Stop the boats. 5k a head. (cont. in Part 2)

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Jul 19, 2005
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That's where the holistic approach comes in.

That's where we employ diplomats to go and get people from refugee camps directly, whether they have paperwork or not.

That's where we employ federal police to go into known people smuggler haunts and bring them to justice.

That easy huh? We just get the refugees? Without paperwork I assume we determinate refugee status by gut feel? How many do you plan on getting?

I am sure Indonesia won't mind our Federal police running around their country grabbing random people.
 
Jul 19, 2005
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359 pages and we are still talking about people smugglers, yet the Triggs reports gets half a dozen posts.
Priorities seem a bit wrong, methinks.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...f-objective-fact/story-e6frg6zo-1227224538997

Because Triggs is a biased political tool?

150 kids in detention = bad

2000 kids in detention and hundreds dead = silence

At the end of the day I am not sure what exactly people are complaining about.
They want children out of detention - children are out of detention.
They want people in general out of detention - the population in detention is falling rapidly.
They don't want people taking leaky boats and dying at sea - people aren't taking leaky boats and dying at sea.

Everything people wanted is being achieved. Not yesterday like they demand but in a reasonable time frame.

What exactly do people want? Remember this isn't a Disney movie with a predetermined happy ending.
 
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http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...f-objective-fact/story-e6frg6zo-1227224538997

Because Triggs is a biased political tool?

150 kids in detention = bad

2000 kids in detention and hundreds dead = silence

At the end of the day I am not sure what exactly people are complaining about.
They want children out of detention - children are out of detention.
They want people in general out of detention - the population in detention is falling rapidly.
They don't want people taking leaky boats and dying at sea - people aren't taking leaky boats and dying at sea.

Everything people wanted is being achieved. Not yesterday like they demand but in a reasonable time frame.

What exactly do people want? Remember this isn't a Disney movie with a predetermined happy ending.
No the children are the political tool!
Triggs got it right both political parties should hang their head in shame.
I found it amazing that this government did little to reduce the time children were held in detention until this report was given to them in October, then lo and behold, legislation was put to the Senate where the children were used as bargaining chips.
How many children were still in detention before the report was submitted?
Amazing how quick they were to reduce the number of children in detention knowing that they had to make the report public.
Try and stay with this, so over the regurgitation of - deaths at sea, people smugglers, threw away documentation, economic migrants blah,blah, blah.
 
Jul 19, 2005
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No the children are the political tool!
Triggs got it right both political parties should hang their head in shame.
I found it amazing that this government did little to reduce the time children were held in detention until this report was given to them in October, then lo and behold, legislation was put to the Senate where the children were used as bargaining chips.
How many children were still in detention before the report was submitted?
Amazing how quick they were to reduce the number of children in detention knowing that they had to make the report public.
Try and stay with this, so over the regurgitation of - deaths at sea, people smugglers, threw away documentation, economic migrants blah,blah, blah.

Amazinly enough under the Howard government they managed to empty the detention centers too.

You put the reduction of detention numbers down to the (long delayed) report. I put it down to the fact that people were being processed and we weren't being flooded by new arrivals.

If only Trigg spoke up when thousands were in detention and hundreds dying.

If we get a change in government and they propose a change back to Rudd/Gillard policy I wonder wether Trigg will speak up immediately? Or will we have another politically motivated delay?
 

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For those interested in Triggs's response re questions of timing of AHRC report, see: https://www.humanrights.gov.au/news/stories/protecting-children-commissions-aim-not-political-points

Yet when questioned by the Senate Trigg told a different story.

What the original aim was is irrelevant. How they actually acted is what we are discussing.

“The fact that an election was imminent had been announced by the prime minister in I think about March,” she said, “so we knew it was going to be very soon, and of course we didn’t know exactly when."

http://m.theaustralian.com.au/natio...ning-in-evidence/story-fn59niix-1227131308575
 

GuruJane

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For those interested in Triggs's response re questions of timing of AHRC report, see: https://www.humanrights.gov.au/news/stories/protecting-children-commissions-aim-not-political-points

Triggs came up with an entirely different story at the recent estimates. She said it was the advent of Operation Sovereign Borders that triggered the decision to make a report in December 2013 because they weren't getting the same information from DIAC that they'd got when Labor was the government.

From the earlier estimates debacle in last November she has consistently made up one spin after another attempting to explain why she took no action during the 15 months Labor was in power.

Clearly if she felt there was a problem with the children in detention after her visits to Christmas Island and Villawood in the second half of 2012 she should have flagged a report a report then. She should have been attacking the Labor immigration minister publicly and relentlessly on the issue of children in detention in 2013 up until the change of govt in September as she continually attacked Morrison after the new government took over.
 

raghav

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You don't like bigots, therefore that makes you a bigot, Mal.

Bigot.

Strange as it may seem you are technically correct, his problem is that he like many others on this board fail to correctly interpret the meaning of the word and are quick to brand people as 'bigots' when they aren't simply because they hold differing views to theirs. In doing so they also are 'bigots' within the meaning of the word.
 

raghav

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People charged with offences and/or imprisoned, shouldn't have access to lawyers or a fair hearing eh?

If this is your actual opinion, we have nothing more to talk about.

Also, I'm flattered that you have quoted me in your signature, if a little flummoxed why?

Did I say that "People charged with offences and/or imprisoned, shouldn't have access to lawyers or a fair hearing.", clearly not, so why ask if it is my actual opinion?
 
For those interested in Triggs's response re questions of timing of AHRC report, see: https://www.humanrights.gov.au/news/stories/protecting-children-commissions-aim-not-political-points
Don't have a problem with her response after reading the link you provided.
Have a bigger problem with people on are concentrating on Trigg's report and not the content.
However if there are questions to be asked (not that I really care about the answers are they are mostly going to be lies).
Why did it take the government 5 months to release the report?
Why the rush to push legislation through in December?
Why the secrecy in releasing information to Commission?
Why no detailed information on IMMI web site as this government insisted that Labor release?
Why not one member of this government has addressed the content of the report?
Sadly it is all a political game and the children are the football.
The constant referral to 2012 also annoys me, she was appointed in July 2012, what do people expect that the report should have been completed immediately?
 

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Strange as it may seem you are technically correct, his problem is that he like many others on this board fail to correctly interpret the meaning of the word and are quick to brand people as 'bigots' when they aren't simply because they hold differing views to theirs. In doing so they also are 'bigots' within the meaning of the word.

bigot
noun big·ot \ˈbi-gət\

: a person who strongly and unfairly dislikes other people, ideas, etc. : a bigoted person; especially : a person who hates or refuses to accept the members of a particular group (such as a racial or religious group)

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bigot

Nah brah. You're a bigot.
 

Xsess

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Qu - I have evidence that thousands of underage white girls are being systematically brutalised and sexually abused. The perpetrators are almost exclusively from a single, very select and easily identifiable demographic. We know this is the fact, what can we do about it?

A - YOU are a bigot and racist!

Qu - But what about the thousands of lives being ruined, the poor girls?

A - YOU are a bigot and racist!

Qu - This has nothing to do with me, I abhor violence against women and I dont want my own loved ones hurt. Can't we do something about the people we know are behind this crime?

A - Bigot! Racist! YOU! YOU!

Qu - Um ... ah never mind
 

Xsess

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Thoughts on the RC into institutional response to child abuse?

Why are you making this issue about me?

Kiddie fiddlers should we dealt with in the harshest possible way. Be it priests in a church, detention centre kids being abused by fellow asylum seekers or the Pakistani rape gangs of Oxford and Rotterdam. But call it as it is FFS.
 

raghav

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bigot
ˈbɪɡət/
noun
noun: bigot; plural noun: bigots
  1. a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.
    "don't let a few small-minded bigots destroy the good image of the city"
    synonyms: dogmatist, partisan, sectarian, prejudiced person;More
You fit into that definition very comfortably.

Time to cease trying to display your obvious lack of knowledge of the English language and get back on topic.
 
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Qu - I have evidence that thousands of underage white girls are being systematically brutalised and sexually abused. The perpetrators are almost exclusively from a single, very select and easily identifiable demographic. We know this is the fact, what can we do about it?

A - YOU are a bigot and racist!

What are you on about. When were people shouted down for this?

People were too scared to comment on the ethnicity of the perpetrators out of PC concerns, but I never actually saw anyone shout them down once they did mention ethnicity.

So whose fault is that?
 

GuruJane

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The constant referral to 2012 also annoys me, she was appointed in July 2012, what do people expect that the report should have been completed immediately?

No Maggie. The issue is this:, while the previous govt who'd put all these children into detention were in power, she had 15 months after taking the job to start a report inquiry and to publicly call out the then minister for immigration Chris Bowen for the government ignoring the "forgotton children" as she eventually did to Morrison.

Triggs should be called out herself for using the children as a political football during this period, like the Greens did.

 
No Maggie. The issue is this:, while the previous govt who'd put all these children into detention were in power, she had 15 months after taking the job to start a report inquiry and to publicly call out the then minister for immigration Chris Bowen for the government ignoring the "forgotton children" as she eventually did to Morrison.

Triggs should be called out herself for using the children as a political football during this period, like the Greens did.
You keep harping on about that, I would prefer if someone can answer the questions I raised.
It is not as if she didn't call out the previous government. Neither government can hold their head high on children in detention.
 

Xsess

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People were too scared to comment on the ethnicity of the perpetrators out of PC concerns,

Which is my point exactly. The media, senior public servants and police engaged in an effective cover-up allowing the crimes to continue for 15 years out of fear of being "outed" as one of those devastatingly aggressive PC labels. Which is why I reckon good people should ignore words like "bigot" and racist" as terms that have been deliberately invented to subvert reality and shut down free speech.
 

GuruJane

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You keep harping on about that, I would prefer if someone can answer the questions I raised.
It is not as if she didn't call out the previous government. Neither government can hold their head high on children in detention.

But she didn't call out the previous government for the whole 15 months she was president at the time they were not only in power but the number of children in detention reached 2000.

ooi please link to the posts you made here between 2009 and September 2013 expressing your continual distress at the number of children being held in detention by the Labor government - I can't remember them now.
 
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