some point in the last 2 seasons.

 

[cryptor]

And for Mitchell. Love that despite being held at a lot of stoppages all he needs to do is get a finger on it to guide it down from the tap, right onto his boot (doesn't matter which side) to send the ball straight into our forward 50. Usually right onto a target.

 

[Hawkas1988]

In my eyes I can't split them and I won't ever split them because I just don't wanna do it

 

[Flag08]

With all due respect to Hodgey, Mitch has been the best footballer at our club for the last 10 years.

And if anyone needs confirmation, just watch the GF 2nd quarter. He took over the game and it was done.

 

[The BIG X]

With all due respect to Hodgey, Mitch has been the best footballer at our club for the last 10 years.

And if anyone needs confirmation, just watch the GF 2nd quarter. He took over the game and it was done.

Hodgey wasn't too bad in the 2nd Q either

Personally like 2 sons - I cannot seperate them

 

[MinerBoy]

But to argue that Hodge's finals record is superior to Mitch's, is in fact, a misnomer!

No it's not. Hodge's is superior. In fact, I'd say Hodge's finals record is the best of any player of his era.

Notwithstanding the fact that I believe your numbers are probably correct, I think it's a little too simplistic. GFs are the biggest stage and Hodge has been in the voting in 3 NSMs and has won 2. But delving deeper than that, it isn't just about being 'in the best', it's about 'being the best'. IMO, and I concede that's all it is - my opinion, when Hodge has been in the best, he has been absolutely dominantly in the best. He has owned the games.

Despite Buddy's 2007 EF heroics, Hodge was enormous that day and was the reason we were still in that match right throughout.

In 2008, Hodge not only won the NSM, but dominated the entire finals series to win a flag nobody but our own supporters could see anyone but Geelong winning.

He has now backed up with another NSM and plenty of bests in the past few seasons QF and PFs.

Once again it comes back to what you want. Mitch has probably been more 'consistently in the best'. But Hodge has been more dominantly best.

That's just my 2c anyway.

 

[Argy]

Well, that's a surprise. I didn't want to vote but was too curious about the result. Eventually went for Sammy, thinking he might be behind. Now I'm embarrassed.

 

[Procrastinator35]

No it's not. Hodge's is superior. In fact, I'd say Hodge's finals record is the best of any player of his era.

Notwithstanding the fact that I believe your numbers are probably correct, I think it's a little too simplistic. GFs are the biggest stage and Hodge has been in the voting in 3 NSMs and has won 2. But delving deeper than that, it isn't just about being 'in the best', it's about 'being the best'. IMO, and I concede that's all it is - my opinion, when Hodge has been in the best, he has been absolutely dominantly in the best. He has owned the games.

Despite Buddy's 2007 EF heroics, Hodge was enormous that day and was the reason we were still in that match right throughout.

In 2008, Hodge not only won the NSM, but dominated the entire finals series to win a flag nobody but our own supporters could see anyone but Geelong winning.

He has now backed up with another NSM and plenty of bests in the past few seasons QF and PFs.

Once again it comes back to what you want. Mitch has probably been more 'consistently in the best'. But Hodge has been more dominantly best.

That's just my 2c anyway.

The numbers i have quoted are a simple calculation lifted from the AFL Record season guide....Naturally, people's opinions will differ markedly as to who was best & who wasn't on any particular day....For example, there are many games where the bests given throughout our finals campaign that i would disagree with the order given..

Be that as it may, The record at least serves as some kind of objective, though admittedly flawed & judicious guide....From my memory of most finals (seen them all from 1974 onwards, though not all live) then it is for the most part, an accurate reflection.

I think you have overlooked the fact of Mitchell's being tagged in giving such a heavily weighted favor to Hodge....Also, we all have our own favorite players with regards the way they play the game & this also serves as a discriminating factor.

Regardless, if we go on stats, then the AFL record says that Mitchell (Apart from GF'S obviously, which was stipulated) has been every bit as influential & consistently good in finals as what Hodge has been...Remembering that Hodge played the 2012 campaign injured & missed the Preliminary final.

The fact they are both in the top 10 in our history, also renders such calculations as accurate for mine, given their 3 Premierships & 250+ games each!