Rate the best Geelong players you have seen

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Cattery

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Nah people have just forgotten how good he was pre broken leg. Watched a few games from the early nineties recently and he was unstoppable. Never seen big forwards since side step players the way he could. Some Neutral commentators back then were claiming he was in the top couple of players in the comp so it ain't just biased me.

Saw plenty of big Baz and I certainly haven't forgotten how good he was, he was very bloody good, so I'm not trying to downplay his achievements, but was never our best player and a fair way behind the likes of Kenahan, Brereton and of course Carey, and that's just CHF's at the time, plenty of other players ahead of him as well.
 
Sep 15, 2007
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he was Geelong's best player in 1990 and was very close to our best the following year too.
All Australian in 1992, his career was improving with each passing season until he broke his leg early in 1994.
The last third of the 93 season he was also crazy super good. The reason for our massive form turn around at the end of that year was Stoneham
 
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Saw plenty of big Baz and I certainly haven't forgotten how good he was, he was very bloody good, so I'm not trying to downplay his achievements, but was never our best player and a fair way behind the likes of Kenahan, Brereton and of course Carey, and that's just CHF's at the time, plenty of other players ahead of him as well.
I disagee massivly on kernahan. Very overrated player who Stoneham beat convincingly a couple of times. Carey and Brereton were better but they were the best two of the past thirty years. Stoneham wasn't just a centre half forward either. A very good second string ruck and a great defender.
 

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Cattery

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Don't have to sell me on Stoneham, as I already said, a very good player, but "close to the best player in the competition" afraid that's pushing it a tad far.

And Kernahan overrated, you may want to check out his career again, had Baz covered in all aspects, disposals, marks and goals, only twice in his career did he kick less then fifty in a season, something Stoneham never achieved once.
 

Goggin Our Best

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I disagee massivly on kernahan. Very overrated player who Stoneham beat convincingly a couple of times. Carey and Brereton were better but they were the best two of the past thirty years. Stoneham wasn't just a centre half forward either. A very good second string ruck and a great defender.

You have said that a couple of times - ive scrathed my head - and i cant recall Stoneham playing on Kernahan even once

Handley and Ben Graham yes i can remember them playing on him but not Stoneham

Stoneham was a good player but i think hes being a little overrated by a few posters- i think Kernahan was the superior player ( what about that state game he played for SA against Vic - what did he kick 9 goals or something)

The other thing thing with Stoneham- we all know his broken leg buggered his career - but there was another patch of about 15-20 games ( might have covered part of a couple of seasons) where he was badly out of form
I can remember Jack Dyer calling a Geelong game - and in his summation - regarding Stoneham who had played a good game -he said welcome back ( from the wilderness) thats how poorly Stoneham had been playing for a decent patch of games
 
Nov 12, 2002
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The last third of the 93 season he was also crazy super good. The reason for our massive form turn around at the end of that year was Stoneham

He was a big factor. He kicked 17 goals in the last 4 games after returning from suspension (after stupidly kneeing a Dogs player in Round 14). But up until that point, he had kicked 8 goals for the season.

He was good, and at times very good, but that's it.
 
Mar 27, 2006
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I'm not sure how old these posters are that are placing Stoneham with or even ahead of Kernahan? It's laughable. Kernahan was an absolute champion of the game - as Goggin Our Best has said, he dominated state games for SA against Vic, even prior to moving over to Victoria. His record statistically is far better as well - even if you take cut the comparison off at the same age that Stoneham sustained his serious injury.

Not withstanding all that if you were a regular observer of footy back in the mid-late 80's/early 90's then you wouldn't even try to compare the two. Even as a diehard Cats fan I'm not partial enough to recognise who is clearly the better player. That's also not in anyway to denigrate from Stoneham - he was a fine player - just not in the same league as Kernahan.
 

ATSAM

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Kernahan may have had all of those selections but it is worth asking who made them. Back in the 90s the football world was dominated by the old boys who played for Melbourne teams, who lived and socialised in Melbourne. A bit like many of todays commentators. Back then Geelong didn't feature even though e were winning on the field-just a country club. So Geelong players weren't talked about in the same hushed tones as the cheating Carlton players-remember the salary cap breach and the cheated premiership in 1995?
 
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He was a big factor. He kicked 17 goals in the last 4 games after returning from suspension (after stupidly kneeing a Dogs player in Round 14). But up until that point, he had kicked 8 goals for the season.

He was good, and at times very good, but that's it.
It comes down a bit to how you rate consistency vs How good a player is when at his best when evaluating players. I tend to rate the latter compared to the former more than others do. Stoneham was not as consistent as others but when he was on his game he was up there with the absolute best. Wasn't a high goal kicker though as he played more up the ground then other forwards, probably because we had brownless and Ablett and sometimes others as deep forward marking options.
 

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It comes down a bit to how you rate consistency vs How good a player is when at his best when evaluating players. I tend to rate the latter compared to the former more than others do. Stoneham was not as consistent as others but when he was on his game he was up there with the absolute best. Wasn't a high goal kicker though as he played more up the ground then other forwards, probably because we had brownless and Ablett and sometimes others as deep forward marking options.

I would agree, and for consistency, I think Stoneham got more out of himself than Brownless did. Even though Brownless had miles more talent.
 

Cattery

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It comes down a bit to how you rate consistency vs How good a player is when at his best when evaluating players. I tend to rate the latter compared to the former more than others do. Stoneham was not as consistent as others but when he was on his game he was up there with the absolute best. Wasn't a high goal kicker though as he played more up the ground then other forwards, probably because we had brownless and Ablett and sometimes others as deep forward marking options.

No doubt that when he was "on" he was outstanding and capable of playing footy that matched the best, but that's a strange way of evaluating a player, surely you have to take their entire career into account, and on that basis Baz was a fair way short of the very best going around at the time.
 
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It's not that clear cut. There are also two little Most Valuable Player awards, voted by the AFLPA (Players' award), and the ALFCA (Coaches' award).

Guess who won both in 2007? Hint: It wasn't Bartel.

The 2007 Brownlow was never going to be Ablett's. I'd tipped Jimmy to win it by a decent margin.

Coaches and player association awards were probably influenced by the media frenzy around Gaz and also the freakiness of the things Gaz was doing. The spotlight was on Gaz a lot of that session because the son of Ablett Snr was making waves. I'm not surprised that a less flashy player like Bartel got less attention, but Bartel clearly deserved the Brownlow over Gaz, and rightfully won it with a huge number of votes even though he missed multiple games.
 
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Stoneham was regularly used as Mr. Fixit and ruck, CHB,CHF were shared as his spots. The finals v Dogs were exceptional.
He was not Carey as CHF but Carey was never asked to ruck or defend either.
We overused Stoneham

Carey played some more than handy CHB later in his career at North. I seem to remember our first game at Docklands (the Bizzell 85 metre torp game), where Carey had about 30 possies and was close to BOG playing CHB.

Stoneham was also BOG in the 89 semi v Melbourne as far as his finals performances go. I don't recall him playing a whole lot of CHF before his injury anyway, we rarely needed him there.
 
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Carey played some more than handy CHB later in his career at North. I seem to remember our first game at Docklands (the Bizzell 85 metre torp game), where Carey had about 30 possies and was close to BOG playing CHB.

Stoneham was also BOG in the 89 semi v Melbourne as far as his finals performances go. I don't recall him playing a whole lot of CHF before his injury anyway, we rarely needed him there.

Stoneham played well in that semi-final, but I have to politely disagree. We had a guy gather 24 touches, take 14 marks, and kick 7 goals 7 from the half forward flank. He was BOG by a country mile ahead of everyone else*. Shane Hamilton also played one of the great finals games by an unheralded player too (29 disposals, 15 marks, 2 goals 2).

Stoneham to my memory played all his footy at centre half forward until around 1990-1991. Yes he did move around more when we had injuries and so on. But I immediately think of him as a centre half forward. Not a defender and not a ruckman.

(* - the scary part was his next two finals were even better.)
 
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I would agree, and for consistency, I think Stoneham got more out of himself than Brownless did. Even though Brownless had miles more talent.
Brownless maybe in the air but once the ground hit the deck not a chance. Browless was my favourite player from that era but was useless if he didn't take a mark. Stoneham could grab a ball in the wet turn 180, side step a defender and hit a forward lace out. I can't think of another key forward his size since who has ever been able to do that. Even Carey (who is probably the greatest key position player of all time) couldn't move like Stoneham did at his peak.
 
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The 2007 Brownlow was never going to be Ablett's. I'd tipped Jimmy to win it by a decent margin.

Coaches and player association awards were probably influenced by the media frenzy around Gaz and also the freakiness of the things Gaz was doing. The spotlight was on Gaz a lot of that session because the son of Ablett Snr was making waves. I'm not surprised that a less flashy player like Bartel got less attention, but Bartel clearly deserved the Brownlow over Gaz, and rightfully won it with a huge number of votes even though he missed multiple games.
Lol abletts season was clearly better than Bartels. The Brownlow is not a very good evaluator of the best. They both racked up similar stats in games, except Ablett did it with a tagger on his arm and his stats were far more influential. If Bartel got the tagger instead this wouldn't even be a topic of discussion.
 
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It's not even close.

It's amusing to see how desperately we overrate our players.
Yep. Smedts, m brown , Horlin Smith. players many of us massively overrate :).

Kernahan was his clubs prime full forward. He kicked solid totals each year for a full forward and was very consistent at doing it but never ever had a big season like good footballers of his era such as John Longmire, Beasely, Scott Cummings and Brian Taylor did, let alone have numerous big seasons like champions of his era such as Dunstall, Modra, Lockett and Ablett. He did have a couple of big state games early in his career which greatly enhanced his reputation that he never truly lived up to. Consistently good but never great. That is the true Kernahan legacy.
 
Sep 15, 2005
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Yep. Smedts, m brown , Horlin Smith. players many of us massively overrate :).

Kernahan was his clubs prime full forward. He kicked solid totals each year for a full forward and was very consistent at doing it but never ever had a big season like good footballers of his era such as John Longmire, Beasely, Scott Cummings and Brian Taylor did, let alone have numerous big seasons like champions of his era such as Dunstall, Modra, Lockett and Ablett. He did have a couple of big state games early in his career which greatly enhanced his reputation that he never truly lived up to. Consistently good but never great. That is the true Kernahan legacy.

Sure; that, plus the VFL/AFL record for the most games captained, his club's all-time leading goalkicker, 3 B&F's and 2 flags ...

Also: Scott Cummings??
 

Cattery

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Kernahan was his clubs prime full forward. He kicked solid totals each year for a full forward and was very consistent at doing it but never ever had a big season like good footballers of his era such as John Longmire, Beasely, Scott Cummings and Brian Taylor did, let alone have numerous big seasons like champions of his era such as Dunstall, Modra, Lockett and Ablett. He did have a couple of big state games early in his career which greatly enhanced his reputation that he never truly lived up to. Consistently good but never great. That is the true Kernahan legacy.

Played mainly CHF, occasionally FF and also in the ruck. To list all his achievements would take far to long, suffice to say it doesn't suffer in comparison with Carey and Brereton.
 
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