Marcus Bontempelli Vs Patrick Cripps

[Scary_Foot_9]

Not this year.

Okay you want to confine it to just this year, this is the team of the year (All Australian) dictated by the ratings system....

None of those names are far from the mark. How is it that Bontempelli has made it alongside them?

 

[askdotcom]

give it up, Cripps is better by hand, bontempelli is the better player ATM, neither are near the top 20 players.

 

[Zgope1]

No we're not. If Bontempelli was a true Top 20 player he would be in discussion for All-Australian. The fact is he made Top 20 in some point system.

He should be in the discussion for all Australian. If he's not it proves my point that counting possessions is all that's wrong with footy stats. Had a cracking year, advanced stats support that

 

[Lethality]

Okay you want to confine it to just this year, this is the team of the year (All Australian) dictated by the ratings system....None of those names are far from the mark. How is it that Bontempelli has made it alongside them?

I thought we already differentiated between Top 20 player and Top 20 in a certain ratings system.

He should be in the discussion for all Australian. If he's not it proves my point that counting possessions is all that's wrong with footy stats.

No he shouldn't, and no it doesn't. It has nothing to do with counting possessions, he hasn't had a good enough year.

 

[Zgope1]

I thought we already differentiated between Top 20 player and Top 20 in a certain ratings system.




No he shouldn't, and no it doesn't. It has nothing to do with counting possessions, he hasn't had a good enough year.

He's been very effective.

I don't think we settled on devaluing the afl player ratings. Maybe you did. Frankly just watching him is enough really.

 

[Lethality]

He's been very effective.

I don't think we settled on devaluing the afl player ratings. Maybe you did.

I think I ran up to about 8 or 9 players in that Top 20 who wouldn't be top 20 this year. The fact that the ratings aren't even about this year but over 40 games also means it has nothing to do with who is the better player right now anyway.

I think Ablett is 32nd in that rating system, so obviously missing games brings your value down in that system as well, whereas in reality Ablett's ranking does not decrease by comparison to other players.

 

[Scary_Foot_9]

I thought we already differentiated between Top 20 player and Top 20 in a certain ratings system.

However way you want to say it, All-Australian, A-grade, Top 20, Elite, there is a metric and methodology that fairly accurately reflects who the best players in the competition are, Marcus Bontempelli is a member of its top echelon. You may dismiss the system and its results if you so wish but in doing so you are also dismissing the notion that Nat Fyfe is the best player in the competition, because the same methodology and logic that leads to at this point fairly consensus judgement also values The Bont as one of its best.

 

[Lethality]

However way you want to say it, All-Australian, A-grade, Top 20, Elite, there is a metric and methodology that fairly accurately reflects who the best players in the competition are, Marcus Bontempelli is a member of its top echelon.

LOL no. All-Australian is a decent metric, these AFL Player rankings clearly are not. Stop trying to link them together as though they carry equal weight or something.

 

[Scary_Foot_9]

LOL no. All-Australian is a decent metric, these AFL Player rankings clearly are not. Stop trying to link them together as though they carry equal weight or something.

You realize the All Australian Team will be completly made up of players who are highly rated by this system therefore you are agreeing it is accurate in assigning value.

 

[Lethality]

You realize the All Australian Team will be completly made up of players who are highly rated by this system therefore you are agreeing it is accurate in assigning value.

No it wouldn't be agreeing, the system should rate Bontempelli highly, but that doesn't mean he justifies AA selection.

 

[Monkey King]

"You can't have everything."

Sound logic. A little juvenile, but sound nonetheless.

Cripps is absolutely not better by hand than Bontempelli.

Nothing to do with logic. Cripps is just IMO, a better handball than Bont, but it seems some Dogs supporters can't handle the idea than Cripps is better than Bont in any department, while on the other hand, I'm quite happy to recognise Bont has a lot of advantages over Cripps - absolutely not better but maybe even kind of even of sums this phenomenon up for me and a little juvenile I actually think sums it up nicely. There's not a lot of room between even and slightly better, but your beliefs compel you to make a definitive statement.

 

[SizeMatters]

Cripps is a an absolute gun. I would take him ahead of Bont.

 

[Zgope1]

I think I ran up to about 8 or 9 players in that Top 20 who wouldn't be top 20 this year. The fact that the ratings aren't even about this year but over 40 games also means it has nothing to do with who is the better player right now anyway.

I think Ablett is 32nd in that rating system, so obviously missing games brings your value down in that system as well, whereas in reality Ablett's ranking does not decrease by comparison to other players.

I think that just further exemplifies that Bont was really good last year despite silly mainstream statistics. If anything your side of the argument supports how brilliant he's been

 

[Zgope1]

Nothing to do with logic. Cripps is just IMO, a better handball than Bont, but it seems some Dogs supporters can't handle the idea than Cripps is better than Bont in any department, while on the other hand, I'm quite happy to recognise Bont has a lot of advantages over Cripps - absolutely not better but maybe even kind of even of sums this phenomenon up for me and a little juvenile I actually think sums it up nicely. There's not a lot of room between even and slightly better, but your beliefs compel you to make a definitive statement.

Nah, Cripps is a better clearance beast. I'd back him in a fight for the ball, but they're different types of weapons once they've got it

 

[Lethality]

I think that just further exemplifies that Bont was really good last year despite silly mainstream statistics.

LOL, I didn't invoke these stats, you did. I guess now you think they're just 'silly mainstream statistics' but it's important to remember you brought them up in the first place

 

[Zgope1]

LOL, I didn't invoke these stats, you did. I guess now you think they're just 'silly mainstream statistics' but it's important to remember you brought them up in the first place

You've misunderstood me. These stats are quality. You'll have to re read my post, but you've explained something that works in support of Bont, seeing as superficially you wouldn't have though his work last year was elite, would you?

 

[Lethality]

You've misunderstood me. These stats are quality. You'll have to re read my post, but you've explained something that works in support of Bont, seeing as superficially you wouldn't have though his work last year was elite, would you?

You mean the 40 game thing? Yes that probably works in his favour, but I also pointed out that this point system seems weighted towards players who are getting consistent games, which would be why Ablett isn't in the Top 20. It's the only explanation as to why Ablett wouldn't be there over the last 40 games.

 

[Zgope1]

You mean the 40 game thing? Yes that probably works in his favour, but I also pointed out that this point system seems weighted towards players who are getting consistent games, which would be why Ablett isn't in the Top 20. It's the only explanation as to why Ablett wouldn't be there over the last 40 games.

Yeah, but seeing as you don't have Rough as a top 20 because of this year, you seem to be picking and choosing when the past is relevant or not.

Your problem with the stats is that it's based on last year and not this year, but also that it's not based on three years ago?

Love it.

Just shows how good Bont is/has been

 

[Lethality]

Yeah, but seeing as you don't have Rough as a top 20 because of this year, you seem to be picking and choosing when the past is relevant or not.

It's relevant when we're discussing careers, if we're discussing this year it's not relevant. Fairly simple. I didn't have Roughead in my AA team because he is not a Top 20 player this year.

Your problem with the stats is that it's based on last year and not this year, but also that it's not based on three years ago?

I don't have a problem with the stats, just with hanging your hat on one particular points system to the exclusion of all else.

 

[Zgope1]

It's relevant when we're discussing careers, if we're discussing this year it's not relevant. Fairly simple. I didn't have Roughead in my AA team because he is not a Top 20 player this year.



I don't have a problem with the stats, just with hanging your hat on one particular points system to the exclusion of all else.

I don't. Most of my views on afl players comes from weekly note taking. I'm in the market for a champion data subscription though because I'd love to pick it all apart.

 

[ManOfClay]

The eye test says bontempelli. Getting the ball more doesn't mean you are a better player

 

[King Bont]

Huge game from the Bont today against a really good midfield, some have been saying that Cripps is better because he does it while his teammates look sluggish.
Well that was the Bont today. He made his teammates look second rate while he carried us on his shoulders.

 

[askdotcom]

Huge game from the Bont today against a really good midfield, some have been saying that Cripps is better because he does it while his teammates look sluggish.
Well that was the Bont today. He made his teammates look second rate while he carried us on his shoulders.

watching today bont was a class above the rest of your midfield, but that doesn't say alot because no one else really did anything. Good player though.

 

[King Bont]

watching today bont was a class above the rest of your midfield, but that doesn't say alot because no one else really did anything. Good player though.

Well that's the point I was making. He stepped up when his teammates didn't

 

[askdotcom]

Well that's the point I was making. He stepped up when his teammates didn't

and i was backing up your point