Traded Ryan Griffen + Pick 6 traded for Tom Boyd

[Determinant]

I know for a fact we were paying the bare minimum 95% of the cap in 2014.
I know for a fact that Higgins was being paid a lot, hence the fact he was a restricted free agent, not unrestricted.
I can make the very safe and educated guess that Griffen and Cooney were among our highest paid players. Griffen reportedly was on 700k a year with us.
Obviously I can never be certain but these are as safe guesses as you can get without having those direct access to TPP info.

Yeah, but that's just the dogs, your claim was preposterously "we're the first team to do innovative, list-management things like that."
So you weren't just saying the dogs were using the new rules, you also claimed them as some kind of lamp lighter and that they were in front of the other 17 clubs in this, this feels at least as likely to be wrong as right..

 

[Determinant]

I wasn't doubting those facts, just that you can't claim that the Dogs are "the first team to do innovative, list-management things like that" when you have no idea about what other teams are doing (or even about the exact details of the Dogs).

Nothing you have described in any of your posts seems particularly innovative. Front loading, prepaying and spreading TPP is pretty basic stuff and offering a player a massive contract isn't exactly ground breaking while having to move players on to help pay for that massive contract isn't a new concept. Using the new salary cap rules for their intended purpose isn't exactly innovation either.

I commend the Doggies for getting Boyd and making the bold decisions they have made to get him, but nothing I have seen indicates that they have innovated the way lists are managed.

lol, clearly I type too slowly.. what he said

 

[Furn2]

If the Dogs paid 95 percent both in 2012 & 2013 they can effectively get an extra 10 percent in their salary cap in 2015 if they wish to with this new rule.

Yeah so they may as well spend it on Boyd got nothong to lose really

 

[TheJackal]

pick 6 actually, yes, we have done very well out of it, but in a season when the General is broken down with injury again, it does hurt us to not have Boyd, and the trade aside, it would have been very nice to keep the triumvirate together for 10 years

Hyperthetical question, if you had known Boyd would walk in 12 months, would you have done anything differently in the previous draft?

Losing Boyd and the General is a bit of a blow next year, but it just means you can play the likes of Tomlinson, Stewart or McCarthy in their actual position - one of them could just shine for you!

I figured GWS were going to always lose one of the big three, so I reckon to get Griffen and 6 (potentially someone like Lever) is a win assuming the other two stay long term.

As for the Doggies, it's a massive risk reward pick up, and one which has sold hope for the future. I will say it has put them back a touch (or at least halted the march up the ladder), you can't lose Griffen, Cooney and Higgins and not be affected short term - take it from a St Kilda supporter who has waved BJ and Dal goodbye. Having said that, it's a scary thought to think Bonts, Macrae, Libba and co would be putting it on the chest of Boyd for the next ten years. As exciting as the fantasy is, I am withholding my judgment as to whether it will be too big of a price to pay for him.

 

[Gigantor]

Hyperthetical question, if you had known Boyd would walk in 12 months, would you have done anything differently in the previous draft?

Losing Boyd and the General is a bit of a blow next year, but it just means you can play the likes of Tomlinson, Stewart or McCarthy in their actual position - one of them could just shine for you!

I figured GWS were going to always lose one of the big three, so I reckon to get Griffen and 6 (potentially someone like Lever) is a win assuming the other two stay long term.

As for the Doggies, it's a massive risk reward pick up, and one which has sold hope for the future. I will say it has put them back a touch (or at least halted the march up the ladder), you can't lose Griffen, Cooney and Higgins and not be affected short term - take it from a St Kilda supporter who has waved BJ and Dal goodbye. Having said that, it's a scary thought to think Bonts, Macrae, Libba and co would be putting it on the chest of Boyd for the next ten years. As exciting as the fantasy is, I am withholding my judgment as to whether it will be too big of a price to pay for him.

fair enough question, I agree that losing one of the tall three was always a possibility, hopefully it's only the one, you have to go with picking the very best when there is a stand out, I don't think anyone ever foregoes a standout pick at no. 1 because they might lose them (although there have been a few oddities over the years like Nathan buckley and James Cook)

 

[threenewpadlocks]

I wasn't doubting those facts, just that you can't claim that the Dogs are "the first team to do innovative, list-management things like that" when you have no idea about what other teams are doing (or even about the exact details of the Dogs).

Nothing you have described in any of your posts seems particularly innovative. Front loading, prepaying and spreading TPP is pretty basic stuff and offering a player a massive contract isn't exactly ground breaking while having to move players on to help pay for that massive contract isn't a new concept. Using the new salary cap rules for their intended purpose isn't exactly innovation either.

I commend the Doggies for getting Boyd and making the bold decisions they have made to get him, but nothing I have seen indicates that they have innovated the way lists are managed.

I can't remember the last time that three of the top 6 or 7 highest earners at a club left to make salary cap room in the long term for last year's number 1 pick - that is innovative as it has never happened before.

 

[yaco55]

Wow - show me a 19 year old kid that when offered $7 million over 7 years would turn around and say no thanks - pay me less because I don't want my character questioned.

Dogs have rolled the dice but could be a huge winner.

Boyd and more importantly his manager should have more scruples than to accept the deal. Every elite player has been offered more dollars to move clubs ( and they are being offered money commensurate with their standing in the game ) and nearly all reject the money. There is your message.

 

[yaco55]

There you go. According to "BF traditionals." Don't put words into my mouth. They had to look after themselves and I don't begrudge them that. I was disappointed in Callan Ward's last few efforts in our jumper while he was under contract, though.

I don't think Boyd's character should be questioned, by any means. He was coming home either this year or next, irrespective of the money on offer. His manager indicated he'd have fulfilled his contract had the trade not gone through, but an opportunity arose to satisfy both clubs and it was taken.

If you want to cast aspersions on anyone's character, I'd suggest you go after a former club captain who defected without any notice and proceeded to turn his phone off while they scrambled to negotiate a fair trade.

The club captain who is playing for less money at a new club - The Club Captain a proven elite player who is getting half the salary of a 19 year old player.

Yeah - lets question the character of Griffen.

And while we are talking about character lets look at the role of Boyd's family who would have been heavily involved in the dicussions.

There is no rule in the world that says Boyd had to accept that contract - Many elite players in the AFL have said no.

We could say they have character ?

 

[TheHoneyBadger]

The club captain who is playing for less money at a new club - The Club Captain a proven elite player who is getting half the salary of a 19 year old player.

Yeah - lets question the character of Griffen.

And while we are talking about character lets look at the role of Boyd's family who would have been heavily involved in the dicussions.

There is no rule in the world that says Boyd had to accept that contract - Many elite players in the AFL have said no.

We could say they have character ?

First of all, Griffen's not playing for significantly less at his new club. He's playing for similar money, if not more, but we're paying a percentage of it.

Of course there's no rule that says Boyd has to accept the money. But why should his character be called into question? The decision to leave GWS had nothing to do with money - the decision to come to the Bulldogs, on the other hand, had almost everything to do with it.

He was leaving the Giants either this year or next irrespective of the money on offer - he wanted to come home. An opportunity arose to return to Melbourne, and it just so happened that it was the Bulldogs that had opened the chequebook and that had the currency to trade for him. The Bulldogs and the Giants were willing to facilitate a trade and that's what eventuated.

Of course you could say those elite players have character - they've accepted less than their market value because they love their club. While you're on your anti-Boyd, pro-Griffen high horse, why don't we point out that Griffen could have fallen into a similar category if not for the events of the last few weeks?

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

Whatever happens either way it'll be intriguing to watch.
They've really laid them on the line the dogs.
Could be the start of something great or be an absolute all time stinker.

 

[Wild Bill]

Boyd and more importantly his manager should have more scruples than to accept the deal. Every elite player has been offered more dollars to move clubs ( and they are being offered money commensurate with their standing in the game ) and nearly all reject the money. There is your message.

Are you joking? If you can get that they would have been insane to turn it down. Same with Scully. The risk did not pay off for GWS and may not for the dogs. But if he is a gun then will be worth every cent.

 

[fronkalicious]

Griffen is on significantly more at the Giants than at the dogs. Bank that. Don't discount that in all of this.

On boyd's salary, the way it's structured, I'd comfortably say he'll be the highest paid player in the league in 2016. Then drop back to a realistic wage for a 22 year old, blue chip key forward.

 

[Periphery]

I can't remember the last time that three of the top 6 or 7 highest earners at a club left to make salary cap room in the long term for last year's number 1 pick - that is innovative as it has never happened before.

Not really. It's just the Dogs taking an opportunity that was presented to them and doing everything they can to make it happen. Nothing they did is a new idea.

 

[maddog37]

The club captain who is playing for less money at a new club - The Club Captain a proven elite player who is getting half the salary of a 19 year old player.

Yeah - lets question the character of Griffen.

And while we are talking about character lets look at the role of Boyd's family who would have been heavily involved in the dicussions.

There is no rule in the world that says Boyd had to accept that contract - Many elite players in the AFL have said no.

We could say they have character ?

Two words. Brendan Goddard.

 

[100action]

What is this Griffen getting paid less garbage coming from, he is getting paid $1m per year over 4 years. We are footing 220k of that next year.

 

[I am Jack]

Boyd is on a stack, but the Bulldogs desperately needed to land a forward.
They've needed a forward for over a decade now.

 

[markm106]

What is this Griffen getting paid less garbage coming from, he is getting paid $1m per year over 4 years. We are footing 220k of that next year.

Source? It's been everywhere about Boyds contract but haven't heard anything above Griffins. Apart from being 4 years and dogs paying half.

 

[captainMyCaptain]

This was reported at the time

Griffen is so determined to leave the Dogs he will take a considerable pay cut to join Greater Western Sydney. Griffen rocked the football world yesterday by declaring he wanted out of the Western Bulldogs given his untenable relationship with coach Brendan McCartney.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...de-to-gws-giants/story-fni5fazt-1227085135163

 

[yaco55]

First of all, Griffen's not playing for significantly less at his new club. He's playing for similar money, if not more, but we're paying a percentage of it.

Of course there's no rule that says Boyd has to accept the money. But why should his character be called into question? The decision to leave GWS had nothing to do with money - the decision to come to the Bulldogs, on the other hand, had almost everything to do with it.

He was leaving the Giants either this year or next irrespective of the money on offer - he wanted to come home. An opportunity arose to return to Melbourne, and it just so happened that it was the Bulldogs that had opened the chequebook and that had the currency to trade for him. The Bulldogs and the Giants were willing to facilitate a trade and that's what eventuated.

Of course you could say those elite players have character - they've accepted less than their market value because they love their club. While you're on your anti-Boyd, pro-Griffen high horse, why don't we point out that Griffen could have fallen into a similar category if not for the events of the last few weeks?

Proven players, not wannabe players reject big money offers every day of the week - It comes down to the character of Boyd and his family - So much for family values of hard work leading to rewards.

 

[yaco55]

Are you joking? If you can get that they would have been insane to turn it down. Same with Scully. The risk did not pay off for GWS and may not for the dogs. But if he is a gun then will be worth every cent.

proven players turn down big money offers every day of the week - there must be lots of insane players in the AFL.

 

[yaco55]

Two words. Brendan Goddard.

Brendan Goddard has nothing to do with the argument - He's not a first year player who is learning the game - And I doubt he is getting 1m a year.

 

[fronkalicious]

Proven players, not wannabe players reject big money offers every day of the week - It comes down to the character of Boyd and his family - So much for family values of hard work leading to rewards.

So taking a life changing payday wreaks of low character and a lack of values??? Grow up mate. Seriously.

 

[Colonial]

What is this Griffen getting paid less garbage coming from, he is getting paid $1m per year over 4 years. We are footing 220k of that next year.

Umm he is actually getting 1 mill from the bulldogs for those 4 years. Part of thd trade arrangement
i had heard what he gets from us on top of that is less. By all reports

 

[Super Hans]

Proven players, not wannabe players reject big money offers every day of the week - It comes down to the character of Boyd and his family - So much for family values of hard work leading to rewards.

Haha, Boyd must be the next Hitler for taking a big money offer. Seriously.

 

[Wild Bill]

proven players turn down big money offers every day of the week - there must be lots of insane players in the AFL.

He saw a chance to get out and took it while setting himself up.

They knock back big offers if they are happy we're they are. He wanted back to vic and got there. Well done to the kid.