Luke Hodge vs Nigel Lappin

[KissKiss]

Not on physique, Norm Smith medals and playing ability. Hodge is a shorter and heavier player with better all-round skills, leadership and utility than Nigel Lappin who was primarily a midfielder. Lappin was a good player, but probably in the Bartel/Hayes class rather than Luke Hodge.

Yeah Im not sure on the skills. Lappin was a very skilled player in his own right. Quicker than Hodge but less powerful. As pointed out above Lappin also rotated through multiple positions (maybe not as much/well as Hodge though) so you are wrong there. Hodge definitely ahead as a leader though. Altogether Hodge is probably the better player but its not that far apart

 

[Monkey King]

A much better poll than Voss vs Hodge. Lappin was a star and a gun finals player; reckon he gets overshadowed by his more heralded teammates. I think he matches up with Hodge pretty well. At the beginning of 2013 I would have had Lappin well ahead, however, Hodge has gained the edge in this one I think. Not as much in it as the poll result will show though.

 

[detox]

While we're at it, why not do a poll on who is the better fab 4:

Hodge/Mitchell/Burgoyne/Lewis....vs....Voss/Black/Ackermanis/Lappin

Go on....You know you want to.

By the way: Podge easily

Id have

1) Voss
2) Mitchell
3) Black
4) Hodge
5) Akermanis
6) Lappin
7) Burgoyne
8) Lewis

 

[Procrastinator35]

Id have

1) Voss
2) Mitchell
3) Black
4) Hodge
5) Akermanis
6) Lappin
7) Burgoyne
8) Lewis

Nah....Not even close.

Hodge, Voss, Mitchell, Black, Burgoyne, Ackermanis, Lewis, Lappin.

Even Lewis has Lappin covered.....Check out his finals stats.

Our Fab 4 have transcended the Brions quartet....More premierships for a start....The only real stat that matters.

 

[M Malice]

1. michael voss
2. sam mitchell
3. jason akermanis
4. simon black
5. luke hodge
6. shaun burgoyne
7. nigel lappin
8. jordon lewis
the top 5 very close in my opinion > burgoyne/lappin > lewis.

 

[Dom PC]

Not on physique, Norm Smith medals and playing ability. Hodge is a shorter and heavier player with better all-round skills, leadership and utility than Nigel Lappin who was primarily a midfielder. Lappin was a good player, but probably in the Bartel/Hayes class rather than Luke Hodge.

So you think Bartel, Hayes and Lappin were just "good"?

I guess if you exclude 2 particular games from Hodge's career then he was just a good player too then huh?

 

[HeHateMe]

I don't understand some if the stuff I've read through out this thread.

Hodge was a top 3 player at times, the cornerstone of 4 flags. If you truly believe lappin is that level... Well I'll know who's opinions are completely worthless.

Also why do people hold so much weight in poll results? Are people so misguided that a result will affect there opinion of a player. All a poll will ever prove is that at one point in time the posters who contributed to a tread held an option biased or not that one player was better then the other. A poll isn't objective, it isn't rational, in fact depending who is contributing it is biased.

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[Monkey King]

I don't understand some if the stuff I've read through out this thread.

Hodge was a top 3 player at times, the cornerstone of 4 flags. If you truly believe lappin is that level... Well I'll know who's opinions are completely worthless.

The whole "cornerstone of 4 flags" is just a trump up. He was an integral part of the team. So was Brian Lake. And there is only one season I can think of where Hodge was ever regarded a top 3 player. Lappin was a very very good player, as is Hodge. It's a pretty fair comparison.

 

[Ricky Vaughn]

Nah....Not even close.

Hodge, Voss, Mitchell, Black, Burgoyne, Ackermanis, Lewis, Lappin.

Even Lewis has Lappin covered.....Check out his finals stats.

Our Fab 4 have transcended the Brions quartet....More premierships for a start....The only real stat that matters.

Amazing you could say "not even close" to another effort and put something together that is so incredibly biased.

1. Voss
2. Mitchell
3. Black
4. Akermanis
5. Hodge
6. Lappin
7. Burgoyne
8. Lewis

That's how it would sit for me.

 

[Dom PC]

I don't understand some if the stuff I've read through out this thread.

Hodge was a top 3 player at times, the cornerstone of 4 flags. If you truly believe lappin is that level... Well I'll know who's opinions are completely worthless.

Also why do people hold so much weight in poll results? Are people so misguided that a result will affect there opinion of a player. All a poll will ever prove is that at one point in time the posters who contributed to a tread held an option biased or not that one player was better then the other. A poll isn't objective, it isn't rational, in fact depending who is contributing it is biased.

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You think Lappin wasn't a cornerstone of our four GF's in a row? I think you are underrating Lappin if you don't think player wise, (excluding leadership) they are actually very close.

In 2004 Mike Sheahan rated Lappin as the 4th best player in the comp (at the end of the season). While not the be all and end all, fair to say Lappin was a top 10 player in the league at his best.

Interestingly, Hodge's best ranking (at the end of the season) by Sheahan is 4th also...

 

[HeHateMe]

You think Lappin wasn't a cornerstone of our four GF's in a row? I think you are underrating Lappin if you don't think player wise, (excluding leadership) they are actually very close.

In 2004 Mike Sheahan rated Lappin as the 4th best player in the comp (at the end of the season). While not the be all and end all, fair to say Lappin was a top 10 player in the league at his best.

Interestingly, Hodge's best ranking (at the end of the season) by Sheahan is 4th also...

I'm sure lappin was just like Lewis is to ours.

I guess cornerstone is open l to interpretation but I'm talking more along the lines of wouldn't of happened if not there.

It's not close I'll never think its close. Just live and let live mate haha.

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[Judd2Sewell]

The whole "cornerstone of 4 flags" is just a trump up. He was an integral part of the team. So was Brian Lake. And there is only one season I can think of where Hodge was ever regarded a top 3 player. Lappin was a very very good player, as is Hodge. It's a pretty fair comparison.

Whilst I understand your point I would maybe explain it like this (however of course this is my opinion and I don't speak for other Hawthorn supporters):

If Hawthorn and that Brisbane side were to play in a GF tomorrow the two first players I would chose for either side would be Hodge and Voss, every single time.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Amazing you could say "not even close" to another effort and put something together that is so incredibly biased.

1. Voss
2. Mitchell
3. Black
4. Akermanis
5. Hodge
6. Lappin
7. Burgoyne
8. Lewis

That's how it would sit for me.

For me, on ability:
Voss
Mitchell
Hodge
Black
Akermanis
Burgoyne
Lappin
Lewis

If I was to pick a combined side to play in a GF tomorrow:
Voss
Hodge
Mitchell
Black
Burgoyne
Akermanis
Lappin
Lewis

 

[Ricky Vaughn]

For me, on ability:
Voss
Mitchell
Hodge
Black
Akermanis
Burgoyne
Lappin
Lewis

If I was to pick a combined side to play in a GF tomorrow:
Voss
Hodge
Mitchell
Black
Burgoyne
Akermanis
Lappin
Lewis

For a GF I couldn't split Hodge and Voss. I'd have those 2 marginally ahead of Black, Mitchell, Akermanis and Burgoyne who are also very hard to split. (I'd take Aker first.)

 

[KissKiss]

For me, on ability:
Voss
Mitchell
Hodge
Black
Akermanis
Burgoyne
Lappin
Lewis

If I was to pick a combined side to play in a GF tomorrow:
Voss
Hodge
Mitchell
Black
Burgoyne
Akermanis
Lappin
Lewis

Funnily enough on pure ability I actually think Akermanis and Burgoyne should be even higher on that first list. Their talents are/were pretty incredible. But the 4 above them all had other factors that are harder to measure (leadership, drive, determination, consistency, etc) that push them higher

 

[Monkey King]

Whilst I understand your point I would maybe explain it like this (however of course this is my opinion and I don't speak for other Hawthorn supporters):

If Hawthorn and that Brisbane side were to play in a GF tomorrow the two first players I would chose for either side would be Hodge and Voss, every single time.

If looking at players from across your four flags, I would choose Franklin first, then Hodge or Mitchell second, Hodge probably. For Brisbane it would likely be Voss, Black and either Lappin or Akermanis.

I just don't buy into the whole cornerstone thing. I find when Hawk supporters are rating Hodge, there's always things like this that creep in. I think the Lappin comparison is a fair one and as I said earlier, up to the start of 2013 I would have actually gone Lappin without a second thought. Now I would go Hodge. Lappin was a terrific and much unheralded player, so Hawk supporters shouldn't take umbrage at the comparison.

 

[Beer n Skittles]

Close. Best of the endless Hodge vs ____ polls. But I think most would agree that Hodge is ahead, even if it's a small margin, so it'll be a lopsided poll.

 

[Procrastinator35]

If I was to pick a combined side to play in a GF tomorrow:
Voss
Hodge
Mitchell
Black
Burgoyne
Akermanis
Lappin
Lewis

Geez, really under selling Lewis there....Here are his stats from all 4 Premierships:

2008 21 disposals, 7 marks, 4 tackles
2013 26 disposals, 8 marks, 4 tackles
2014 37 disposals, 8 marks, 7 clearances
2015 26 disposals, 8 marks, 5 tackles

Lewis is every bit the equal of Lappin.

Similarly: Hodge/Voss, Mitchell/Black, Burgoyne/Ackermanis.

People need to remember that our boys have achieved more....Perspective.

 

[Dom PC]

Geez, really under selling Lewis there....Here are his stats from all 4 Premierships:

2008 21 disposals, 7 marks, 4 tackles
2013 26 disposals, 8 marks, 4 tackles
2014 37 disposals, 8 marks, 7 clearances
2015 26 disposals, 8 marks, 5 tackles

Lewis is every bit the equal of Lappin.

Similarly: Hodge/Voss, Mitchell/Black, Burgoyne/Ackermanis.

People need to remember that our boys have achieved more....Perspective.

Do you think the fact the Lions averaged 276 disposals in their grand finals, while the Hawks averaged 386 disposals should be added to your post for "Perspective"?

What about Lappin's 4 All Australian selections vs Lewis 1 All Australian selection?

Perspective

 

[Procrastinator35]

Do you think the fact the Lions averaged 276 disposals in their grand finals, while the Hawks averaged 386 disposals should be added to your post for "Perspective"?

What about Lappin's 4 All Australian selections vs Lewis 1 All Australian selection?

Perspective

So Lappin won a B& F in a premiership year then?

My opinion of AA awards has been well documented: Their a raffle, & under Healey's stewardship, a complete farce.

Did a comparative study of Geelong & Hawthorn's recent eras of dominance; & they were almost equal in every respect barr 1.....The Cats had twice as many AA's....A complete joke.

Perspective

 

[Dom PC]

So Lappin won a B& F in a premiership year then?

My opinion of AA awards has been well documented: Their a raffle, & under Healey's stewardship, a complete farce.

Did a comparative study of Geelong & Hawthorn's recent eras of dominance; & they were almost equal in every respect barr 1.....The Cats had twice as many AA's....A complete joke.

Perspective

Lappin won his B&F in 2004, we were leading at half time in the GF that year, that's close enough for me.

Okay, no problem. Lets half Lappin's AA numbers. He still leads there... 2-1.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Lappin won his B&F in 2004, we were leading at half time in the GF that year, that's close enough for me.

Okay, no problem. Lets half Lappin's AA numbers. He still leads there... 2-1.

That's fine....Lewis leads 4:3 on Premierships & is still going.

 

[Dom PC]

That's fine....Lewis leads 4:3 on Premierships & is still going.

I guess I'll just have to live with my 3x premiership stars... it's tough

This thread is about Hodge anyway, it's a much closer comparison. Start a Lewis v Lappin thread if you want, you'll have plenty of people to disagree with then

The Lappin vs Hodge
B&F's 1 vs 2
AA's 4 vs 3
Games: 279 vs 271
Goals: 174 vs 188
Draft pick: Pick 2 vs Pick 1
Club Captain: Yes vs Yes
Great finals record: Yes vs Yes
Played midfield and HBF: Yes vs Yes

As I said, their careers aren't that different and skills wise, very similar, with Lappin having the pace Hodge doesn't and Hodge having the leadership edge.

 

[Procrastinator35]

As I said, their careers aren't that different and skills wise, very similar, with Lappin having the pace Hodge doesn't and Hodge having the leadership edge.

More like a chasm....Would have thought.

Not to mention flexibility in being able to play almost any position on the ground....Not to mention finals performances.

 

[Beer n Skittles]

More like a chasm....Would have thought.

Not to mention flexibility in being able to play almost any position on the ground....Not to mention finals performances.

Lappin was too important to drag him away from the midfield