List Mgmt. 2014 Draft Trade FA Megathread

[Manimal_Dunstan]

Wow Gwilt only 30 at the start of the 2017 season? Did not realize that, thought he would've been at least a couple of years older. Definitely have him in the 2017 plans then.

Turns 31 later in 2017.

Same as Gilbo and Faz (Which i just noticed is in that post)..

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

Brilliant analysis Richter.... what I get out of all that is that we have more than just the bones of a very good side. This in itself is amazing considering where most of us considered the list was positioned in the 2012/13 pre season.

I'd probably argue that Dunstan should be considered a probable A Grade talent. Acres highly promising, numerous others looking very likely to be very good AFL players (if not A Grade)- Newnes, Saunders, Curren, etc.

Absolutely no doubt that adding a key forward is paramount. We're pretty fortunate that our rebuild is occurring now rather than in the Suns/Giants set up era. I still think we're likely to finish no higher than 5th last & give us a crack at one of the key talls.

As I posted yesterday in response to Ike... I believe the club is ahead of schedule in terms of the rebuild. Last year's trading & drafting brought in 9 young players that all have the opportunity to become long term Saints. I don't think Pelchen & Bains could have predicted this when the draft strategy letter was sent. Maybe they had ear marked someone like Joey should be traded as well....

In a draft that is considered to be reasonably strong & deep at this very early stage, you would expect that clubs will only trade picks if a deal comes along that is very strong. So I expect that we will be more conservative, select 3 or 4 'live' selections, upgrade Eli & possibly Mav & see if there are any delisted free agents that fit into the plan.

I'd be happy if the club kept Armo & Gilby.... drafted 4 new kids, upgraded a few & went into 2015 with a similar list but without a few GOP's that are unlikely to be best 22 circa 2017 (TDL, Sippo, Milera, Maister, CJ are all in the gun)

 

[L_W_P]

Going to throw up a serious left field option here - Clay Smith from the Western Bulldogs.

Turns 21 in a couple of weeks. Listed as 182cms and 83kgs. Has 30 games to his name but cant get a run this year. Not on the injury list either.

Ave 14 touches @ 66% DE, 3 marks, 4.5 tackles and a goal every other game but was used as the sub alot in his first two years but still managed to pick up 15+ touches in 9/14 games played last year. Stats compare favorably to the likes of Saunders and Curren.

Doubt he is even on the radar but he would be a sneaky one to look at.

 

[Manimal_Dunstan]

He is still returning from an ACL injury he suffered late last season.

 

[King_Steele]

Going to throw up a serious left field option here - Clay Smith from the Western Bulldogs.

Turns 21 in a couple of weeks. Listed as 182cms and 83kgs. Has 30 games to his name but cant get a run this year. Not on the injury list either.

Ave 14 touches @ 66% DE, 3 marks, 4.5 tackles and a goal every other game but was used as the sub alot in his first two years but still managed to pick up 15+ touches in 9/14 games played last year. Stats compare favorably to the likes of Saunders and Curren.

Doubt he is even on the radar but he would be a sneaky one to look at.

I don't think he will suit CP's criteria, his kicking is as good as Clint Jones.

 

[L_W_P]

Well that's that idea crushed...



His efficiency isn't really far off what Curren and Saunders produce though. We are talking 1 in 100 kicks not hitting a target.

 

[hayes]

Turns 31 later in 2017.

Same as Gilbo and Faz (Which i just noticed is in that post)..

That's alright. Most teams have some 30+'ers in them. I've re-watched the game and some of Gwilt's kicks were sublime so I'm rapt about that, sad thing is it would've taken me only a minute to figure it out for myself.

Players from richter's team that I expect to be phased out by better/younger players with better foot skills:

Geary and Ray easily replaced by Roberton and Acres.

Armitage I can see being overtaken at some stage.

Gilbert I could go either way on. Happy to keep him but also happy to trade him if we can get something good from say a GWS or GC.

After retiring Schneider off for the past couple of years I'm now hoping we can squeeze another 3 or so years out of him. Only 29 now.

Of course you always have to leave some room for the unknown but we look in pretty decent shape IMO.

 

[Manimal_Dunstan]

Jesse Lonergan and Luke Dunstan in the same midfield.... Opposition teams will be scared of two man childs.

 

[King_Steele]

Jesse Lonergan and Luke Dunstan in the same midfield.... Opposition teams will be scared of two man childs.

Would love Lonergan at the Saints! I wonder if his good mates with Jimmy Webster doubt it would happen though

 

[Smoke_Me_AKipper]

I think Lonergan is surplus as we got Dunstan. We were keen on Jesse before we traded our picks that year for Hickey and Lee plus other picks.

With Ross, Dunstan, Curren, & Armitage we have enough inside. We need more outside/pace/run mids - one or two elite mids of that nature will make our midfield eventually one of the best in the league IMO!!

 

[Richter]

Brilliant analysis Richter.... what I get out of all that is that we have more than just the bones of a very good side. This in itself is amazing considering where most of us considered the list was positioned in the 2012/13 pre season.

I'd probably argue that Dunstan should be considered a probable A Grade talent. Acres highly promising, numerous others looking very likely to be very good AFL players (if not A Grade)- Newnes, Saunders, Curren, etc.

Absolutely no doubt that adding a key forward is paramount. We're pretty fortunate that our rebuild is occurring now rather than in the Suns/Giants set up era. I still think we're likely to finish no higher than 5th last & give us a crack at one of the key talls.

As I posted yesterday in response to Ike... I believe the club is ahead of schedule in terms of the rebuild. Last year's trading & drafting brought in 9 young players that all have the opportunity to become long term Saints. I don't think Pelchen & Bains could have predicted this when the draft strategy letter was sent. Maybe they had ear marked someone like Joey should be traded as well....

In a draft that is considered to be reasonably strong & deep at this very early stage, you would expect that clubs will only trade picks if a deal comes along that is very strong. So I expect that we will be more conservative, select 3 or 4 'live' selections, upgrade Eli & possibly Mav & see if there are any delisted free agents that fit into the plan.

I'd be happy if the club kept Armo & Gilby.... drafted 4 new kids, upgraded a few & went into 2015 with a similar list but without a few GOP's that are unlikely to be best 22 circa 2017 (TDL, Sippo, Milera, Maister, CJ are all in the gun)

Thanks W2L. I agree with you re Dunstan. Just overlooked him in originally writing the post! I think the point stands with regards to not having enough 'A' graders though... when you compare with the 2009 team which had Roo, BJ, Dal, Lenny, Joey, Chips as well as Milne, Gram and Gardiner... I'm really really hoping for something from Acres... who from video vision looks like he could at best be a cross between Nat Fyfe and Scott Pendlebury.

In regards to our depth... which I agree for the stage of the rebuild is terrific... we can look back fondly to the 2012 draft when we gave up #12 and #13 for Hickey, Lee, Wright, Saunders and a couple of pick upgrades (used on Murdoch and White).

Interesting what you say about this being a deep draft. We heard rumours about last year being a good top 20 and not much beyond, which I believe strongly influenced our trading strategy, so it will certainly be interesting to say what happens this year... Also there are said to be 5 top quality Talls too.

Presumably our aim will be to secure a top 5 pick as first priority and then make sure we have 3 other top 50 picks.... so perhaps we'll look to turn picks (guesstimate) #8, #26, #44, #62 in to say #5, #40, #44, #50. Of course if we finish in the bottom 4 then we won't need to do very much at all to gain this outcome as we'd have approx. (after either Melb get a priority pick or Carlton finish below us and lose Gibbs as a free agent), #5, #23, #41, #58.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

Remember that of those A graders circa 2004, Joey & Chips were reasonably late bloomers. A few years into their careers they definitely weren't considered absolute stars.

The big difference now compared with the beginning of that era is that we dont have the experienced yet young players of the calibre of Lenny, G-Train & Hamill. Only probably Jack fits into that category & any gun free agents that we can sign won't be for at least 18 months.



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[VDS66]

Our improvement has caught everyone by surprise and I suspect the recruiters as well. But let's see how we go against the better teams this year. Results may force a strategy rethink regarding our draft picks.

Whilst climbing to mid-table might give us a warm and fuzzy feeling, if we are to rebuild I honestly hope we don't win to many games. Hate to say it, but that is the system we live in, and sadly we have to exploit it as every other team does.

The only other alternative I see happening if we continue to win games, is to keep 1st rounder and try to upgrade it. Then look at trading 2nd rounders / players for good young players who have been in the system for a few years.

Either way, we learnt last year to expect the unexpected.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

Agree VDS66... gotta cash in while the draft window is open

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[God Save Max King]

Pick 6 could still net us a good tall (Wright, Durdin, McCartin, Lever, Goddard) or one of Brayshaw/Weller/Lamb.

Failing that though we could look for a 2 for 1 type deal from someone ala West Coast with Collingwood last year?

Gold Coast have a compo pick tied to Geelong so maybe our first rounder for that compo pick (16-19 assuming Geelong finish top 4) and a player on the outer (Gorringe? Hutchins? Taylor? Help me out here Rahul )

In theory, your idea is a good one. Unfortunately I don't think we'll double down unless we're guaranteed a top 10 pick, and the Gold Coast players listed simply are not talented enough to be deemed worthy of a first round selection. Gorringe would be our 3rd best ruckman who has issues with injuries, and he's the best of the 3. Gold Coast for perhaps their 1st and compensation selection (might end up being 5 for 8 and 17) would be a better deal, but a 1st rounder is a lot to pay to move up 3 spots.

 

[Persevering Saint]

As I said in the Dare to Dream thread, the most likely scenario now is that we will win, at most, 8-10 games. That'll put us in the bottom 4 or 5, which I think is fine.

What you don't want is to finish in that 9-13 area on the ladder - that is just pointless.

 

[VDS66]

Don't forget that you probably have to allow for compo picks as well. IS the AFL still doing the FA compo bs again this year?

FWIW I reckon FA compo should start at the 2nd round. And I'll beef hooked if Melb get a compo for being... well... Melb.

 

[Persevering Saint]

Don't forget that you probably have to allow for compo picks as well. IS the AFL still doing the FA compo bs again this year?

FWIW I reckon FA compo should start at the 2nd round. And I'll beef hooked if Melb get a compo for being... well... Melb.

I know. In all seriousness,

I'm sick of seeing good young players become duds. When it's one or two, you say "Bad recruiting". When it's 20 or 30, you say "Bad club culture".

No kid deserves to be sucked into the Maelstrom of mediocrity that is Melbourne.

 

[Jezzarayman]

O'Rourke named for GWS

 

[Manimal_Dunstan]

Shiel named emergency i know he has had a injury problem but maybe the gossip on him wanting to come home is growing some legs and GWS aren't happy with it? (Doubt this, probably just want him back through the NEAFL)

 

[goodie23]

SIX clubs have sent scouts to this week's US AFL International Combine in Los Angeles as they look to gain an edge in list management.

Recruiters from Collingwood, the Sydney Swans, Richmond, Fremantle, Port Adelaide and North Melbourne will attend the three-day testing from Friday, where 20 American athletes will test under AFL conditions.

Does this mean we're not looking for a buddy/rival for Holmes or are our recruiters are too busy scouring New Zuland (or maybe looking even closer to home)?

 

[CALL ME SNAKE]

Remember that of those A graders circa 2004, Joey & Chips[/B][/COLOR] were reasonably late bloomers. A few years into their careers they definitely weren't considered absolute stars.

The big difference now compared with the beginning of that era is that we dont have the experienced yet young players of the calibre of Lenny, G-Train & Hamill. Only probably Jack fits into that category & any gun free agents that we can sign won't be for at least 18 months.



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In response to Richters good choice of a possible future Saints side
I remember back in the early 2000's I had a Saints Team poster in my shed and I had circles around the players Roo, Xman, Joey, Goose, Dal and I wrote at the bottom of the poster in texta 2004 here we come.
Boy 'o' boy I was close. We could've won it in 04. Id be bloody happy if 2017 was our yr

 

[VDS66]

Irony: Holmes master AFL kicking at VFL level then goes home to become an NFL punter and makes a squillion.

 

[St_Laz]

I think Richter's well thought out post pointed out our desperate need for a big forward.
Chances of "making it":
Lee - 70%
Stanley - 60%
White - 40%

Slim pickings.

If we finish approx. 14th we get pick 5, 23, 41.
What about trading Armo+23 for pick 8-14.
Then Gilbert for 25-30.

End up with 5, 10, 27, 41.
Upgrade Weller to cover Armo's spot. Use 5 and 10 on the best key forward available (unless we'd be reaching). Rahul, who would that be? (Durdin + Goddard?)

 

[aussierulesrules]

If we finished 14th, depending on whether Gibbs and Frawley leave their clubs or not, we might only end up with picks 6 and about 27, or 7 and about 28, after all the compo picks and so-on are handed out.