Opinion Mick Malthouse

[76woodenspooners]

With any luck, Malthouse quits, and you have a mutual agreement on a suitable payout. I'd suggest $750k - so we save $250 which would be less than the cost to upgrade a coach to be the stand in.

Mick will never quit.

He explicitly laid out the three options in last week's 5AA interview ( here )

(1) He gets sacked by the board
(2) The players lose confidence in him (said there's been no indication of that)
(3) He wakes up in the morning not wanting to go to work (said he loves going to work)

And of course there's the implied option ...

(4) His contract expires

... And if he was a wiser man he would see that there's another option ...

(5) Realise that others can do a much better job

I think Carlton are limited to options (1) and (4)

 

[ESKIE]

Not Worsfold, FMD

What is wrong with the idiots that run this club, same bloody process over and over

Why cant they do a process like every other club or company, morons the lot of them, make that incompetent morons, the reason we are in this situation, is they way this club has been run, we will never learn

Hopeless

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Don't think the Crows will let Woosha go mid season unfortunately

He's a part time advisor/specialist coach. They have all their coaching position covered. I doubt his agreement with the Crows ties him to them if he wants to leave.

 

[jj1978]

This time next year we will have a new coach (please lord not Woosha), some newly acquired SOS selections (maybe a baby SOS) and a list that will have to rely on themselves and their teammates and not Judd!

We will have to swallow the slow rebuild, handle the media scrutiny (Mick will be quite scathing you'd think in his media roles), but things will be better than they our now.

 

[El Topo]

So sacking Pagan robbed us and the players of seeing just what they could have produced for there? Ratten? Dees under Neeld?

How many supporters are sitting there right now in hopeful anticipation of what the team might do under Mick from now? Do you reckon we feel robbed because of what has happened, rather than some pie in the sky notion of what might happen if Mick stays and the players and game plan suddenly click?

A bird in the hand (mass beltings and dispirited performances) is worth two in the bush (Mick will suddenly get through to these guys and the game plan will click).

Massive leap of faith and I don't think our finances can afford to take it and be wrong. Something needs to freshen our perspectives. A circuit breaker.



Aside from a handful of players, we have less character in this group than any team in recent memory.

I'll happily admit that I'm wrong if Mick goes and the team's form turns around, but we all know that he is only part of the problem. The team is genuinely trying out there, as opposed to the dying days of Pagan and Ratts, which were textbook cases of coach-icide. These players weren't drafted as soulless hacks. We've always made excuses for them, the club has always pinned its hopes on brilliant individuals. I just have a gut feeling that, with these factors removed and the side at rock bottom, the players will display substance that even they themselves do not know that they have.

Or, we can just blame the head coach, repeat the cycle and be back here in another five years arguing over counterfactuals.

 

[pepalenko]

Serious question Blues fans...apologies if it's a bit of a convoluted one.

The reputation of Carlton has long been 'throw enough money at whoever they want', whether it be player, coach or hovercraft, and it should 'fix' things. There has been a bit of talk surrounding John Worsfold who most regard as a worthy coach.

If Malthouse and the Blues part ways and Carlton throw the $$$ Worsfold's way without any real process of really interviewing anyone else*, but the man they are instilling is credentialed, proven and ready to go, as is the case of Worsfold, will there be backlash from supporters, despite a worthy character taking the reigns?

I regard Worsfold as one of the best currently not coaching and I'm sure a lot of others do too.

*and no, calling up other candidates to come and interview when everybody bar the candidate knows the job's already been filled and they are wasting their time does not count as a process.

Yes, i will backlash.

 

[chelseacarlton]

Mick will gone early next week Barker will be caretaker

And here I was thinking we couldn't sink any lower!.

 

[pepalenko]

Surprised Nathan Bassett has not been mentioned more , most successful coach @ the next level

Been mentioned. I like as an opyion but i'm still confused if he can be a candidate due to the afl coaching accreditation thingy they have to do.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I'll happily admit that I'm wrong if Mick goes and the team's form turns around, but we all know that he is only part of the problem. The team is genuinely trying out there, as opposed to the dying days of Pagan and Ratts, which were textbook cases of coach-icide. These players weren't drafted as soulless hacks. We've always made excuses for them, the club has always pinned its hopes on brilliant individuals. I just have a gut feeling that, with these factors removed and the side at rock bottom, the players will display substance that even they themselves do not know that they have.

Or, we can just blame the head coach, repeat the cycle and be back here in another five years arguing over counterfactuals.

This seems inconsistent to me. Supporters advocating for Mick suggests we need a few more years of pain under Mick through a rebuild, but if another coach comes in, they'll admit they're wrong if the team's form turns around.

When Ratten was sacked, the expectation was that Mick would address our inconsistency, then he got to have the parameters shifted as it all turned to s**t. I'm not sure why a new coach would have a higher expectation than Mick currently has given Mick is in his 3rd year to get to this point, and given the expectations of Mick seem to have been lowered every year.

These players are going to show substance that they don't know they have but many of them have exhibited more consistently already by winning a lot of more games and making finals.

Let's face it, the only reason anybody is supporting this is because Mick bottomed out at Collingwood and built it back again. There is nothing currently going on at this club that anybody is basing their faith on. It's all reputation.

 

[Jatz]

I actually like the appointment of Worsfold if it happens.

What I don't like is that we haven't gone through a process to get him. It's not John's fault but a lot will resent him if this turns out to be true.

Why anyone would actually want to be employed by this rabble of a club is beyond me but anyway...

 

[Coona Blues]

If this is so, the club is stupider than any of us imagined.

Mick as head coach is gone.....only the time frame remains in question.

Do not want another old campaigner whose credentials are from a decade ago......yes Worsfold is recently retired, but his
results declined as the game escalated. His credits are outdated.

I want one of the younger brigade. Analytical, innovative, open, progressive and up to speed with the modern game.

The most successful new breed of coaches have emanated from Hawthorn, Geelong and at a stretch Sydney of late.
They have the successful model to draw on. It would be ridiculous not to draw on someone with up to date experience
from one of them.

Coaches without AFL playing experience are like hen's teeth, however diminutive Brendan Bolton had a significant playing
career at representative level in Tassie, before a premature retirement to explore an obvious passion for coaching. He has
already made monumental progress resulting in a successful stint filling in for Clarko. To be selected ahead of his peers to
take the reins was testament enough.

Let's face it though, our conservative business type executive would be loath to "gamble" on a "speculative" choice. This
thinking condemned us to Malthouse at a ridiculous premium. His wages over the last couple of years would set most
Aussie families up for life (and he is holding out for every last penny, rather than putting club first)

We need to appoint a Director of Coaching or an ultra experienced Senior Assistant in tandem with a Bolton, Dew, Nicks type.
If the price tag wasn't prohibitive and his ego allowed it, I wouldn't be totally against MM, but the likes of Worsfold would be
ideal. If we went the Senior Assistant trail, McKenna comes to mind, who did much better with Gen Y Gold Coast than another
old campaigner in Eade.

We then need to surround them with the best possible Development and Line Coaches to ensure we get the best possible
results from our list. I still see plenty of talent and upside on our list. I would love to know if Graham, Watson, Buckley
and co have the scope I believe they have.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Update

2002 - 76.4 avg points for 104.5 avg points against
--------------------------------------------- Pagan in
2003 - 81.0 for 121.5 against
2004 - 82.9 for 101.5 against
2005 - 91.6 for 121.3 against
2006 - 81.4 for 109.7 against
2007 - 98.5 for 132.3 against
---------------------------------------------- Ratten in
2008 - 100.7 for 107 against
2009 - 103.1 for 93.4 against
2010 - 97.4 for 90.1 against
2011 - 101.1 for 77.2 against
2012 - 94.5 for 87.5 against
---------------------------------------------- Malthouse in
2013 - 96.5 for 90.5 against
2014 - 85.9 for 95.7 against
2015 - 73.1 for 112.6 against

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

We need to appoint a Director of Coaching or an ultra experienced Senior Assistant in tandem with a Bolton, Dew, Nicks type.
If the price tag wasn't prohibitive and his ego allowed it, I wouldn't be totally against MM, bit the likes of Worsfold would be
ideal. If we went the Senior Assistant trail, McKenna comes to mind, who did much better with Gen Y Gold Coast than another
old campaigner in Eade.

We then need to surround them with the best possible Development and Line Coaches to ensure we get the best possible
results from our list. I still see plenty of talent and upside on our list. I would love to know if Graham, Watson, Buckley
and co have the scope I believe they have.

Mick is an authoritative coach. This is what I want, go out and do it.

A younger coach would be more consultative. With a 3 year contract, more willing to take advice in his first and second years.

We have Laidley there. He could be a director of coaching. Wiley is there. Problem is the guys there are Mick's assistants, paid to prepare the side in the manner he wants but not to question anything. I would like to see a more collaborative approach. If you have a dominant head coach, they have to wear the responsibility.

You can't be scared to have quality thinkers in your box in case they steal your job. They also serve to keep you in a job.

 

[smashbox gill]

If they give the job to Woosha without due diligence and going through a process im done with this club.

I cant continue to take these stupid calls. Why cant they realise they need to stop living in the past!

 

[El Topo]

This seems inconsistent to me. Supporters advocating for Mick suggests we need a few more years of pain under Mick through a rebuild, but if another coach comes in, they'll admit they're wrong if the team's form turns around.

When Ratten was sacked, the expectation was that Mick would address our inconsistency, then he got to have the parameters shifted as it all turned to s**t. I'm not sure why a new coach would have a higher expectation than Mick currently has given Mick is in his 3rd year to get to this point, and given the expectations of Mick seem to have been lowered every year.

These players are going to show substance that they don't know they have but many of them have exhibited more consistently already by winning a lot of more games and making finals.

Let's face it, the only reason anybody is supporting this is because Mick bottomed out at Collingwood and built it back again. There is nothing currently going on at this club currently that anybody is basing their faith on. It's all reputation.

FWIW I think that Mick needs to go at year's end. I'm not basing my view on faith in the coach, I'm basing it on the fact that he is clearly only part of the problem. With any luck, the end of the year will see a complete overhaul of the coaching and football departments.

The team that consistently scraped into finals under Ratts did so with an unacceptable number of passengers, if that side really had substance they wouldn't have shat the bed against lower teams in H & A games to get stuck with interstate finals!

Again, this is purely a gut feeling. Mick is gone either way but it's about time that players not named Murphy or Judd take responsibility. These guys were drafted as footballers, they've been playing their whole lives. This time, without any messiahs or places to hide, I think that with no other option, the team may just surprise us.

 

[Wickzki]

Have a fear that on the outside the club will claim to have gone through the processes, give several interviews to give the look that they've done due diligence with most fans eating it up when they've gone into it with a clear 'we're hiring this guy regardless' attitude.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

FWIW I think that Mick needs to go at year's end. I'm not basing my view on faith in the coach, I'm basing it on the fact that he is clearly only part of the problem. With any luck, the end of the year will see a complete overhaul of the coaching and football departments.

Agreed, there are problems everywhere. This should not mask Mick's lack of judgement and foresight, and inability to teach a game plan which has become worse as time goes on.

The team that consistently scraped into finals under Ratts did so with an unacceptable number of passengers, if that side really had substance they wouldn't have shat the bed against lower teams in H & A games to get stuck with interstate finals!

I'd love to go back and s**t the bed all over again right now .... good times.

Seriously you can't bag these passengers while talking up the current team as having substance that they will soon show. You can only judge on performance.

Again, this is purely a gut feeling. Mick is gone either way but it's about time that players not named Murphy or Judd take responsibility. These guys were drafted as footballers, they've been playing their whole lives. This time, without any messiahs or places to hide, I think that with no other option, the team may just surprise us.

The playing list is fragile, has been for a while. Mick has made them worse. It was retrievable in 2012. It's not now. Clean house I guess.

 

[GoBlues!]

Update

2002 - 76.4 avg points for 104.5 avg points against
--------------------------------------------- Pagan in
2003 - 81.0 for 121.5 against
2004 - 82.9 for 101.5 against
2005 - 91.6 for 121.3 against
2006 - 81.4 for 109.7 against
2007 - 98.5 for 132.3 against
---------------------------------------------- Ratten in
2008 - 100.7 for 107 against
2009 - 103.1 for 93.4 against
2010 - 97.4 for 90.1 against
2011 - 101.1 for 77.2 against
2012 - 94.5 for 87.5 against
---------------------------------------------- Malthouse in
2013 - 96.5 for 90.5 against
2014 - 85.9 for 95.7 against
2015 - 73.1 for 112.6 against

The changes in scores for and against has probably more to do with corresponding changes in players than coaches imo.

Fevola was the main productive forward in the Pagan years. The introduction of Betts, Garlett and Walker, as forwards, and an improving Fevola in the Ratten years increased our scoring power. The first year under MM was okay but then the loss of Betts, Waite and Garlett with no comparable replacements, combined with a midfield on the decline is why our average scores have fallen.

 

[lachie charm]

Pretty confident the Woosha rumour will be as accurate (or inaccurate) as DVB's other rumours lately.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

The changes in scores for and against has probably more to do with corresponding changes in players than coaches imo.

Fevola was the main productive forward in the Pagan years. The introduction of Betts, Garlett and Walker, as forwards, and an improving Fevola in the Ratten years increased our scoring power. The first year under MM was okay but then the loss of Betts, Waite and Garlett with no comparable replacements, combined with a midfield on the decline is why our average scores have fallen.

It's more about the increasing gap between for and against. This is currently our 4th worst defence over this period and our worst attack. We still have Sydney, Hawthorn, Fremantle, Port Adelaide to play.

Look at those other poor years then go back and compare lists then ask yourself if we should be doing better.

 

[Paulski19]

You've been very confident on everything you've posted. But this is the first call where there's a definitive outcome in the short-term.

Not a Barker fan, but anything is better than Malthouse.

I call BS

 

[ShanDog]

No you don't know that. All you know is what is reality, and that is that mick is one of the biggest failures in the history of our club. To suggest it would've been the same regardless of who we had appointed or kept, is just pure speculation at best.

Do you deliberately write posts that contradict themselves?

 

[pepalenko]

Have a fear that on the outside the club will claim to have gone through the processes, give several interviews to give the look that they've done due diligence with most fans eating it up when they've gone into it with a clear 'we're hiring this guy regardless' attitude.

Well they will have to tell members who the candidates were and how the selection was made. Transparency please.

 

[Aphrodite]

There was mixed messages coming from both the board and MM.

For instance, Mick really wanted to keep Jeffy, but apparently someone at board/admin level wanted him gone for Cultural reasons.

I have no idea if Mick was behind our list management/draft strategies last year,.am very happy with Boek and Clem and Matt Dick, but picking up Jones and Tutt was appallingly ill-advised.

Happy still with Jaksch (St Kilda offered pick 1 for him and O'Rourke)

Don't think anyone at the club at board has told Mick to play kids and the only reason Warnock is playing is to try and raise his non-existent trade value)

Where does the club know (collectively) where we're at ?

Everyone at the club should shoulder the responsibility in some way, including Mick, but lets face it, club politics and internal disarray in the inner sanctum makes it a poor working environment for both coaches and players.

John Worsfold is over the line as our new coach, lock it in Eddie. (according to someone who spoke to Gavin Brown a few days ago

Hopefully Woosha can give us the 'prescription' to rebuild our list. You don't have to be a chemist to realize we have the worst list in the league.

Was against Woosha initially, but the more I think about it, the more it feels right.

Are you part of the 'inner sanctum' DVB!

 

[Quazza]

Process. Pleeeeeasseeeeee go through a process to find a new coach. Interview some prospects ffs