MCG may be football-free next July

[swiftdog]

It is not a Soccer V AFL fight, the MCC must respect it's major tenant and satisfy the AFL first and foremost. Of course we should have these teams out here, but the AFL are well within their rights to hold their ground as far as scheduling is concerned, particularly now that they will get the double whammy with the World Cup Cricket eating into the start of the season. This Soccer exhibition tournament can work around the AFL schedule, i expect Gilligan not to give an inch here and rightly so. It can be arranged without difficulty, it just takes some working out and i am sure they will, but not at the AFL's expense! The AFL should schedule matches as planned and are already under pressure to fix scheduling issues. I can't see why the Soccer matches cannot be played on a Wednesday night and late Sunday afternoon?

My question for you is - why and how?

Why must the MCC satisfy the AFL first and foremost when they're well within their rights to host 3 soccer matches?
How are the AFL "well within their rights" to hold their ground as far as scheduling is concerned? It has been established in this thread that the MCC can do what they like in regards to hosting 3 soccer matches.
Next year's AFL fixture isn't even out yet. It looks as if this soccer tournament is being organised now. How can the soccer tournament work around a non-existent AFL schedule? Should Gillon stubbornly tell his fixturing team to fixture a match at the MCG when a soccer tournament match is already booked in?
Why will it be at the AFL's expense? The AFL plays a certain amount of matches at the MCG each year (44 or 45 or whatever it was). They will still play the same amount of matches at the MCG in 2015, there will just be a couple of rounds of no scheduled MCG games which will be compensated for with a few rounds of 3 MCG matches. Again, how does this cost the AFL anything?
The pressure the AFL is under is completely their own doing. Again, are you saying that the AFL should schedule a match at the MCG on a date where the MCC have already scheduled a soccer match? It's likely that at least 1 of the soccer matches will be on a weeknight anyway. I'm not sure how exactly this tournament is run but treating clubs like Real Madrid, Barcelona, Manchester United or City etc like second-rate peasants will be horrible for Melbourne and Australia. We want these clubs to go back home blown away by our city and country which in turn enhances our reputation and attracts even more attention. Despite the size and popularity of these clubs I'm thinking many of these players would not have played in front of a crowd of 95,000 - 100,000 people.


Honestly, so many posts in this thread are all gloss, icing and emotive language with very little explanation, logic and meat and potatoes behind their points of view. People need to get out of the bubble that is AFL footy.

 

[The_Wookie]

i don't really understand what you're getting at with all this, in this thread.

a clause in AFL/MCC agreement states that the MCC and the VIC govt can legally schedule events at the MCG during the footy season.

The AFL have erred in much of their scheduling in the last few seasons. They have have under utilised the MCG in July this year, and practically stuck the finger up at Victorian football supporters who want to attend live matches in favour for TV $$$.



how are the VIC govt placing the game in jeopardy? Did they tell the AFL not to schedule 2pm games at the MCG this season? Did they tell the AFL to schedule games at times supporters don't want to attend the matches? did the VIC Govt implemented the unpopular ticketing strategy?

the VIC Govt have provided a world-class stadium which is one of the largest in the world for the AFL to fill up each and every weekend for their exclusive use from late March to beginning of October. how the AFL utilise it is up to them. Napthine is not putting up any wall with regard to these issues. The AFL have ****** up their use of it.

The VIC govt know it can be accommodated going by the scheduling trend of the AFL in recent seasons. You're insisting that they put one of the biggest international events to be staged in Victoria next year on hold pending what the AFL might do, and take their word at face value that they will go against the trends of the last few seasons. Supporters don't trust the AFL. You expect an organisation too?

It's one weekend next season where the VIC Govt have: a) sought to provide a massive economic benefit and exposure to the city and state; & b) both parties signed an agreement which allows it to happen.

The AFL can rectify their poor scheduling in the other 25 odd weeks of the season. Don't hold your breath.

Its not that black and white and you know it. But im wasting my time here.

 

[The_Wookie]

Honestly, so many posts in this thread are all gloss, icing and emotive language with very little explanation, logic and meat and potatoes behind their points of view. People need to get out of the bubble that is AFL footy.

And people need to stop treating Australian football like its insignificant every time a friendly is played.

 

[Sub_Zero]

It is insignificant though

 

[NUFC Tiger]

Why can't these soccer cultists play their inconsental games in Sydney at grounds that never get filled anyway.
Soccer is out to get footy and that former rugby boss Gallop is doing his best to faver his old code.
He never liked footy when he was boss of the rugby and this is a way of getting revenge.

Lol, that's what happens in competitive sporting markets like Australia mate.

FWIW, the A League/Gallop want football (soccer) to be the number one code (it's his job to try and grow the game, the as it is for any Sporting Administrator who heads up a code). I don't think Gallop has any kind of vendetta against the AFL. I seriously doubt he'd be doing something to help the NRL either.


For all the haters, the real issue is the MCC potentially disrespecting the AFL (the FFA/Gallop etc have no control over the venue, it's up to the MCC to decide who uses the venue - any AFL issues should be directed at the MCC, not the FFA.

 

[Lion for Life]

It is insignificant though

If you truly believe that then why do you even take part in this forum bud?

 

[swiftdog]

And people need to stop treating Australian football like its insignificant every time a friendly is played.

Who's treating it like it's insignificant? We're all on an AFL forum because we're fans of the game.

Telling the AFL that there are maybe two dates during the 2015 year that they can't schedule a match on is hardly treating them like they're insignificant.

 

[Theprofessional]

It is not a Soccer V AFL fight, the MCC must respect it's major tenant and satisfy the AFL first and foremost. Of course we should have these teams out here, but the AFL are well within their rights to hold their ground as far as scheduling is concerned, particularly now that they will get the double whammy with the World Cup Cricket eating into the start of the season. This Soccer exhibition tournament can work around the AFL schedule, i expect Gilligan not to give an inch here and rightly so. It can be arranged without difficulty, it just takes some working out and i am sure they will, but not at the AFL's expense! The AFL should schedule matches as planned and are already under pressure to fix scheduling issues. I can't see why the Soccer matches cannot be played on a Wednesday night and late Sunday afternoon?

This is the most annoying thing about Bigfooty- people coming into threads and talking about things they have no idea about.

AFL are not well within their rights scheduling wise- the deal made with the MCG a few seasons ago meant the AFL wasn't entitled to have both Prelims at the MCG and in return MCG could host events at the MCG instead of AFL if realistically Etihad couldn't host the events.

The tournament can hardly work around the schedule, it's got elite teams during the pre-season of their respective seasons- it's a 2 month window max to fit this in, and more realistically a one month window.

Gilligan won't give an inch? He doesn't have an inch to give, he's got nothing to stand on.

 

[Theprofessional]

Its not that black and white and you know it. But im wasting my time here.

You seem like a smart guy but this is very black and white.

A clause was negotiated in the deal between AFL and MCG meaning the AFL wasn't forced to have both Prelims at the MCG in return MCG can put on this exact sort of event when Etihad isn't a realistic option.

Etihad will be fine for a weekend, some weeks the MCG is used once- one week it might not be used at all. AFL will still happen, the AFL can't legally complain as they've got nothing- and even morally I don't think so.

The AFL have no power to stop this. The AFL won't stop this. The AFL shouldn't even if they could as it'll be fantastic for Victoria.

Do you have a problem with it? What's not black and white about this? What would you want the AFL to do?

 

[dvas987]

Not in Australian though, and last i checked this is still Australia. This crap gets trotted out every time these issues arise. Soccer isnt big here at the pro level, has never been. Yes its great for the Euro FIFO sides, but when they've played their one off games and gone hoe, we're left with a second rate product that even supporters of the round ball code cant be bothered getting behind.

Oh dear....assumptions

 

[harmesy 37]

Participation rates can be overstated in regards to a sports popularity. Lawn bowls and cycling have higher rates than any football codes. Most kids in the US never play their football and most that do never play again after high school yet the NFL goes alright.

I played Aussie rules until i was 25 and then swtiched to soccer due to having a bad back and wrecked shoulders and played that for another 14 years and loved it, doesnt mean I wouldnt rather have played footy. One day ill play lawn bowls too im sure.

Have you thought about playing AFL9s?

Non contact, easy on the body, social footy.

Well worth having a go... I am surprised so few people have heard of AFL9s... this should be the transition of people in their 30s (if they want an option) and older after they give up playing competitive football.

http://afl9s.com.au/

 

[Kwality]

One here for The_Wookie and some others Soccer is a bigger sport in Western Australia for those over the age opf 15 than AFL. If you don't believe refer to the below government report.

https://secure.ausport.gov.au/__dat...t_and_Active_Recreation-2011-12-WA-Tables.pdf

Unfortunately can't seem to find a decent Victorian one as only full report I found is a decade old.

What has participation got to do with this matter , tiddly squat !!

 

[Aussie in exile]

It could get worse for the AFL at the MCG reading between the lines. We could have soccer games at the MCG in August, which is the beginning of the soccer season for the EPL. Don't under estimate soccer. Australia is seriously on soccer's radar now.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/28770356

 

[Bardo State]

It could get worse for the AFL at the MCG reading between the lines. We could have soccer games at the MCG in August, which is the beginning of the soccer season for the EPL. Don't under estimate soccer. Australia is seriously on soccer's radar now.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/28770356

Seems like a silly idea. Not the playing abroad thing but the 39th game concept. Can't see it working.

What the game really needs is the continued strengthening of the national game. Keep supporting a viable second tier, get the number of sides into the mid teens, maybe even look at limited P&R around the mid/late 2020s. The only things that will truly grow the game in Australia are a strong national comp and a strong national team. Friendlies between big clubs will always bring out the theatre goers and the Eurosnobs but really mean very little for the code overall in Australia.

 

[pinot]

I love my AFL and I love my Carlton where I was born and studied. I am not torn between AFL and football as some would like to twist things around . It's just awesome having Real Madrid and Barcelona coming to Australia - never would have I thought in my life time watching these clubs live. Ronaldo and Messi in the flesh running around (Bale + Ramos + Suarez + Neymar + Silva + Aguero + Kolo Toure)...I am blown away by the prospect of watching them ply their talents live. As for the AFL having a hissy fit - look at it as an opportunity to see what a great sport like world football can do commercially to clubs.. stability, governance, youth facilities, training facilities, how to rank coaching (youth) etc. If there are clubs where AFL can learn from its these giants. Don't be so ignorant

 

[Aussie in exile]

Seems like a silly idea. Not the playing abroad thing but the 39th game concept. Can't see it working.

What the game really needs is the continued strengthening of the national game. Keep supporting a viable second tier, get the number of sides into the mid teens, maybe even look at limited P&R around the mid/late 2020s. The only things that will truly grow the game in Australia are a strong national comp and a strong national team. Friendlies between big clubs will always bring out the theatre goers and the Eurosnobs but really mean very little for the code overall in Australia.

I think if the EPL bring teams to Australia for competition points it will under pin soccer in Australia. This would be a huge problem for the AFL as i think the MCG would be the stadium of choice. The publicity a game like this would get and the knock on affects would be huge. I would agree with you about the 39th game concept and the strengthening of the A league.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

Firstly I'm bigger soccer fan than i am footy fan.

But watching a soccer game an oval ground is terrible. unless you're on the second level you can't see s**t. and no way a 100,000 seat stadium is necessary. i get it they want to showcase one of the worlds great stadiums but we have AAMI park which holds 30,000 which will be more than enough people and much better suited to soccer tournament. get the storm to go on a 4 week road trip.

A 30k venue would better suited to an Association Football tournament if it was Melbourne City v Guanzghong v Osaka v Pohang. Being some of the game's biggest clubs, the MCG will sell out - even for a friendly tournament.
Its true that viewing the sport at the MCG is terrible, but I'd be surprised if there was a single game that gets under 85k - and any empty seasts will be in the MCC members.

As far as scheduling the AFL goes, it only becomes an issue they demand that the ground be free of Australian Football for a few weeks beforehand to make the surface suitable. Just don't have the big four or five Vic sides play each other for a week or two. Given all the fixture manipulation that goes on now, that is hardly an exhaustive ask.

 

[Starburns_]

Seems like a silly idea. Not the playing abroad thing but the 39th game concept. Can't see it working.

What the game really needs is the continued strengthening of the national game. Keep supporting a viable second tier, get the number of sides into the mid teens, maybe even look at limited P&R around the mid/late 2020s. The only things that will truly grow the game in Australia are a strong national comp and a strong national team. Friendlies between big clubs will always bring out the theatre goers and the Eurosnobs but really mean very little for the code overall in Australia.

39th game is stupid considering the tiny points margins that seasons can be determined by, how do you reconcile a points difference made up in the 3rd match-up game?

The flow on effects to the game here from these matches will be minimal, it does more for the teams competing. Man City purchasing Heart on the other hand...

As far as scheduling the AFL goes, it only becomes an issue they demand that the ground be free of Australian Football for a few weeks beforehand to make the surface suitable. Just don't have the big four or five Vic sides play each other for a week or two. Given all the fixture manipulation that goes on now, that is hardly an exhaustive ask.

This is the part of the issue that's unknown. If they're expecting the ground to go unused for non-match days/light training sessions, then the AFL have every right to dig their heels in on this.

I'm sure the clause in the fixturing deal with the MCC would contain no provisions for the ground to go unused on 'non-event' days. Such a request is unnecessary anyway, Liverpool played on a Wednesday (from memory) last year, if it's good enough for them, it should be for the rest.

 

[dvas987]

The way some are acting on this thread, they probably believe this:

 

[The_Wookie]

Oh dear....assumptions

Really? Because Crowd figures, tv ratings, memberships and finance all support me. 95,000 people went to see Liverpool v Victory - i saw the game - there was so many liverpool supporters it was unbelievable. Victory got the kind of crowd how many times last season?

 

[The_Wookie]

You seem like a smart guy but this is very black and white.

A clause was negotiated in the deal between AFL and MCG meaning the AFL wasn't forced to have both Prelims at the MCG in return MCG can put on this exact sort of event when Etihad isn't a realistic option.

Etihad will be fine for a weekend, some weeks the MCG is used once- one week it might not be used at all. AFL will still happen, the AFL can't legally complain as they've got nothing- and even morally I don't think so.

The AFL have no power to stop this. The AFL won't stop this. The AFL shouldn't even if they could as it'll be fantastic for Victoria.

Do you have a problem with it? What's not black and white about this? What would you want the AFL to do?

Im glad you think its black and white, and contract wise there may welkl be nothing that the AFL can do but contracts can be re negotiated - it already has been since it was originally signed, and the AFL was already working in improving its crowds again next season after a season of experimentation.

The AFL will only have issues next year because its giving up the start of the season for the World Cup, as well as this. I say this again, the issue isnt that soccer is being scheduled at the MCG - the AFL had no problems with Origin being announced mid AFL season - its the way the AFL were not even consulted on a matter they would have traditionally, and not given any room to move.

Yes I have a problem with Victorian Major Events and the MCC pissing all over its single biggest tenant and driver of 90% of its revenue. I would have that problem if this happened in Sydney with ANZ Stadiun and the NRL. This is not about soccer, again I dont care when they play, its about the MCC treating the AFL like crap. maybe Im coming around to Kwality's way of thinking on this.

 

[pinot]

I am sure the AFL will survive by having these great clubs in Melbourne to entertain us for a weekend (woopee doo how precious can the AFL get?). Have a split round that weekend (which was going to happen anyway) problem for AFL solved.. I see it as no big deal and I am sure the AFL will lose no supporters. Now for the Socceroos to win the world cup. The MCC already have their eyeballs turned to dollar signs - it is irresistable the effect Real Madrid has.

 

[FuManchu]

100,000 people watching 90 mins of chess with a ball. Mass narcoleptic inducing event.................. there will be no speeding fines on the freeways that night as the zombies head home.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

What a whole lot of rubbish.

It's three nights of the year that will all draw 90k+, the govt, major events and MCC will be all over it.

Of course it'll happen, as it should.

It'll make absolutely no difference to the footy season, it's 3 whole nights which will affect one of the AFL's 11 stadiums, and one or more of them will probably be midweek. And it's soccer, it's not like they're going to rip the ground up. You could play footy out there the next day.

Anyone with a problem with this is just a moron. It doesn't affect anybody.

 

[Redalert]

Im glad you think its black and white, and contract wise there may welkl be nothing that the AFL can do but contracts can be re negotiated - it already has been since it was originally signed, and the AFL was already working in improving its crowds again next season after a season of experimentation.

There's absolutely no incentive to renegotiate the agreement though, why would the MCC give up their windfall without demanding heavy compensation in return? I'm also surprised that you think that there's some kind of personal relationship between the AFL and the ground that somehow transcends its operation as commercial enterprise, both parties benefit from the existing arrangement (the AFL utilise the nation's premier footy ground, they pay the MCC in return) and they'll continue to do so regardless of what happens with the games.