Pretty big wraps for Clarke to be compared to Punter as Ponting was a once in a generation type player. Incredible bat and spectacular fieldsman.
Ponting (95-12) vs Clarke (04-14)
- Thread starter Smiling Buddha
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- Jan 13, 2001
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Quite simply:
Ponting - the debate is where to bat him in Australia's best ever team (would bat at #5 for me, Bradman 3, G. Chappell 4)
Clarke - is does he even fit into the 2nd XI? for me, No.
Ponting - the debate is where to bat him in Australia's best ever team (would bat at #5 for me, Bradman 3, G. Chappell 4)
Clarke - is does he even fit into the 2nd XI? for me, No.
Ricky Ponting retiring was one of the saddest moments in my life. I found it impossible to envisage Australian cricket without Ricky Ponting.
An absolute champion and the reason I still buy Kookaburras today.
An absolute champion and the reason I still buy Kookaburras today.
- May 5, 2006
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I don't think Ponting retiring was a particularly sad moment at all.
His form dropped off after about 2008/9 and he should've pulled up stumps when he handed over the captaincy to Clarke. Held on too long IMO.
His form dropped off after about 2008/9 and he should've pulled up stumps when he handed over the captaincy to Clarke. Held on too long IMO.
I've always thought he should of retired after the summer here against the Indians, he made a lot of runs but i still didn't think he looked all that convincing.
After reading his book for the last few years he just seemed mentally shot, its a good lesson for treating our best players in the future however id hate it get to the stage where players start retiring to early just to protect stats.
- Aug 11, 2008
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It's a myth that Ponting led an all star team for all (or even most) of his captaincy. Of his 77 tests as captain, he only had McGrath and Warne 25 and 34 times respectively. Basically the entire second half of his captaincy saw teams very similar in quality to the ones Clarke has had at his disposal.
And I know it was already corrected, but Ponting's record was much better. Even his record without most of the greats is pretty much identical. It wasn't until right near the end where our performances truly went to s**t.
Attributed to more than just poor captaincy. Some horrendous selections with players way out of form, or players coming up from the state league who shouldn't have been near the test team, poor training, poor coaching. CA acknowledged this a few years back and set about redeeming themselves and getting Australia back to no.1. I think they've done a good job of it, but they can still do better.
Yes, Ponting got screwed over by dud selectors and Tim Nielsen's attempts to reduce the role of the Captain.
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Ponting won 27/35 tests to the conclusion of the 2006/7 Ashes. That's a pretty good head start. From then on it drops to 21/42.
The key difference for mine is that Ponting inherited a strong side with a winning culture while Clarke took over when the team was at a pretty low ebb. It feels more like Clarke's side since Ponting retired altogether too.
To sweep the Ashes 5-0 and roll South Africa in South Africa following a belting in India and an Ashes defeat is a massive turnaround. Plenty of credit for that should go to Clarke and Lehman. And Johnson obviously.
As a batsman, clearly Ponting. Ponting's sustained peak eclipses Clarke's (though at their absolute peaks there isn't much between them), although one must consider that Clarke has been unlucky to have a back injury which has made him somewhat uncomfortable against short balls bowled at pace. He's also a better player of spin than Ponting was (though Ponting was by no means bad against spin). However, Ponting excelled at #3 for a long period (a position which typically, though not always, marks out your best batsman), whereas Clarke made his home at #5 and has merely been decent at #4.
As a captain, Clarke is a superior tactician, no question. The problem with Ponting was that he was too reactive - fine in a more defensive format like ODI's, but problematic in Tests because the bowlers can't bowl to a set field if you keep shifting things after a boundary has been scored. Clarke was more patient and got more out of his bowlers than Ponting was able to (helping to unlock the Johnson enigma was a big achievement). The only area where Clarke falls behind Ponting is maybe man-management, but he's been better with this since Darren Lehmann came in.
Of course, Ponting wasn't helped by terrible coaching (Nielsen/Cooley/Langer) and selections from Hilditch and co. Hilditch is pretty much a walking Peter Principle in cricket - consistently promoted beyond his ability. To his credit, it seemed that Ponting recognised this during his tenure but could do little about it but watch as his team slid down the rankings. Thank god those days are over.
Moreover, with hindsight Ponting should have retired after India 2011/12, after piling on runs against a lousy Indian bowling lineup. When should Clarke retire? Hard to say, depends on injury. He's still contributing when half-fit.
As a captain, Clarke is a superior tactician, no question. The problem with Ponting was that he was too reactive - fine in a more defensive format like ODI's, but problematic in Tests because the bowlers can't bowl to a set field if you keep shifting things after a boundary has been scored. Clarke was more patient and got more out of his bowlers than Ponting was able to (helping to unlock the Johnson enigma was a big achievement). The only area where Clarke falls behind Ponting is maybe man-management, but he's been better with this since Darren Lehmann came in.
Of course, Ponting wasn't helped by terrible coaching (Nielsen/Cooley/Langer) and selections from Hilditch and co. Hilditch is pretty much a walking Peter Principle in cricket - consistently promoted beyond his ability. To his credit, it seemed that Ponting recognised this during his tenure but could do little about it but watch as his team slid down the rankings. Thank god those days are over.
Moreover, with hindsight Ponting should have retired after India 2011/12, after piling on runs against a lousy Indian bowling lineup. When should Clarke retire? Hard to say, depends on injury. He's still contributing when half-fit.
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