So how bad are Melbourne?

[Demonheart]

"clearly' is an overstatement.
Waite could well be in the top 10 most over paid, over-rated, under performed, dumbest, worst bloke, crappest joke in VFL/AFL history.
His dad must have been a genuinely great player because his son has dined out on his dads reputation for 14 years. JOKE.

And he always plays well against us, it's usually his best game of the year. I wanted to send Mick a thank you card when I heard the news.

 

[Lord Nicholson]

The best, most sustainable performance I've seen from the Dees since... grumble grumble, the game against us in 2011. Simply because it was built on basics. If they can do that all year they might win 4 or 5 more games, which would be as good a start as any and the start of vindication for the Roos appointment.

I don't know if it was the best endeavour that Melbourne have applied in three years, but it's certainly the smartest they've played for years.

 

[Lach72]

Chris Dawes helped a lot

 

[Sprout]

Chris Dawes helped a lot

He was a very welcome return, that's for sure. For an 8 possession game his impact was huge.

Meanwhile Chip may now become a free agent as a forward.

 

[TradeDraft]

There better then Carlton

 

[Bluelegs]

He was a very welcome return, that's for sure. For an 8 possession game his impact was huge.

Meanwhile Chip may now become a free agent as a forward.

That tap to Bail.

 

[Shatterpoint]

Wizard

Thank you, thank you very much.

 

[Scotland]

It's bizarre that we have a thread about how bad a particular team is yet there are 8 or 9 ex players from said team currently running around successfully for other sides. How many of the following players should Melbourne have retained? Would the pick of these guys be enough to lift Melbourne above spoon favouritism?

Ricky Petterd - delisted, semi-regular fixture at Richmond
Jared Rivers - FA, regular in Geelong's 22
Kyle Cheney - traded for a late pick, depth player establishing himself at Hawthorn
Tom Scully - yeah, that guy
Jordan Gysberts - traded to the Roos, delisted after one year there
Cale Morton - delisted, played 2 or 3 games for WC then was delisted there also
James Sellar - delisted, no interest from elswhere
James Magner - delisted, no interest from elswhere
Brock McLean - traded for pick 11 which became Gysberts, started slowly at Carlton but was great in 2013
Stefan Martin - statistically as good as Naitanui )), traded to Brisbane, currently injured
Brent Moloney - FA, regular in Brisbane's 22
Colin Sylvia - FA, yet to get a debut with Freo
Matthew Warnock - traded, semi-regular fixture at GC

Some pretty obvious list cloggers and Scully leaving was a blessing in disguise given the ridiculous compo compared to his actual output with GWS, but there's a few in the grey area.

 

[Cudi_420]

Big test will be this week, for both the Dees and Suns. I expect the Suns to get up (you'd expect them to), but Dees can't afford a 70-point flogging like what happened the last time these two met at the 'G.

It's bizarre that we have a thread about how bad a particular team is yet there are 8 or 9 ex players from said team currently running around successfully for other sides. How many of the following players should Melbourne have retained? Would the pick of these guys be enough to lift Melbourne above spoon favouritism?

Ricky Petterd - delisted, semi-regular fixture at Richmond
Jared Rivers - FA, regular in Geelong's 22
Kyle Cheney - traded for a late pick, depth player establishing himself at Hawthorn
Tom Scully - yeah, that guy
Jordan Gysberts - traded to the Roos, delisted after one year there
Cale Morton - delisted, played 2 or 3 games for WC then was delisted there also
James Sellar - delisted, no interest from elswhere
James Magner - delisted, no interest from elswhere
Brock McLean - traded for pick 11 which became Gysberts, started slowly at Carlton but was great in 2013
Stefan Martin - statistically as good as Naitanui )), traded to Brisbane, currently injured
Brent Moloney - FA, regular in Brisbane's 22
Colin Sylvia - FA, yet to get a debut with Freo
Matthew Warnock - traded, semi-regular fixture at GC

Some pretty obvious list cloggers and Scully leaving was a blessing in disguise given the ridiculous compo compared to his actual output with GWS, but there's a few in the grey area.

It's probably the same at most other clubs. Also, guys like Rivers, Warnock, Moloney, Sylvia were all around at the club's lowest point, are all experienced, and ultimately needed to be moved on. Harsh reality.

The players that left that really hurt the club were the likes of Bruce, Green, McDonald, who were forced out at a time when the team's only "leaders" were *gag* Jack Trengove. They were experienced players who had played finals and knew what it took to play 4 quarters of sustained footy. Rivers was too in some regard but McDonald has been a fine replacement and will prove to be a good pick up.

Cheney was the kind of guy most teams would have let go, flying teams have the flexibility to bring in fringe players and when you're entering into a successful structure and culture the ante is upped and players are more inclined to perform. Another harsh reality. Poor teams struggle to get the most out of players that need the extra push. I am glad Cheney is playing good football and has found a place in the league's best side.

Petterd and Martin were both loses that I think would be beneficial for the club atm. I was astonished when they dumped Martin. Petterd as well was a big loss and severely underrated, but I believe it was an attitude problem that preceded his drafting, and also led to teams baulking at him when he was delisted. Very talented, just doesn't work hard enough. I mean, Richmond lol

 

[Trav 20]

It's bizarre that we have a thread about how bad a particular team is yet there are 8 or 9 ex players from said team currently running around successfully for other sides. How many of the following players should Melbourne have retained? Would the pick of these guys be enough to lift Melbourne above spoon favouritism?

Ricky Petterd - delisted, semi-regular fixture at Richmond
Jared Rivers - FA, regular in Geelong's 22
Kyle Cheney - traded for a late pick, depth player establishing himself at Hawthorn
Tom Scully - yeah, that guy
Jordan Gysberts - traded to the Roos, delisted after one year there
Cale Morton - delisted, played 2 or 3 games for WC then was delisted there also
James Sellar - delisted, no interest from elswhere
James Magner - delisted, no interest from elswhere
Brock McLean - traded for pick 11 which became Gysberts, started slowly at Carlton but was great in 2013
Stefan Martin - statistically as good as Naitanui )), traded to Brisbane, currently injured
Brent Moloney - FA, regular in Brisbane's 22
Colin Sylvia - FA, yet to get a debut with Freo
Matthew Warnock - traded, semi-regular fixture at GC

Some pretty obvious list cloggers and Scully leaving was a blessing in disguise given the ridiculous compo compared to his actual output with GWS, but there's a few in the grey area.

What a bizarrely stupid post. Every club has what I call "interchangeables", who typically make up the bottom 6 of a side's 22, or the depth between 22-28.

Martin is a spud.

Cheney doesn't play if Lake, Stratton, Schoenmakers are fit. He'd still be a fringe player if he was at Melbourne. He'd be behind Frawley, McDonald, Garland, Grimes, Dunn and just be toughing it out with Terlich, Clisby etc.

Morton, Sellar, Magner, Gysberts speak for themselves.

Warnock is OK, but he doesn't make us any better and he's fringe at Gold Coast. If Bock's fit he doesn't play.

We ended up with Hogan for Scully.

McLean's a plodder, who has played nearly as much for the Bullants.

The rest are free agents who've exercised their rights.

NO player delisted or traded has gone on to embarrass Melbourne.

 

[wowlace]

Rivers is the only one I wish was still red and blue.

 

[Headless]

Rivers is the only one I wish was still red and blue.

Moloney should never have been pushed out. I'd like him back, too.

 

[LeverPuller]

Jamie Bennell at WCE has done alright this year.

 

[Sprout]

Jamie Bennell at WCE has done alright this year.

"Alright" being the key word. He has talent, but on his output and inconsistency he had to be moved on. I hope he does well though. He can be good to watch.

 

[Bluelegs]

It's bizarre that we have a thread about how bad a particular team is yet there are 8 or 9 ex players from said team currently running around successfully for other sides. How many of the following players should Melbourne have retained? Would the pick of these guys be enough to lift Melbourne above spoon favouritism?

Ricky Petterd - delisted, semi-regular fixture at Richmond
Jared Rivers - FA, regular in Geelong's 22
Kyle Cheney - traded for a late pick, depth player establishing himself at Hawthorn
Tom Scully - yeah, that guy
Jordan Gysberts - traded to the Roos, delisted after one year there
Cale Morton - delisted, played 2 or 3 games for WC then was delisted there also
James Sellar - delisted, no interest from elswhere
James Magner - delisted, no interest from elswhere
Brock McLean - traded for pick 11 which became Gysberts, started slowly at Carlton but was great in 2013
Stefan Martin - statistically as good as Naitanui )), traded to Brisbane, currently injured
Brent Moloney - FA, regular in Brisbane's 22
Colin Sylvia - FA, yet to get a debut with Freo
Matthew Warnock - traded, semi-regular fixture at GC

Some pretty obvious list cloggers and Scully leaving was a blessing in disguise given the ridiculous compo compared to his actual output with GWS, but there's a few in the grey area.

How many would you want in your starting 22 based on current output?

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Moloney should never have been pushed out. I'd like him back, too.

He was a dickhead who was part of our poor/poisonous culture, had to go.

 

[LBJ6]

Just quietly, after last night i'm tipping that we'll have a real chance against Brisbane and Richmond.

 

[Demonheart]

He was a dickhead who was part of our poor/poisonous culture, had to go.

There's no surprise that their culture has gone down the toilet since he went up there

 

[Scotland]

How many would you want in your starting 22 based on current output?

Rivers, Moloney. Wouldn't hate having Scully either, save for the pricetag. My team is 3-1 and not subject of a 'how s**t are West Coast', mind.

What a bizarrely stupid post. Every club has what I call "interchangeables", who typically make up the bottom 6 of a side's 22, or the depth between 22-28.

Not really, it's not a 'LOL Melbourne got rid of all these guns and now they're s**t' post. My question is would Melbourne actually be any better had they kept any of the guys listed. Every club lets players go who succeed elsewhere. Brad Ebert would be handy, for example. Likewise every club cuts deadwood and 5 minutes later no one remembers. I maintain that letting Rivers and Moloney go was a mistake.

Your Cheneys, your Petterds, your Bennells manage to play OK elsewhere. Melbourne got rid of these guys then brought in your Byrnes, your Pedersons, your Terlichs etc. It is widely acknowledged that Melbourne's list much chop. Are the 'depth' players on Melbourne's list any better / worse than they were 1-2-3 years ago?

 

[Scotland]

Just quietly, after last night i'm tipping that we'll have a real chance against Brisbane and Richmond.

On current form I'm tipping you'll be asking the OP to replace 'Melbourne' with 'Brisbane' in the thread title before too long. They've swallowed a real s**t sandwich to start 2014.

 

[Bluelegs]

Rivers, Moloney. Wouldn't hate having Scully either, save for the pricetag. My team is 3-1 and not subject of a 'how s**t are West Coast', mind.



Not really, it's not a 'LOL Melbourne got rid of all these guns and now they're s**t' post. My question is would Melbourne actually be any better had they kept any of the guys listed. Every club lets players go who succeed elsewhere. Brad Ebert would be handy, for example. Likewise every club cuts deadwood and 5 minutes later no one remembers. I maintain that letting Rivers and Moloney go was a mistake.

Your Cheneys, your Petterds, your Bennells manage to play OK elsewhere. Melbourne got rid of these guys then brought in your Byrnes, your Pedersons, your Terlichs etc. It is widely acknowledged that Melbourne's list much chop. Are the 'depth' players on Melbourne's list any better / worse than they were 1-2-3 years ago?

So you agree most of them are fringe players at best. The two you would have in your starting 22 were pushed out during the neeld era as was petterd who was the only other one you mentioned that id still have at the dees.

 

[Trav 20]

Rivers, Moloney. Wouldn't hate having Scully either, save for the pricetag. My team is 3-1 and not subject of a 'how s**t are West Coast', mind.



Not really, it's not a 'LOL Melbourne got rid of all these guns and now they're s**t' post. My question is would Melbourne actually be any better had they kept any of the guys listed. Every club lets players go who succeed elsewhere. Brad Ebert would be handy, for example. Likewise every club cuts deadwood and 5 minutes later no one remembers. I maintain that letting Rivers and Moloney go was a mistake.

Your Cheneys, your Petterds, your Bennells manage to play OK elsewhere. Melbourne got rid of these guys then brought in your Byrnes, your Pedersons, your Terlichs etc. It is widely acknowledged that Melbourne's list much chop. Are the 'depth' players on Melbourne's list any better / worse than they were 1-2-3 years ago?

Cheney would not improve us. He's just more of what we have.

Petterd wouldn't improve us. He's fringe at Richmond and he'd be fringe with us. He's very brave and can win the footy, but he also butchers the ball beyond comprehension.

Bennell is soft and wouldn't make us better. He's fringe at West Coast and he'd be fringe with us.

Rivers and Moloney would be best 22 and make us better, but they hated Neeld. That said, our backs with Garland, Frawley, Dunn, McDonald are OK. Moloney was the sub for Brisbane last night. He's OK, but no great shakes.

WE were crap when these players were in the team.

A team's fortunes rely on their best 12-14 players and in particular their best 6. Other than Rivers and Moloney, none of them were core to our team. They're simply not big losses. And even Rivers and Moloney are just "good ordinary" footballers.

NO player has gone on to embarrass Melbourne other than Scott Thompson, who we didn't want to lose.

We do have issues, but losing crap players hasn't been one of them. Our drafting and development has been deplorable. The way young draft picks have been treated has been disgusting. We finally have mature heads running the joint and we'll see how things progress.

As usual, a big thanks to opposition supporters for having such a fascination with our club.

 

[Sprout]

My question is would Melbourne actually be any better had they kept any of the guys listed.

No.

You could argue for Rivers or Moloney but they left of their own accord thanks to Neeld, and Moloney isn't greatly missed.

You are completely barking up the wrong tree.

 

[Freomaniac]

Serious question. 7 years since finals. Haven't beaten Hawthorn, St Kilda, North or Geelong since 2006. Collingwood and Carlton since 2007. Richmond since 2012. Haven't beaten one of the existing clubs interstate since the mid-2000s. Haven't won at Etihad since 2007. Haven't won in Round 1 or 2 since 2005.

And yet, they seem to have gotten worse again. The Eagles could have comfortably drilled 200 if they kept their foot on the pedal after the first 10 minutes. Melbourne didn't get a double-digit score until midway through the third term. They can't kick a score, they still turn it over like anything and they have no confidence in each other.

It's not a troll at this point. It's a legitimate question. What the hell has to be done to make the Dees remotely competitive - as in an actual chance to win an actual game against a quality opponent?

Well its not even 10 games in so here it goes...

-Demons beat the Blues by 3-4 goals for their 1st win of the season....

-Beat the Crows at Adelaide oval last month by under a goal.

-Beat the Tigers just recently 91-74 despite Richmonds inaccuracy in front of goal.

-Could of had more than 3 wins if not for the losses against the Bulldogs and Suns too.


All in all doing much better than last season.

 

[Captain Awkward]

Could of had more than 3 wins if not for the losses against the Bulldogs and Suns too.

Sorry to be mean but this part gave me a chuckle .

On-topic: Really interested to see how they'll go against a top 4 side. At the start of the season it was looking like they would lose by 200+ to Hawthorn and would find trouble just scoring a goal against Fremantle.

Not a knock on Melbourne but I have a sneaking suspicion some teams are treating Melbourne with the same amount of respect as they would have last year. I have no doubt that West Coast were guilty of that in round 2. All I can say is I'm very glad we got Melbourne at the MCG early in the year. The return game should be interesting.