Swans told to end COLA - OR be banned from trading in players for 2 years

[dean33]

The problem I have with attitudes like yours is that you assume that Sydney's success is because of the CoLA. That is only an assumption on your part. And it completely disregards things like coaching, recruiting, game plan, injury management, etc....

Tell me - if Richmond had the CoLA do you reckon that would have guaranteed them consistent success over the last ten or so years? With a couple of flags thrown in for good measure?

So you object to the ban in principle but because it is the Swans you'll be okay with it in this instance? Rightio then.......


The Swans are trying to forge a football club in foreign territory. And this will continue to be the case for years. Probably generations. There needs to be some sort of incentive and motivation in place for the kids to take up the game (in my view, having lived here for a long time) for quite a while yet. This is more likely to be the case if the goal is to play for the Swans - again, in my view.

No i am not disregarding everything the swans have done, they have had excellant coaching, administration and no I doubt if the tigers had the extra cap space we would have snagged 2 flags in that time. This however is besides the point, I am not against this allowance because the swans have won 1 or 2 flags while still be afforded it, I am against this allowance as it goes against the whole idea of a salary cap and gives an established team an unfair advantage. I am ok with the suns and giants having it while they establish themselves however not a club who has been in sydney for over 30 years and is well and truly established.

Regardess of how good a club sydney is run, the facts of the matter are they receive an advantage that no other established club gets. This is plain and simply wrong.

As for the NSW academy I can see the merit in this and I'm more of the watch this space on it as long as it is monitored and looked at it every few years.

 

[PNess]

I don't think anyone would suggest that $1m extra in the cap is the reason Sydney have had success, but that sort of advantage certainly gets you more success than you'd otherwise have.

When you consider the supplements scandal, how they were trying to get the most minute advantage, it certainly wouldn't have equated to a 9.8% increase in performance.

I look at Port Adelaide, Fremantle and wonder if they were given a free $1m gift voucher to pickup a superstar. Then I think that's the difference between a prelim and a GF, or a GF and a premiership.

 

[Beachsleeper]

Just listened to the Trade Week edition of the Superfooty Podcast and, in 50 minutes of otherwise decent analysis (and maybe a little too much of guest Slobbo Robbo's verbal wandering) I was staggered that the AFL's trade ban on Sydney wasn't mentioned once. Not once. Imagine this ban affecting Hawthorn or Collingwood or Essendon and then go back and tell me how long you'd think it would be discussed for. I try and avoid Victorian media conspiracy theories and other forms of whingeing about the fate of an interstate club supporter but the COMPLETE lack of media reporting about this decision stinks. It absolutely stinks. We can debate the pros and cons of COLA and whether Sydney, in your mind, "abused" it - I mean, hell, look at the 125 pages before this! - but to not mention it AT ALL, and to see so little mention of it elsewhere too, is infuriating. And so the mind turns back to the Vic/AFL conspiracy theories I'd put aside, and here comes the wounded pride that I thought I'd put aside too. Being a Sydney-born Swans fan now living in Melbourne, I'm used to seeing my team either ignored or lazily mocked, or, at best, begrudgingly admired, but to see so many hacks and one-eyed journos happy to let this slide is deeply frustrating.

I don't want to hear your impressive theory about how we were probably going after a gun player and the AFL stepped in. We don't know this, it's just random conjecture, and you're essentially using a guess to justify a remorseless and unfair ruling. The allowance was given to us then stripped back (mid-phase out plan) with extra penalty on top.

I hate bitterness and self-pity and how it poisons the hearts of football fans (the bleating about umpires, the us against them juvenile mentality) but this whole affair leaves a Swans fan so raw and wronged. That it seems to have passed with so little comment only adds to the sense of, well, betrayal, if that isn't too melodramatic a word.

 

[QuietB]

This thread is up to a whopping 125 pages, and still no-one has explained satisfactorily, why it's OK for the AFL to renege on an already-agreed process to phase out CoLA, a process which was already on foot, as they say in contracts law, and give no clear reason.

We actually do not know if the AFL reneged on anything. Maybe Sydney reneged on something which to be honest was the clear implication made when the AFL gave their direction mid trade period.

The whole problem here is we do not really know anything. And your footy club has not gone out of their way to explain it either. They have made a few rumblings on the back of supporter sentiment, but they have not challenged anything publically.

We still do not know who the player was. We still do not know what the phasing out agreement is. We still do not really know anything in true AFL fashion.

The faux outrage is a little bemusing given no one can actually explain how Sydney have been wronged. And I doubt the answer lies in zoning .

 

[dean33]

Yes, quite astonishing how an extra 9.8% can deliver that incredible gut running, that manic ferocious tackling, that ironclad team ethic, that tough, relentless accountable footy.

Jude Bolton, Paul Kelly, Brett Kirk, Stewie Maxfield, just in it for the money, weren't they?

Paul Roos, what an unethical mercenary. And clueless to boot.

Ted Richards, Mitch Morton, Mike Pyke, Martin Mattner, already absolute AFL superstars before joining us, became even more insufferable, preening prima donnas once they got their hands on the Swans' bucketloads of filthy lucre.

You're either delusional, or a graceless myopic jerk.

Lay off it. Your pathological rancour will guarantee you long term health issues if you don't deal with it promptly.

Actually yes maxfield was in it for the money. He's a player that left richmond after he started to play really good footy for the big bucks that sydney offered him. This after we made a preliminary final and sydney finished outside the finals.

 

[aussielondon]

I quite like Cola, it goes well with Jack Daniels on the rocks ......... ohhhh, COLA, yeah that is bad stuff, South Melbourne should stop that.

 

[aussielondon]

Are you glad the AFL had the balls to open up the avenue of Essendon being compensated for Ryder leaving without Port Adelaide having to do a proper trade for him?

Theirs a difference between making strong and good decisions- to making stupid decisions based on carelessness or past mistakes.

I got the Bombers back, they are a good club, they just hired some bad people in position of power and influence.

 

[bungwahl]

We actually do not know if the AFL reneged on anything. Maybe Sydney reneged on something which to be honest was the clear implication made when the AFL gave their direction mid trade period.

The whole problem here is we do not really know anything. And your footy club has not gone out of their way to explain it either. They have made a few rumblings on the back of supporter sentiment, but they have not challenged anything publically.

We still do not know who the player was. We still do not know what the phasing out agreement is. We still do not really know anything in true AFL fashion.

The faux outrage is a little bemusing given no one can actually explain how Sydney have been wronged. And I doubt the answer lies in zoning .

I think if you read back on all replies I gave your posts between pages 1 - 125 you should know many of the answers to those questions.

 

[DaVillaBlues]

My biggest issue now is that the AFL really hasn't come out and explained in detail, the reasons for this decision, especially as they did tick off the Buddy deal last year.

The decision just came out of nowhere, still without any adequate rationale and as others have pointed out, most journos have become strangely silent on this issue.

I think the decision was right to phase out the Swans COLA, but this trade ban makes no sense, especially as Essendon are still allowed to do/make trades, and everyone agrees their crimes was horrendous that bought into disrepute, and the Swans really, were only taking advantage of what the AFL gave them.

This whole situation stinks

 

[SugarCoat]

Eddie was saying on his radio show that the AFL have told him the academy bidding system is being overhauled.
Sydney will only have the choice of one academy player per year or they will lose draft picks.
Looks like he has also won that battle.

 

[Tedeski]

why? cause you are sydney?

That & because we work harder than any other team to promote the game with one hand tied behind our back by the AFL & Vic clubs.
We are looked at as the enemy when we actually contribute to lining the pockets of non viable clubs in Victoria that would fold in any other non manufactured organisation.
So yes!

I'll take any advantage I can get as a Swan supporter.
No guilt. No apologies.

Up against 9 NRL teams & a hostile anti AFL media.

So don't concern your self over it because we are actually more important in generating revenue for the AFL competition in today's market than a few struggling non viable Victorian clubs are.

If that's a bit of a struggle for you guys to deal with, email Eddie!
He's dying to help you out!

 

[QuietB]

I think if you read back on all replies I gave your posts between pages 1 - 125 you should know many of the answers to those questions.

No thanks.

The only actual "evidence" we have are some comments from a player manager that the player was Patful. I do not accept that as confirmation.

We have absolutely no comment from the AFL. We have very little comment from Sydney. We have stuff all in the media.

Sydney may have been screwed and on face value it does seem unfair. But we actually do not know many facts.

 

[bluespooner]

Interesting quote from a Hawthorn supporter in that thread I posted:
The key to success is simply one thing ... administration. No club can ever win a flag with a poor administration.

Another interesting thing to take from that thread is how defensive Hawthorn supporters became when the Hawks were accused of receiving advantages.

You sound like a bitter carltank supporter struggling with the reality that your club can no longer go and buy the best players in SA and WA. The sort of advantages carlton enjoyed as one of the wealthiest clubs in the AFL, this on top of having a very healthy zone in Victoria.

It is odd that you should complain about Hawthorn's old zone, given the zones that were granted to hawthorn when they first joined the AFL pretty much guaranteed them the wooden spoon.

I wonder how strong the bloods culture would be if it were to take them forty-five years to win a game at Victoria Park, they would be squealing for all sorts of AFL concessions.

 

[aussierulesrules]

I love how Longmire and co. are crying that they "can't trade anyone in" or sentiments along these lines. Yes you can, John. You are 100% free to trade in. Just ditch the COLA and have the same salary cap as the rest of the comp and you will be able to trade in anyone you like. It's not that hard to work out.

Welcome to our world, where you don't have everything handed to you on a platter.

 

[Beachsleeper]

I love how Longmire and co. are crying that they "can't trade anyone in" or sentiments along these lines. Yes you can, John. You are 100% free to trade in. Just ditch the COLA and have the same salary cap as the rest of the comp and you will be able to trade in anyone you like. It's not that hard to work out.

Welcome to our world, where you don't have everything handed to you on a platter.

Arguments with smiley faces always convince me of their seriousness.

But yeah, sure, let's rewrite dozens of contracts predicated on an allowance that was signed off on by the AFL. And let's do that in an afternoon, right in the middle of trade week. And let's do that despite the agreement to phase it out in the next two years we already had.

It's almost as if you don't want to seriously engage with the argument and are happy to troll from the bottom of the ladder.

The Main Board is a toilet these days, barely distinguishable from Bay 13. And they have better jokes.

 

[sherb]

You sound like a bitter carltank supporter struggling with the reality that your club can no longer go and buy the best players in SA and WA. The sort of advantages carlton enjoyed as one of the wealthiest clubs in the AFL, this on top of having a very healthy zone in Victoria.

It is odd that you should complain about Hawthorn's old zone, given the zones that were granted to hawthorn when they first joined the AFL pretty much guaranteed them the wooden spoon.

I wonder how strong the bloods culture would be if it were to take them forty-five years to win a game at Victoria Park, they would be squealing for all sorts of AFL concessions.

Carltank? You seem lost, Bay 13 is about 10 boards down.

The Main Board is a toilet these days, barely distinguishable from Bay 13. And they have better jokes.

Yep, see the post I quoted above.

 

[aussierulesrules]

You sound upset, Beachsleeper. My heart bleeds for you after you've been able to have an extra mil or so in the salary cap for years and have barely dropped down the ladder in over a decade as a result, have won a couple of flags in that time and now probably won't drop down out of the finals for the forseeable future, because you're going to be gifted the likes of Heeney, Mills and Dunkley on the cheap (with presumably loads more to come) and have been able to get in Franklin and Tippett before the COLA was abolished. The poor, poor Swans, doing it so tough.

 

[MarkP]

You sound upset, Beachsleeper. My heart bleeds for you after you've been able to have an extra mil or so in the salary cap for years and have barely dropped down the ladder in over a decade as a result, have won a couple of flags in that time and now probably won't drop down out of the finals for the forseeable future, because you're going to be gifted the likes of Heeney, Mills and Dunkley on the cheap (with presumably loads more to come) and have been able to get in Franklin and Tippett before the COLA was abolished. The poor, poor Swans, doing it so tough.

Why do we even bother to have a board for rational discussion when you get posts like these that show people have zero, and I truly mean zero, understanding of the issues involved, the mechanics and how they work and the history of those issues and mechanics.

It really is not worth it is it?

 

[TazHawk15]

I love how Longmire and co. are crying that they "can't trade anyone in" or sentiments along these lines. Yes you can, John. You are 100% free to trade in. Just ditch the COLA and have the same salary cap as the rest of the comp and you will be able to trade in anyone you like. It's not that hard to work out.

Welcome to our world, where you don't have everything handed to you on a platter.

This.

 

[dean33]

That & because we work harder than any other team to promote the game with one hand tied behind our back by the AFL & Vic clubs.
We are looked at as the enemy when we actually contribute to lining the pockets of non viable clubs in Victoria that would fold in any other non manufactured organisation.
So yes!

I'll take any advantage I can get as a Swan supporter.
No guilt. No apologies.

Up against 9 NRL teams & a hostile anti AFL media.

So don't concern your self over it because we are actually more important in generating revenue for the AFL competition in today's market than a few struggling non viable Victorian clubs are.

If that's a bit of a struggle for you guys to deal with, email Eddie!
He's dying to help you out!

oh now that you put it that way... hope about we start you on 20 pts(5 wins) at the start of every season to ensure you finish top 4? Or maybe a 4 goal lead at the start of each game?

Will that appease our sydney friends whose success is vital for the viability of the AFL?

 

[dean33]

Eddie was saying on his radio show that the AFL have told him the academy bidding system is being overhauled.
Sydney will only have the choice of one academy player per year or they will lose draft picks.
Looks like he has also won that battle.

sounds fair to me

 

[MarkT2]

But yeah, sure, let's rewrite dozens of contracts predicated on an allowance that was signed off on by the AFL. And let's do that in an afternoon, right in the middle of trade week. And let's do that despite the agreement to phase it out in the next two years we already had.

But if they are all (or even most) getting the COLA on top of their salary then it would actually be a very simple process and they would all share the loss in equal proportion. It may take more than an afternoon but you made that up anyway so it isn't relevent. In fact it didn't even have to be done, just agreed to for next year.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Just listened to the Trade Week edition of the Superfooty Podcast and, in 50 minutes of otherwise decent analysis (and maybe a little too much of guest Slobbo Robbo's verbal wandering) I was staggered that the AFL's trade ban on Sydney wasn't mentioned once. Not once. Imagine this ban affecting Hawthorn or Collingwood or Essendon and then go back and tell me how long you'd think it would be discussed for. I try and avoid Victorian media conspiracy theories and other forms of whingeing about the fate of an interstate club supporter but the COMPLETE lack of media reporting about this decision stinks. It absolutely stinks. We can debate the pros and cons of COLA and whether Sydney, in your mind, "abused" it - I mean, hell, look at the 125 pages before this! - but to not mention it AT ALL, and to see so little mention of it elsewhere too, is infuriating. And so the mind turns back to the Vic/AFL conspiracy theories I'd put aside, and here comes the wounded pride that I thought I'd put aside too. Being a Sydney-born Swans fan now living in Melbourne, I'm used to seeing my team either ignored or lazily mocked, or, at best, begrudgingly admired, but to see so many hacks and one-eyed journos happy to let this slide is deeply frustrating.

I don't want to hear your impressive theory about how we were probably going after a gun player and the AFL stepped in. We don't know this, it's just random conjecture, and you're essentially using a guess to justify a remorseless and unfair ruling. The allowance was given to us then stripped back (mid-phase out plan) with extra penalty on top.

I hate bitterness and self-pity and how it poisons the hearts of football fans (the bleating about umpires, the us against them juvenile mentality) but this whole affair leaves a Swans fan so raw and wronged. That it seems to have passed with so little comment only adds to the sense of, well, betrayal, if that isn't too melodramatic a word.

sEN are partly owned by the afl if I recall correctly. Some presenters have tried to get Gillon on to explain the why - with no success. Unfortunately the issues with Essendon and the dogs and the horse racing have pushed it to the back burner.
And the station went off air when andy maher was asking for an explanation also.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Eddie was saying on his radio show that the AFL have told him the academy bidding system is being overhauled.
Sydney will only have the choice of one academy player per year or they will lose draft picks.
Looks like he has also won that battle.

As long as you only can get one father son per year rated as a round 1 pick (without getting extra picks)

 

[bungwahl]

I love how Longmire and co. are crying that they "can't trade anyone in" or sentiments along these lines. Yes you can, John. You are 100% free to trade in. Just ditch the COLA and have the same salary cap as the rest of the comp and you will be able to trade in anyone you like. It's not that hard to work out.

Welcome to our world, where you don't have everything handed to you on a platter.

After 125+ pages of this thread you would think people may have got a grasp of the basic issue..