New academy bidding system

[Fatcat08]

I did a count last year on QLD players if we had a state or origin and came up to over 40, which I was surprised at. Lots of ruckmen on lists around the place.

The list is very very tall and has a lot of lower tier talent on it. While the numbers don't look horrendous, there aren't many on that list that you could term A Grade talent. Lots of athletic big men that perhaps lack a lot of game awareness/impact. Its not surprising really given the focus previous to the academies was to largely go after those tall athletes who played in sports where the money (in Australia) wasn't super or didn't fit into the body type of the other major sports. Lots of ex basketball, volleyballers, rowers even soccer players or guys who just got too tall (with the wrong body types) for a real crack at League or union. That's one thing the academies have done is given some ammunition to try to entice some of the better league and union prospects, still its a long road thats only just begun.

 

[winged1]

The list is very very tall and has a lot of lower tier talent on it. While the numbers don't look horrendous, there aren't many on that list that you could term A Grade talent. Lots of athletic big men that perhaps lack a lot of game awareness/impact. Its not surprising really given the focus previous to the academies was to largely go after those tall athletes who played in sports where the money (in Australia) wasn't super or didn't fit into the body type of the other major sports. Lots of ex basketball, volleyballers, rowers even soccer players or guys who just got too tall (with the wrong body types) for a real crack at League or union. That's one thing the academies have done is given some ammunition to try to entice some of the better league and union prospects, still its a long road thats only just begun.

You forgot the gymnasts and ballet dancers. Work your whole life towards a goal then grow too tall

From that list we landed the most talented player in Beams.

 

[mark121]

If I understand the proposed system, I think you pretty much have it. Except that we don't get to choose which pick to down grade. The next-most-valuable pick is down graded. If there are left over points, they are deducted from the first round of the next draft. For example, if there are 200 points carry over, draft pick 12 is downgraded to pick 16.

I think this is one of the biggest problems with the proposed new bidding process and one they will need to fix.

 

[John]

I have just read this through and I dont get any of it. I suppose that says a lot about me.

 

[MacMum]

I put a post in the other Academy thread, perhaps I should've put it here..

Hammo has done a very good article on the Academies in the northern states....also gave it to Eddie too. Was on the HUN website today.

..as you all know, I'm a dumb bum for doing links, soooooo...

 

[Ironmonger]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-02-...g-for-lateround-fatherson-and-academy-players

It looks as though the problems we identified earlier on this thread are being looked at.

BIDDING on father-son or academy players after the draft's second round could be scrapped if a recommendation to amend the AFL’s proposed bidding system is given the green light.

But the potential to lose out in future drafts for taking a father-son or academy pick after the second round looms as a contentious issue.

If clubs were allowed near free access on players who didn't attract at least a second round bid, then that wouldn't solve the problem where to take Dawson and Andrews last year we'd have had to downgrade our first round pick the following year, but it seems as though they're working towards a solution.

 

[Panthera]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-02-...g-for-lateround-fatherson-and-academy-players

It looks as though the problems we identified earlier on this thread are being looked at.





If clubs were allowed near free access on players who didn't attract at least a second round bid, then that wouldn't solve the problem where to take Dawson and Andrews last year we'd have had to downgrade our first round pick the following year, but it seems as though they're working towards a solution.

That actually makes sense. First and Second round bids only which basically means the AFL will knock the idea on its head

 

[Chasing the Dream]

I have developed a draft abacus.

Draft picks will be given a colour... Green, Orange, Red, Blue or Yellow.

Teams would randomly draw for balls from a large barrel, they would of course be coloured as per above...

If a club has an academy or F/S player bid on, he is given a colour from the abacus. For example Heeney would have obviously given green, as teams would have been green with envy that the Swans could pick him up.

Now a green draft pick is complicated. They would naturally need to be giving up a Blue and Yellow draft pick. That is how you get green isn't it....

The next most valuable pick would be an orange pick... You here would need to give up a red and a yellow draft pick for this one...

If Collingwood bid one of their Red picks on Heeney, then Sydney could just give another prime colour draft pick.

Are you getting it yet??

Discounts would also be given if you drafted a player with the name of Green, Red, Yellow, Blue or Orange....

I think this is a much fairer draft model. It takes a 'number' away from the drafted player... These numbers promote expectations on players which leads to unnecessary stress on the before mentioned drafted players.

You're welcome.

(when does the season start??)

 

[Ironmonger]

Discounts would also be given if you drafted a player with the name of Green, Red, Yellow, Blue or Orange....

Would it be sufficient if a player's name rhymed with Orange?

 

[Skoob]

If Collingwood bid one of their Red picks on Heeney, then Sydney could just give another prime colour draft pick.

Are you getting it yet??

Discounts would also be given if you drafted a player with the name of Green, Red, Yellow, Blue or Orange....

I think this is a much fairer draft model. It takes a 'number' away from the drafted player... These numbers promote expectations on players which leads to unnecessary stress on the before mentioned drafted players.

You're welcome.

(when does the season start??)

Don't Sydney only have pre-selected black balls?

Would it be sufficient if a player's name rhymed with Orange?

That's worked in the past, but Port had to use both their 2 orange (to make red) and one of their traded in blacks from sydney, to get Ryder, and thus missed out on;

 

[Crimso]

Don't Sydney only have pre-selected black balls?


That's worked in the past, but Port had to use both their 2 orange (to make red) and one of their traded in blacks from sydney, to get Ryder, and thus missed out on;
View attachment 110909

Sorry Scoob, you can't make red, it's a prime colour. But if we were to get another black we'd have to give up nothing as black is a total lack of colour! Keep,away from the Whites though!

 

[Skoob]

Sorry Scoob, you can't make red, it's a prime colour. But if we were to get another black we'd have to give up nothing as black is a total lack of colour! Keep,away from the Whites though!

 

[Chasing the Dream]

Sorry Scoob, you can't make red, it's a prime colour. But if we were to get another black we'd have to give up nothing as black is a total lack of colour! Keep,away from the Whites though!

You get it Skoob

Well played.

Your prize is to it next to Gil on draft night and explain it to him.

 

[Gibbo_88]

Really hope there is something higher than the 20-30% discount for academy players so we don't miss out on top end talent as well as able to keep our own. One idea I think would make sense (but of course the AFL wouldn't do it) would be having the percentage of discount related to where you finish on the ladder such as 1st = the minimum discount 20% and last = 40%. That way if you finish on top of the ladder you might only get the 20% for the player such as Sydney getting Heeney, which I think is fair whereas we are desperate for top talent atm.

 

[jonnobackpocket]

Really hope there is something higher than the 20-30% discount for academy players so we don't miss out on top end talent as well as able to keep our own. One idea I think would make sense (but of course the AFL wouldn't do it) would be having the percentage of discount related to where you finish on the ladder such as 1st = the minimum discount 20% and last = 40%. That way if you finish on top of the ladder you might only get the 20% for the player such as Sydney getting Heeney, which I think is fair whereas we are desperate for top talent atm.

Like it but the but in the brackets is spot on and the afl would have to run it past fat head ed who would whinge his way to whatever suits scummingwood.

 

[jjami15]

Really hope there is something higher than the 20-30% discount for academy players so we don't miss out on top end talent as well as able to keep our own. One idea I think would make sense (but of course the AFL wouldn't do it) would be having the percentage of discount related to where you finish on the ladder such as 1st = the minimum discount 20% and last = 40%. That way if you finish on top of the ladder you might only get the 20% for the player such as Sydney getting Heeney, which I think is fair whereas we are desperate for top talent atm.

That it actually makes a lot of sense and thats the problem.

 

[KissKiss]

Really hope there is something higher than the 20-30% discount for academy players so we don't miss out on top end talent as well as able to keep our own. One idea I think would make sense (but of course the AFL wouldn't do it) would be having the percentage of discount related to where you finish on the ladder such as 1st = the minimum discount 20% and last = 40%. That way if you finish on top of the ladder you might only get the 20% for the player such as Sydney getting Heeney, which I think is fair whereas we are desperate for top talent atm.

Actually its a really really good idea that even Eddie could get behind. Stops top teams getting too much of an advantage but helps the strugglers.

 

[Sanchez365]

One of the better ideas I've heard for sure. But does have an implication for encouraging tanking.

Maybe a range based of ladder position eg 18-14 = 40%, 13 - 9 = 35% 8 - 5 = 30%, 4 - 1 = 25% could work.

 

[winged1]

One of the better ideas I've heard for sure. But does have an implication for encouraging tanking.

Maybe a range based of ladder position eg 18-14 = 40%, 13 - 9 = 35% 8 - 5 = 30%, 4 - 1 = 25% could work.

the whole draft system encourages tanking.

 

[Balony_pony16]

the whole uproar is all about a top team like the swans getting top talent on the cheap due to father son bidding... Any change should be for top 8 teams. Lions should be asking for a compo pick that hasnt been seen outside of Vic... compo = leave of acdemey kids alone

 

[Gibbo_88]

Latest from Quayle and Wilson

With the AFL virtually settled on an identical new and live bidding system for father-son and northern academy players opening with a 20 per cent points discount on top picks, it is understood the competition will move to introduce in 2016 the controversial trading of future draft picks with an expected two-year limit.

Perhaps they are looking at a bigger discount for those down the bottom end of the ladder or players taken in the first round only have the 20% discount. It's not unreasonable to think that every year, each academy will have at least one player in either the first or second round and then a few 3rd round - project type players. That would be much closer to fair if there are either bigger discounts for finishing lower on the ladder or for players not ranked in the 1st/2nd round.

 

[dlanod]

Latest from Quayle and Wilson



Perhaps they are looking at a bigger discount for those down the bottom end of the ladder or players taken in the first round only have the 20% discount. It's not unreasonable to think that every year, each academy will have at least one player in either the first or second round and then a few 3rd round - project type players. That would be much closer to fair if there are either bigger discounts for finishing lower on the ladder or for players not ranked in the 1st/2nd round.

That's how I read it too. The proof will be in the pudding, but it sounds like a compromise from our "everyone 3rd round and later for free please". Probably also shows a better negotiating nous that previously exhibited by our club - start with a huge ambit claim and wind it back to "compromise".

 

[Eons]

I put a post in the other Academy thread, perhaps I should've put it here..

Hammo has done a very good article on the Academies in the northern states....also gave it to Eddie too. Was on the HUN website today.

..as you all know, I'm a dumb bum for doing links, soooooo...

Right click on the link, if you're on bigfooty it will say www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads etc at the top of whatever browser you are using. If it's the AFL site it will say, www.afl.com.au etc. That's the link you want to right click on then choose copy in the box that comes up.

Copy the link then paste it, simples. To paste it you just right click again in the message box and choose paste.

 

[Gibbo_88]

That's how I read it too. The proof will be in the pudding, but it sounds like a compromise from our "everyone 3rd round and later for free please". Probably also shows a better negotiating nous that previously exhibited by our club - start with a huge ambit claim and wind it back to "compromise".

I hope the percentage of discount based on ladder position was brought up by one of the 4 clubs. Perhaps something that The Lions Roar could suggest seeing as they have contacts and followers? We're the only example at the moment that shows that top draft picks don't actually help us climb back up the ladder when there is the go home factor. The silence on the topic from the 4 clubs suggests that things may be closer to their favour than Eddie's.

 

[Panthera]

Point based player ranking is such a flawed system as there are waaaaay too many variables, especially with Academy kids who don't have the same access to quality coaching and opposition in their junior days

Same goes for F/S as they may not put in as much effort as other kids as they know their father's club will be picking them up 99% of the time if they even show the slightest hint of football ability.

And imagine if 3000 points are slapped on a player by a panel who don't have the same views as club recruiters; what happens then? Ie. Jack Watts scenario...

There's a reason why no other draft in the world has this (none that I can think of) - b/c it's basically throwing a dart over your left shoulder and hoping it lands on the bullseye