Marcus Bontempelli Vs Patrick Cripps

[Gollo]

Cripps will win a Browlow, wines and macrae wont.

Look there is no point even talking to you its abundantly clear you dont actually watch Cripps very often

Alright mate, I'll stop you there because you seem to be distracted by thinking Cripps will win you a Premiership in 2 years, too distracted to realise Cripps has no running capacity and cannot hit a target by foot. I very much like Cripps and know he will become one of the premier inside midfielders in the comp in time, as well as a future Carlton leader, but this is irrelevant to the fact that Cripps is quite unfit and needs to drastically improve his kicking. Right now, Cripps is a sole inside midfielder who tackles, wins clearances and occasionally can go forward for a goal, but that's it. He cannot win any effective outside ball or intercept counter-attacks unless he focuses all pre-season on those aspects.

Wines is one of the truest footballers you'll see come out of the draft for a while. He has incredible game sense, leadership skills, footy intelligence and responsibility off-field. On-field, he can play roles: inside mid, outside mid, high half-forward, crumbing forward, defensive stopper, rebounding defender and defensive midfielder all to great capabilities. He is extremely fit, has great disposal efficiency, marks and tackles ruthlessly and has top notch strength. He is a complete, all-round footballer.

Macrae has absolutely freakish capabilities. He could become a top 5 mid in the whole comp in the next 2 years, or he could take a little longer. Honestly and impartially, he is one of the most rapidly improving players in the AFL right now. He came into the AFL barely knowing how to man-mark, now he is a greatly capable defensive mid who has incredible work-rate and blocks opposition players at contests frequently. He has a massive tank and a nice burst of speed, an unpickable sidestep and baulk, an unorthodox but effective kick, a beautiful marker and reader of the play, a regular hunting tackler, and one of the most ingenious handballers in the comp. He is also very diligent and a smart person on and off field.

Unlike you I'm not going to be as forthright as saying either of these three will win a Brownlow - they all are talented enough - all I'm putting forward is that Wines and Macrae are both far more ahead of Cripps as players right now. Who knows, time will play its course, and Cripps has only played one full year of proper footy.

 

[TheHoneyBadger]

Aren't Brownlow votes generally awarded to players in winning teams?

 

[Th3 DoG FaTh3R]

Congratulations to Patrick Cripps on winning the Carlton FC Club Best and Fairest for 2015. This along with his 2nd place in the 2015 Rising Star award caps off an excellent 2nd year for the young gun.
In 2014 Bontempelli also placed 2nd for the Rising Star award as well as winning the Chris Grant Best First Year Player awarded by the Western Bulldogs. Bontempelli also won the AFLPA Best First Year Player as voted on by all players in the AFL.
Bontempelli and Cripps were both named in the 2015 AFLPA 22 Under 22 Team. Cripps as starting centre and Bontempelli as rover.
In 2014 Bontempelli was also named in the AFLPA 22 Under 22 Team on the half forward flank.

 

[Th3 DoG FaTh3R]

Cripps is better than all three..

Differences between Cripps, Macrae, Wines and Bont are minimal at this stage of their career. Talent and production wise all 4 are relatively even with each possessing their own strengths and weaknesses. I would add that Adams has had an extra 2 years over Bont and Cripps, being from the 2011 draft and despite averaging 27.4 possesions this year, his talent, from the eye test, appears to be a level down from the other four.

 

[SickQwon]

Alright mate, I'll stop you there because you seem to be distracted by thinking Cripps will win you a Premiership in 2 years, too distracted to realise Cripps has no running capacity and cannot hit a target by foot. I very much like Cripps and know he will become one of the premier inside midfielders in the comp in time, as well as a future Carlton leader, but this is irrelevant to the fact that Cripps is quite unfit and needs to drastically improve his kicking. Right now, Cripps is a sole inside midfielder who tackles, wins clearances and occasionally can go forward for a goal, but that's it. He cannot win any effective outside ball or intercept counter-attacks unless he focuses all pre-season on those aspects.

Wines is one of the truest footballers you'll see come out of the draft for a while. He has incredible game sense, leadership skills, footy intelligence and responsibility off-field. On-field, he can play roles: inside mid, outside mid, high half-forward, crumbing forward, defensive stopper, rebounding defender and defensive midfielder all to great capabilities. He is extremely fit, has great disposal efficiency, marks and tackles ruthlessly and has top notch strength. He is a complete, all-round footballer.

Macrae has absolutely freakish capabilities. He could become a top 5 mid in the whole comp in the next 2 years, or he could take a little longer. Honestly and impartially, he is one of the most rapidly improving players in the AFL right now. He came into the AFL barely knowing how to man-mark, now he is a greatly capable defensive mid who has incredible work-rate and blocks opposition players at contests frequently. He has a massive tank and a nice burst of speed, an unpickable sidestep and baulk, an unorthodox but effective kick, a beautiful marker and reader of the play, a regular hunting tackler, and one of the most ingenious handballers in the comp. He is also very diligent and a smart person on and off field.

Unlike you I'm not going to be as forthright as saying either of these three will win a Brownlow - they all are talented enough - all I'm putting forward is that Wines and Macrae are both far more ahead of Cripps as players right now. Who knows, time will play its course, and Cripps has only played one full year of proper footy.

Your assessment of Cripps is embarrassingly untrue, It's obvious you've never seen him play. Not many people watch Carlton games so i don't blame you.

 

[Gollo]

Your assessment of Cripps is embarrassingly untrue, It's obvious you've never seen him play. Not many people watch Carlton games so i don't blame you.

Alright, well I have watched many Carlton games and have known Cripps' positives and weaknesses for a while now, but I'm open to discussion so I ask how would you assess him as a player, in your words?

 

[T2B_]

If a sole inside midfielder who can't win any outside ball is already racking up 30-35 touch games... well I'm just more excited.

 

[jasonrampage2010]

Both equal

 

[Trav 20]

Cripps will win a Browlow, wines and macrae wont.

Look there is no point even talking to you its abundantly clear you dont actually watch Cripps very often

Look, he may or may not, but you overstate the merits of using a Brownlow to value a player's worth. Shane Woewodin won a Brownlow.

The two best players I've seen never won a Brownlow.

 

[raymagoo]

Cripps has been great and will be a great player, but this is like comparing Andrew Swallow to Scott Pendlebury.

Lol bias much

 

[Th3 DoG FaTh3R]

Cripps will be better than Swallow. For starters his disposal is more composed and effective. Swallow is quite bad in this regard. He hacks kicks out of packs. Bont's disposal is amazing. He has a 60meter kick and is now laser like when choosing to hit up targets. In pre season gameson a couple of occasions when entering 50 he was bombing it as long as he could, often going over our forwards head leading to an easy spoil or intercept mark. This became an obvious area of improvement for him and by about round 7 he had all but eliminated this from his game. He will still occasionally kick long inside 50, but not to the disadvantage of our forwards.

 

[T2B_]

Cripps will be better than Swallow. For starters his disposal is more composed and effective.

Well it's nice that an opposition fan can acknowledge this (although you may mainly be referring to his disposal by hand). Still, some people 'round here make it sound like Cripps couldn't kick over a jam tin, but while he has a vast differing ratio of handballs to kicks, when he has had to kick I've seen him pull off some pretty good ones.

Yeah he'll probably never anywhere near an elite kick and not the foot disposal of someone like a Bont, but like Chris Judd before him, his skill by foot may not be amazing but given any space, his vision means he can give off a decently weighted kick to advantage. And instead of hacking out of congestion, he usually finds someone by hand.

His main weakness is set shots at goal. Fix those and he'd be racking up a decent tally of goals for an inside mid.

 

[Monkey King]

... too distracted to realise Cripps has no running capacity and cannot hit a target by foot.

I stopped reading here. Dude. Talk about distracted. You really gotta watch the footy.

 

[Gollo]

Bontempelli and Cripps were both named in the 2015 AFLPA 22 Under 22 Team. Cripps as starting centre and Bontempelli as rover.

And Macrae wasn't. Absolute disgrace. (Not detracting anything from Bont and Cripps)

 

[Gosha]

BONTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[100action]

I love it when Bruce says "The Bont" in his overly excited low guttural voice when The Bont is finishing off an arousing piece of play.

 

[Th3 DoG FaTh3R]

And Macrae wasn't. Absolute disgrace. (Not detracting anything from Bont and Cripps)

Neither was Adams. Despite missing a few games, Wines was named. Stringer Captain on a half forward flank.

 

[Th3 DoG FaTh3R]

Well it's nice that an opposition fan can acknowledge this (although you may mainly be referring to his disposal by hand).

I would say Cripps's disposal by hand out of a contested situation is in the very top echelon for this phase of play, along side players like Liberatore, Pendlebury, Priddis, S Mitchell and Cunnington. I would include Bont at this level also. As they are stylistically different It is difficult to say who is more effective with each of these players being extremely damaging by hand from the contest in their own unique way.

 

[Th3 DoG FaTh3R]

A good result for Bontempelli in the 2015 Brownlow medal count finishing with 13 votes, which was equal 18th overall and the leading Western Bulldogs vote getter.
Cripps finished on 6 votes, equal 54th overall and was the 3rd leading vote getter for Carlton.
In 2014 Bontempelli polled 4 votes, equal 82nd overall and equal 6th for the Bulldogs whilst Cripps did not poll any votes.

 

[Adam H]

A good result for Bontempelli in the 2015 Brownlow medal count finishing with 13 votes, which was equal 18th overall and the leading Western Bulldogs vote getter.
Cripps finished on 6 votes, equal 54th overall and was the 3rd leading vote getter for Carlton.
In 2014 Bontempelli polled 4 votes, equal 82nd overall and equal 6th for the Bulldogs whilst Cripps did not poll any votes.

Whats your point?

 

[Zgope1]

Whats your point?

It's a comparison thread. That you don't understand why people are adding info for the comparison is the real question

 

[Adam H]

It's a comparison thread. That you don't understand why people are adding info for the comparison is the real question

So what he's trying to do is use the Brownlow as some sought of gauge to the abilty of a player. Which if true has little to no weight at all.

 

[Zgope1]

So what he's trying to do is use the Brownlow as some sought of gauge to the abilty of a player. Which if true has little to no weight at all.

It's more information on their output, good for the thread to have more data out there. All pretty one way though ATM

 

[Trav 20]

The Brownlow is virtually useless in gauging the worth of young players.

Best & Fairests hold far more weight and Cripps' won, albeit in a spoon year.

 

[Zgope1]

The Brownlow is virtually useless in gauging the worth of young players.

Best & Fairests hold far more weight and Cripps' won, albeit in a spoon year.

Yeah I agree it's definitely better comparing players in different fields than in the same one