Luke Hodge or Sam Mitchell

[Crankyhawk]

I'd go as far as saying picking Tom Murphy over Hodgey and we wouldn't have lost that GF.
No offense to Hodge - he was unfit and should never have been picked - but had Smurf played, Potato Morton wouldn't have run amok.

Controversial opinion, but I stand by it.


*i understand why hodge was picked - inspirational leader and all, but hindsight is a wonderful thing.

I would've had murphy in for Ellis.

 

[smeltitdeltit]

Hodge is my favourite player, and I reckon he's won more games "off his own boot".

Having said that, we would have lost a lot more games without Mitchell in the engine room, week in, week out doing what he does best. He's like a Diesel (coincidental metaphor) engine cruising never fast, never slow, and NEVER missing a beat.

So if I had to take one away from the team forhe past decade, would be Hodge.
Mitchell gets us to the Granny, Hodge wins it

 

[whiteTiga2k]

Just watched some of Hodgey's 2010 season. Boy he was good... what form he was in... did things others could only dream of.

That gather, shrug and goal to put us in up against the dogs was masterful.

 

[Procrastinator35]

I will qualify what I am about to say by noting we are essentially discussing the merits of two of our greatest players.

The thing about Hodge is pretty much everyone acknowledged in 2012 that a fit Hodge would have made the difference between a win and a loss. That is what Hodge is - the difference between winning and losing in those big matches.

There's always an exception Brishawk....in this case, It was Sammy's brilliant Preliminary Final against the Cats last year which broke their strangle-hold upon us....Similarly, in this years Qualifying Final, he tore them a new one once again!

In 2008 he was B.O.G against the Saints & only second to Franklin against the Bulldogs....And this year's Norm Smith was a lottery between Hodge, Mitchell & Lewis!...Sammy also won best finals player for 2014!

We lost in 2012 for many reasons, one of which was an injured Hodge; but also an injured Cyril, a missing Guerra, A jelly-legged Buddy combined with a one dimensional attack. And, finally, but by no means least, a conniving AFL Commission!

 

[wheelie_hawk]

[/quote]
We lost in 2012 for many reasons, one of which was an injured Hodge; but also an injured Cyril, a missing Guerra, A jelly-legged Buddy combined with a one dimensional attack. And, finally, but by no means least, a conniving AFL Commission![/QUOTE]

On the plus side I believe we won the next two in part because we lost 2012, so it provided the extra motivation, well that & the defection!

Hodge & Mitchell are so good because they compliment each other on & off the field. The class and sublime skill of Mitchell & the grunt, determination, & leadership from Hodge means making a hard choice. Luckily we don't have to make it.

 

[Brishawk]

There's always an exception Brishawk....in this case, It was Sammy's brilliant Preliminary Final against the Cats last year which broke their strangle-hold upon us....Similarly, in this years Qualifying Final, he tore them a new one once again!

In 2008 he was B.O.G against the Saints & only second to Franklin against the Bulldogs....And this year's Norm Smith was a lottery between Hodge, Mitchell & Lewis!...Sammy also won best finals player for 2014!

We lost in 2012 for many reasons, one of which was an injured Hodge; but also an injured Cyril, a missing Guerra, A jelly-legged Buddy combined with a one dimensional attack. And, finally, but by no means least, a conniving AFL Commission!

This is certainly a fun thing to discuss. Mitchell was certainly very good in the geelong PF in 2013. Could not have won it without him. But for all his fantastic effort we still trailed going into the last quarter. In that match Burgoyne made the difference between winning and losing. That is the kind of thing I am talking about - where both teams have thrown the kitchen sink at each other and it needs someone to rise above all others and Hodge has been the one more often than not that has being able to do that for us in finals.

Just as he did in the Preliminary final against port where if just appears in the right place at the right time to smother and then trap the ball winning a free kick to close out the match. In the grand final his ability to read the play saw him get on the end of a roughy snap and intercept a kick-in both resulting in goals. In the QF Sellwood had just kicked a goal and hodge was able to go forward and replicate the feat, from the boundary no less. In 2008 he formed a virtual wall across half back which protected our vulnerable backline from the likes of Riewoldt, Kosi, Ottens and Mooney etc. We never really looked like premiers until late in the season when Hodge moved to defense. The stats show we were a transformed team. For several seasons Hodge was the best or near the best last quarter player in the competition according to Champion data (and my personal observations). He saved goals, created goals and kicked goals himself to win us matches when the game was on the line. In the 2014 GF after kicking goals in the first half he went back and saved them in the second half, even nulling a contest between himself and Buddy deep in their forward line which was a feat even Lake had trouble doing. just as importantly he was the one who landed the first big tackle of the GF which triggered more aggression in his team mates. That is what hodge does, he imposes his will on the game. He competes even when he is out-matched and still manages to find a way to win. And while he does this his team mates walk taller. Mitch is a great player but he doesn't have the same ability to hit the scoreboard, save a goal or set the tone for his team mates like Hodge. Love them both but it has to be Hodgey!

 

[Threadkilla]

I would've had murphy in for Ellis.

That too. Point is, I was responding to a poster who said a fit hodge would've made all the difference in 2012. I'd agree, but would suggest that granny was lost at the selection table (as you have further illustrated), for what it's worth.

Anyway, I should also clarify that my point was in no way a slight on Hodge, or a point of difference between he and Mitch. Both are out and out superstars, without doubt, but Sammy Mitchell is the best player we've had at hawthorn since Jason Dunstall... in my opinion.

 

[Procrastinator35]

This is certainly a fun thing to discuss. Mitchell was certainly very good in the geelong PF in 2013. Could not have won it without him. But for all his fantastic effort we still trailed going into the last quarter. In that match Burgoyne made the difference between winning and losing. That is the kind of thing I am talking about - where both teams have thrown the kitchen sink at each other and it needs someone to rise above all others and Hodge has been the one more often than not that has being able to do that for us in finals.

Just as he did in the Preliminary final against port where if just appears in the right place at the right time to smother and then trap the ball winning a free kick to close out the match. In the grand final his ability to read the play saw him get on the end of a roughy snap and intercept a kick-in both resulting in goals. In the QF Sellwood had just kicked a goal and hodge was able to go forward and replicate the feat, from the boundary no less. In 2008 he formed a virtual wall across half back which protected our vulnerable backline from the likes of Riewoldt, Kosi, Ottens and Mooney etc. We never really looked like premiers until late in the season when Hodge moved to defense. The stats show we were a transformed team. For several seasons Hodge was the best or near the best last quarter player in the competition according to Champion data (and my personal observations). He saved goals, created goals and kicked goals himself to win us matches when the game was on the line. In the 2014 GF after kicking goals in the first half he went back and saved them in the second half, even nulling a contest between himself and Buddy deep in their forward line which was a feat even Lake had trouble doing. just as importantly he was the one who landed the first big tackle of the GF which triggered more aggression in his team mates. That is what hodge does, he imposes his will on the game. He competes even when he is out-matched and still manages to find a way to win. And while he does this his team mates walk taller. Mitch is a great player but he doesn't have the same ability to hit the scoreboard, save a goal or set the tone for his team mates like Hodge. Love them both but it has to be Hodgey!

Yeah....You wont get any argument from me that Hodge does the more spectacular or eye catching things Brishawk, but for pure consistency of output & excellence in performance it still has to be Mitch for mine mate....His radius of influence may only extend between a 40-50 meter arc, but what he does inside that arc is second to none.

Four best & fairests to Hodge's 2 also suggests this to be the case, not to mention two 2nd's in Brownlow medal voting & the highest numbers all up, behind only Matthews & B.Harvey without having won it.

Burgoyne may well have won us the 2013 Prelim, but without Sammy, we wouldn't have been still in that game at 3/4 time to start with!

As for you champion data stats re 2008....It was Gilham & Ellis who led us for possession retention coming out of defense....Also, Hodge was far more potent this season when shifted into the middle & exerted a far greater deal of influence from there.

For consistency over 13 seasons, it's Sammy by a nose mate!

 

[Goodo73]

Looking at the stats goes to prove to me, yet again, that Mitchell would have to be winning the 'most underrated of all time' race. Imagine the jizz fest if he had been a Carton, Bombres or $ydney player.

If he was a Collingwood player, Eddie would be trumpeting his virtues at every opportunity

 

[MinerBoy]

Burgoyne may well have won us the 2013 Prelim, but without Sammy, we wouldn't have been still in that game at 3/4 time to start with!

Not quite true. Had it not been for inaccuracy and 10 minutes of crazy umpiring prior to 3/4 time, the Hawks would have been 6 goals up at that point.

Sammy didn't keep us in it. We, as the wasteful unit we were, kept the Cats in it. The Hawks dominated that match.

 

[Agent Smith]

Four best & fairests to Hodge's 2 also suggests this to be the case, not to mention two 2nd's in Brownlow medal voting & the highest numbers all up, behind only Matthews & B.Harvey without having won it.

I'll give you the best & fairests, but the brownlow is a midfielders award, and Hodge has been playing either down back or 'jack of all trades' for the past 7 years.

Play fair.

 

[WWSD]

Just watched some of Hodgey's 2010 season. Boy he was good... what form he was in... did things others could only dream of.

That gather, shrug and goal to put us in up against the dogs was masterful.

This was a fairly similar goal too. Another match-winning goal from Hodge.

 

[Nuggets73]

Not quite true. Had it not been for inaccuracy and 10 minutes of crazy umpiring prior to 3/4 time, the Hawks would have been 6 goals up at that point.

Sammy didn't keep us in it. We, as the wasteful unit we were, kept the Cats in it. The Hawks dominated that match.

Having watched the replay recently, agreed ... We should have smacked them by 10 goals, the goal kicking was appalling ..

PS - MITCH ... At pick 36, he was a steal! .. Plus he's been a little more consistent over the journey

Hodge is a legend, no doubt .. Awesome big game player
... But at the time, we had to give up a bit for him (McPharlin, Croad??.. From memory)

 

[Gunstall555]

It is funny how Hodge may be the best player ever taken at 1 yet looking at his draft many would argue Judd at 3, Mitchell at 36, GAJ @ 40 and Swan at 58 from the same draft all have claims (albeit it arguable) at being better players. Then there are the Stevie J's, Bartels, Dal Santo's etc from this draft.

 

[WWSD]

It is funny how Hodge may be the best player ever taken at 1 yet looking at his draft many would argue Judd at 3, Mitchell at 36, GAJ @ 40 and Swan at 58 from the same draft all have claims (albeit it arguable) at being better players. Then there are the Stevie J's, Bartels, Dal Santo's etc from this draft.

Looking back at it now, the 2001 draft has played a huge role in our current success.

Hodge
Mitchell
Ladson
Brown
Hale (originally drafted with pick 7 by North Melbourne)
Lake (originally drafted with pick 71 by Western Bulldogs)

12 premiership medals combined.

 

[Brishawk]

I'll give you the best & fairests, but the brownlow is a midfielders award, and Hodge has been playing either down back or 'jack of all trades' for the past 7 years.

Play fair.

Hodge was clearly the best player in the comp in 2010 and barely got a vote!

 

[Procrastinator35]

Hodge was clearly the best player in the comp in 2010 and barely got a vote!

Are you suggesting that the umpires are not worthy to cast votes Brishawk ?

 

[Brishawk]

Are you suggesting that the umpires are not worthy to cast votes Brishawk ?

Haha no just that brownlow votes are not an accurate reflection of the Great Man's influence and value as a player. As much as the brownlow has its issues, there is no better award. Players association is a joke (I would rather base it on super coach scores!) and we have seen even the coaches can't escape their own bias in voting. Media awards are all sentiment based. Brownlow is the most robust award we have but it is far from perfect.

 

[MC_9]

I choose not to choose.

 

[Yabbys Heroes]

I can't and I won't

 

[MrFujiMoto]

Can I vote for Luke Mitchell - A bullocking mid / stroke quaterback defender with the ability to make time stand still when he has the ball. He also has the ability to evade any tackler and to extract a fully inflated Sherrin from inside a matchbox while solving the rubiks cube. That guy gets my vote.

 

[Brant]

Hodge was clearly the best player in the comp in 2010 and barely got a vote!

Correct - in a Geelong, Fremantle or $ydney jumper he'd have been awarded 2 Brownlows - in a Collingwood, Carltank or Richmond jumper he'd have been Prime Minister...

 

[Brant]

Can I vote for Luke Mitchell - A bullocking mid / stroke quaterback defender with the ability to make time stand still when he has the ball. He also has the ability to evade any tackler and to extract a fully inflated Sherrin from inside a matchbox while solving the rubiks cube. That guy gets my vote.

Gibbo?

 

[Mitchell54]

2.5 years ago when this thread was created I would have voted Mitchell but now in early 2015 I would vote for Hodge.

 

[Procrastinator35]

2.5 years ago when this thread was created I would have voted Mitchell but now in early 2015 I would vote for Hodge.

Talk about a betrayal of your own AV!