Analysis Post match Discussion

[jackcass]

Well watched the game again and the key thing I noticed was the pressure all over the ground. there was one period were they either took the foot off or tired but came back strongly. Although it is worth noting that we had over 160 inter changes.

I didn't worry too about opposition as you can only beat what you are up against and we did that convincingly.

Don't see the issues re Adams, thought he worked hard and his disposal is much improved, still see a lot of upside in him.

Was surprised by Ramsey and Gault, both young players and have improved from last year, would hang on to both.

The only slight disappointment was Varcoe, I think I will reserve judgement, but for a senior experience player, didn't impress me in this game.

And... as I have critised Fasolo in the past, his kicking for goal is one of the best in the team.

Edit: I thought it was good of JBrown to give us a clue that the Brisbane backline during practice matches had difficulty in manning K. thanks!

Although it was in the rules... as was 26 plus 2 subs... what's interesting is that Clarkson should be sooking because they only had the 26 (no subs) and then lost 1, and only used the 120ish I/C rotations... hello... like that was our fault!

 

[jackcass]

Maxy he might be as good as....in 200 games or so.....but Jimmy Clement? No put downs on young Tommy but that's like comparing silk to sail cloth.

Even Jimmy struggled early, which is why Freo were happy to trade him. Clement had 80-90 senior games at Freo over 5-6 season before coming to the Pies. Think if you compare their respective first 20 or even 50 (when Langdon gets there) games you'll find more similarities.

 

[jackcass]

Don't really see the comparison with Clement. Jimmy was lightning quick over 20m, strong as an ox, a great judge of the ball in flight, a beautiful kick of the pill and a competitive beast. The best backman ive seen at Collingwood in all honesty.

But I am excited about Tommy. F*** it, he'll be better!

I wouldn't say that Langdon is slow though, be interesting to see what their respective 20m sprint times were pre-draft.

 

[jackcass]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...ked-to-the-game-of-footy-20150227-13qjfj.html

OK, I could be in the minority here. Martin Flanagan, a writer and commentator who's opinions I respect, and who's thoughts on footy are usually right on the mark, enjoyed Brown's debut as a commentator. He thought Brown 'energised' the commentary team.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/tasmania-inextricably-linked-to-the-game-of-footy-20150227-13qjfj.html

But we are talking Brereton and Russell...

 

[jackcass]

I think average age for us was 23 and Hawks was just over 22. Oldest players were Mitchell (31) and Toovey (28 later this month). Average games played was 43 for the Hawks and 46 for the pies.

It was actually a pretty even contest in terms of age profile and games played, which is really exciting imo. To be able to crush the Hawks like that while both playing very young teams bodes well for our future.

Difference is that we'll be relying on more of our young players during the H&A season than they will (discounting injuries of course) theirs.

 

[jackcass]

I wasn't that excited by Brown the other night given the space that McEvoy got on him - Frost I think is a better defender already and offers more carry.

First real competitive hitout since he did his shoulder last year so happy to cut him some slack.

 

[Old Spice]

First real competitive hitout since he did his shoulder last year so happy to cut him some slack.

Yes, has credit in the bank and rusty as you say but needs to show great defensive capability given his lack of creative play. I think he might be a good match for Hawkins but have some concerns about his ability to stick with athletic leading fowards which are an increasing quantity.

 

[Apex36]

Difference is that we'll be relying on more of our young players during the H&A season than they will (discounting injuries of course) theirs.

Hence the reason I said future, not present.

 

[Bay Pie]

Tongue in cheek, but the likes of Brand, Pittonet, Miller-Lewis, Howe, Hardisty, Willsmore and Miles (a quarter of their line up) are likely to spend time in Box Hill's reserves this year if they're as strong as 2013-14. The last 45 minutes of that match was designed specifically by Clarkson to have players get extra run in their legs and catch up to teams like us.

If Hawthorn had a stand alone VFL side like we do, they'd all be playing VFL seniors. They depth around players 30/44 isn't all that flash considering the result of the game.

As for Clarkson, I'd suggest every coach in the AFL is trying the same thing during the NAB Challenge. 5 interchanges to 6 was a disadvantage. The subs for us meant nothing in the context of the game. The bottom end of our list showed up theirs, pure and simple.

 

[Boris the Contradiction]

I think Adams was better. Had most Touches and put his body on the Line. Thomas and Kennedy be fighting for a Spot in the Best 22

You're probably right about the pecking order. Then again, I think Kennedy will be fast=tracked this year. He has to be, or he will be on the scrap heap very quickly I fear.

 

[jmac70]

You're probably right about the pecking order. Then again, I think Kennedy will be fast=tracked this year. He has to be, or he will be on the scrap heap very quickly I fear.

How will he be fast tracked?

 

[Boris the Contradiction]

How will he be fast tracked?

Fast-tracked in that at least for a while he will be treated as a core player even if he is yet to establish himself.

He will be given a decent run of games no matter what. We are rebuilding and simply have to find out if he us up to it. For what it's worth, I think he is probably in or close to the best 22 anyway.

 

[jmac70]

Fast=tracked in that at least for a while he will be treated as a core player even if he is yet to establish himself.

He will be given a decent run of games no matter what. We are rebuilding and simply have to find out if he us up to it. For what it's worth, I think he is probably in or close to the best 22 anyway.

He will only become a regular player if his form warrants it. There is no way he will be gifted games ahead of experienced players such as Blair.

 

[wednesdaywarrior]

If Hawthorn had a stand alone VFL side like we do, they'd all be playing VFL seniors. They depth around players 30/44 isn't all that flash considering the result of the game.

As for Clarkson, I'd suggest every coach in the AFL is trying the same thing during the NAB Challenge. 5 interchanges to 6 was a disadvantage. The subs for us meant nothing in the context of the game. The bottom end of our list showed up theirs, pure and simple.

Good observation. You sort of feel like with the number of high picks and experienced players we've traded out we should be starting to out point Hawthorn and most other teams at this end of our list. I made a point late last year that perhaps a few of the Hawks younger players being touted as superstars were living a little off the coat tails of Mitchell, Lewis, Hodge and co. When those blokes eventually start to wane we will see the real Hawthorn once these players have to play fromt line roles rather than getting the easy ball. Whereas our infants like Grundy, Elliott, Langdon, Adams etc etc etc have already been playing front line roles for two years now! The Hawks are still a deadly good list and it will probably be a kind of slow burning decline like we're witnessing with Geelong and obviously they are bloody brilliant at replacing talent, they are still producing quality like Anderson and because trading is now a case of 'bees to a honey pot' they are luring big names like Frawley. But it won't go on forever. I like to think what we saw the other day was Collingwoods future beating Hawthorns future. I liked it. I've been getting very sick of losing to them.

 

[jmac70]

It's interesting that the equivalent thread on the Hawthorn board is well over 30 pages. Did we dent their pride just a little?

 

[jackcass]

Hence the reason I said future, not present.

I think it'll produce good results in 2015 as well, assuming a few things go our way.

 

[Kappa]

It's interesting that the equivalent thread on the Hawthorn board is well over 30 pages. Did we dent their pride just a little?

They had a look at their youth and hit the panic stations

 

[Ingy]

He will only become a regular player if his form warrants it. There is no way he will be gifted games ahead of experienced players such as Blair.

Maybe not gifted, but I think Boris is right and the standard of performance expected of Kennedy to retain his spot might be lowered. I expect him to play regularly at the start of the year, hopefully his form makes that compulsory and the question of whether he would have been dropped is moot.

After all those vests last year, he deserves a decent run at it IMO

 

[Apex36]

I think it'll produce good results in 2015 as well, assuming a few things go our way.

Indeed.

 

[Robroy22]

Even Jimmy struggled early, which is why Freo were happy to trade him. Clement had 80-90 senior games at Freo over 5-6 season before coming to the Pies. Think if you compare their respective first 20 or even 50 (when Langdon gets there) games you'll find more similarities.

I think having a coach that believed in him and allowing JC to play across half back might have brought out the best in him...I take your point about him starting slowly (and can even remember him being a lightly built wingman/half forward for Freo)
I think Tommy is a great find by his first year standards but comparing him to Clement is just a stretch. I'd rate Clement right up there with Doull, Ayres and Kenny Hunter. Fabulous player and a champion bloke to go with it.

 

[jackcass]

I think having a coach that believed in him and allowing JC to play across half back might have brought out the best in him...I take your point about him starting slowly (and can even remember him being a lightly built wingman/half forward for Freo)
I think Tommy is a great find by his first year standards but comparing him to Clement is just a stretch. I'd rate Clement right up there with Doull, Ayres and Kenny Hunter. Fabulous player and a champion bloke to go with it.

Yeah, I'm not questioning how good Clement was, 2x B&F, 2x AA. Was a legend.

But year 1 comparison, Clement 10-11 games, Langdon 19-20 games and I'd say at a higher level than Clement. Can Langdon continue to develop and have a career the equal of Clement... hopefully, but ahead at this stage. Did Clement get a RS nomination?

And unless I'm mistaken Clement played predominantly HB at Freo, maybe 1 season forward. Having the faith of a coach may have been the difference as he certainly didn't have Drum's.

 

[jmac70]

Maybe not gifted, but I think Boris is right and the standard of performance expected of Kennedy to retain his spot might be lowered. I expect him to play regularly at the start of the year, hopefully his form makes that compulsory and the question of whether he would have been dropped is moot.

After all those vests last year, he deserves a decent run at it IMO

It's an elite sporting environment. Kennedy will have to perform at a standard that places him in the best 22 available players to win the game. The expectation is to play finals.

 

[Bay Pie]

It's interesting that the equivalent thread on the Hawthorn board is well over 30 pages. Did we dent their pride just a little?

They had a look at their youth and hit the panic stations

I recall around 2011/2012 St.Kilda were spruiking their youngsters. Lose some older guns, then you see them for what they are. Some youngsters shine when they are just role players. However, when it's time to step up and become the guys that start the play, they get found out.

 

[Old Spice]

I recall around 2011/2012 St.Kilda were spruiking their youngsters. Lose some older guns, then you see them for what they are. Some youngsters shine when they are just role players. However, when it's time to step up and become the guys that start the play, they get found out.

Prismallesque.

 

[Quicky]

It's an elite sporting environment. Kennedy will have to perform at a standard that places him in the best 22 available players to win the game. The expectation is to play finals.

True. And considering this his performance against Hawthorn has done him no harm.