Pendles and Elliott put paid to silly rumours

[dubber]

No.
Most rational and unbiased supporters can see unrest at Collingwood.
It's your right to close your eyes.

There is definitely unrest at Collingwood. Some players are not happy and wanting to move on. The club is not in a good place right now but i believe things can turnaround pretty quickly.
A fact that remains and is being ignored by the likes of you is that the majority of our list has stayed and re-signed. So people like you are all doom and gloom & i can pretty much guarantee that at the first sign of success you will stop posting from this account & create a new one.

 

[DKS17]

Not a liar.
Just unreflective of all the recent actions.
In my world, actions speak louder than words.
Be it Mitch Clark choosing another culture as a preference.
Be it your second best player walking out of the club.
I am not naive enough to believe Beams is only walking due to his fathers health.

So if in your world actions speak louder than words what does that fact that we had 13 guys this year alone sign new contracts mean?

Would think that those actions speak pretty loudly to the fact that there isn't the level of unrest of Collingwood your trying to purport

 

[dubber]

So then you do believe her claim that Beams dislikes leading teams rather than, as you suggested, it being simply the false claim of a 'journo generating sales'?

So a pupil in a school does not like the curriculum, should the whole school change for this one kid?

 

[SugarCoat]

But you are naive enough to believe that a grave illness to his father should irrelevant.

I never said it's irrelevant.
But there are many reasons why Beams is leaving and those don't purely relate to his fathers sickness.

 

[dubber]

I never said it's irrelevant.
But there are many reasons why Beams is leaving and those don't purely relate to his fathers sickness.

- He does not like leading teams.
- He misses his mate Heath Shaw
- He wants to play with his brother Clay
- He wants to be close to his dad

Anything i missed?

 

[Swooper18]

- He does not like leading teams.
- He misses his mate Heath Shaw
- He wants to play with his brother Clay
- He wants to be close to his dad

Anything i missed?

Claye would be better.

 

[SugarCoat]

- He does not like leading teams.
- He misses his mate Heath Shaw
- He wants to play with his brother Clay
- He wants to be close to his dad

Anything i missed?

Overall, he doesn't appear happy.
Father is very important.
But his mate Shaw has been traded.
Thomas his other mate was let go.
The pull of staying at Collingwood isn't as great for Beams anymore.
Happiness has been eroded and the pull of Claye and his father is now making him want to go to a happier place.
Cue Happy Glimore.

 

[No SPIN]

I never said it's irrelevant.
But there are many reasons why Beams is leaving and those don't purely relate to his fathers sickness.

Sorry mate all the other reasons are of very very very low significance compared to the very very very important issue of his Dads health - but you naively can't understand that.

 

[Manic Magpie]

So a pupil in a school does not like the curriculum, should the whole school change for this one kid?

All I am saying is that evidence exists, anecdotal and otherwise, to suggest that some players don't seem comfortable at the club. There are also players whose performance has remained static or gone backwards.

I purposely highlighted Caro's claim re Beams because other posters had said in another thread that no evidence existed that Beams did not like leading teams. There are actually 2 sources, Caro and Eddie, who have indicated that Beams is not all that enamoured with the leading teams program.

To follow through on your analogy, the success of a school curriculum and the quality of it teachers are judged by results. If the best and brightest students leave the school, results will suffer. The same will occur if students fail to improve their own scores and ability. At this point, the curriculum and the quality of its teaching staff will be questioned.

 

[Pendles!]

Overall, he doesn't appear happy.
Father is very important.
But his mate Shaw has been traded.
Thomas his other mate was let go.
The pull of staying at Collingwood isn't as great for Beams anymore.
Happiness has been eroded and the pull of Claye and his father is now making him want to go to a happier place.
Cue Happy Glimore.

The mates thing is bullcrap. His best mate at the club is Steele and he gets on very well with Seedo. Beams and Thomas weren't that close at all.

 

[No SPIN]

Overall, he doesn't appear happy.
Father is very important.
But his mate Shaw has been traded.
Thomas his other mate was let go.
The pull of staying at Collingwood isn't as great for Beams anymore.
Happiness has been eroded and the pull of Claye and his father is now making him want to go to a happier place.
Cue Happy Glimore.

If his father was in MELB you are actually suggesting that the above would make him move to an interstate club for more money - that is just BS.
He would stay in MELB with his ill father - enough said.
Therefore the above reasons are crap as an explanation for his leaving.

 

[SugarCoat]

The mates thing is bullcrap. His best mate at the club is Steele and he gets on very well with Seedo. Beams and Thomas weren't that close at all.

That is bulltish.
Beamsy and Thomas are very close friends.

 

[dubber]

All I am saying is that evidence exists, anecdotal and otherwise, to suggest that some players don't seem comfortable at the club. There are also players whose performance has remained static or gone backwards.

I purposely highlighted Caro's claim re Beams because other posters had said in another thread that no evidence existed that Beams did not like leading teams. There are actually 2 sources, Caro and Eddie, who have indicated that Beams is not all that enamoured with the leading teams program.

To follow through on your analogy, the success of a school curriculum and the quality of it teachers are judged by results. If the best and brightest students leave the school, results will suffer. The same will occur if students fail to improve their own scores and ability. At this point, the curriculum and the quality of its teaching staff will be questioned.

I am not suggesting that everything is honky dory down at Westpac. What I am suggesting is that since the change of regime there has been a shift in the direction of the club and a real determination to improve it's culture. As part of this shift there will be a fallout let's not be naive about it. Not everyone is going to sign up for it. Again, how many players have walked out since Buckley took over?

This is not the time to waver from the direction Collingwood has decided to go. We must stick to the principles & let it run it's course. I am very confident that as a club we will be better in the long run.

 

[PieBeast]

 

[dubber]

 

[Pendles!]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuckman's_stages_of_group_development

 

[jmac70]

That is bulltish.
Beamsy and Thomas are very close friends.

Thomas and Swanny are pretty close too. What's your point?

 

[eddiebankbalance]

The mates thing is bullcrap. His best mate at the club is Steele and he gets on very well with Seedo. Beams and Thomas weren't that close at all.

Plane flight from Melb to Syd or Syd to Goldcoast is the same. Add another 20min Syd to Brisbane. So this "missing Heath" is just a thrown in excuse.

 

[Pendles!]

Plane flight from Melb to Syd or Syd to Goldcoast is the same. Add another 20min Syd to Brisbane. So this "missing Heath" is just a thrown in excuse.

I could understand it, because it'd be s**t being at a footy club when you've got no mates. But bloody hell, if you're at a footy club and you've got no mates then the problem is with that individual.

But its not like he doesn't have any friends at the club, so its a crap excuse being sprouted by his manager.

 

[eddiebankbalance]

I could understand it, because it'd be s**t being at a footy club when you've got no mates. But bloody hell, if you're at a footy club and you've got no mates then the problem is with that individual.

But its not like he doesn't have any friends at the club, so its a crap excuse being sprouted by his manager.

Yeah but he's asking to be traded to Brisbane and not GWS. Brisbane to Sydney is a longer plane filght than Melbourne to Sydney. So he wont be any closer to Heath, just saying.

Although, I understand your point that it's possible he is missing Heath, it's just not a valid reason for wanting out of Collingwood.

 

[Pendles!]

Yeah but he's asking to be traded to Brisbane and not GWS. Brisbane to Sydney is a longer plane filght than Melbourne to Sydney. So he wont be any closer to Heath, just saying.

Although, I understand your point that it's possible he is missing Heath, it's just not a valid reason for wanting out of Collingwood.

I absolutely agree.

 

[jackcass]

There is definitely unrest at Collingwood. Some players are not happy and wanting to move on. The club is not in a good place right now but i believe things can turnaround pretty quickly.
A fact that remains and is being ignored by the likes of you is that the majority of our list has stayed and re-signed. So people like you are all doom and gloom & i can pretty much guarantee that at the first sign of success you will stop posting from this account & create a new one.

Not a fan of the term "unrest" in this context. Hong Kong has "unrest", Syria has "unrest", what we've got is a mere ripple on the pond by comparison.

Is everything perfect at Pieland, no. Is everyone working to improve the club and it's personel, I think so.

 

[frizzle]

I am not suggesting that everything is honky dory down at Westpac. What I am suggesting is that since the change of regime there has been a shift in the direction of the club and a real determination to improve it's culture. As part of this shift there will be a fallout let's not be naive about it. Not everyone is going to sign up for it. Again, how many players have walked out since Buckley took over?

This is not the time to waver from the direction Collingwood has decided to go. We must stick to the principles & let it run it's course. I am very confident that as a club we will be better in the long run.

Well put. Stick fat & think long term.
If there is a fallout from us being more professional in our approach & vastly fitter then so be it. We need to follow the culture shift through.

 

[good4footy]

My favourite story about leading teams is one involving Joel Selwood captain of one of the teams we should aspire to be.

Paraphrased- but Scarlett one of the greatest players in history of the club questioned and was unhappy about the use of leading teams. He was turned around by the group about its existence within their club. When asked what would have happened if Scarlett did not come around- Selwood replied- he would have been traded.

You can not be successful by pandering to individuals- just because a club has a number of them like Shaw, Thomas, Wellingham, H, etc does not mean moving them on for future success is not the right thing. If players do not want to be part of the vision then see ya later.

When your coaching group, captain and leadership group are as one, then the rest either fall in line or go away. It is not about 'right or wrong' but 'in or out'. Some are choosing to be out whist the majority are choosing in.

 

[Big Bryza]

In all fairness, what would you expect them to say?

"Yeah, Bucks is a clueless twit"?

Once I opened this thread I knew the first reply would be something along the lines of the above.

Maybe Elliott and Pendles are actually sick of hearing all this bullshit? Good on them for standing up for Bucks.