News Dons ASADA scandal (Latest: Pg 101 - CAS verdict. Guilty, 12 months.)

[MyManLynch]

under WADA guidelines players/athletes are responsible for what they put in their bodies. Full Stop even if they can prove there drink was spiked to bad.

For those of us who are old enough to remember Suzie O'Neil, the swimmer. She was banned for 1 year because she took A HEADACHE TABLET, given to her BY HER COACH. Let me repeat that. She had a headache before a meet and her coach gave her a headache tablet that he found in the bottom of his kit bag and gave it to her. This tablet contained a banned substance so when she was drug tested as is the norm in swimming, she tested positive to a banned sub stance. It was investigated and it was proven and accepted by WADA that she is not a drug cheat, and that this was a one time error of judgement by an otherwise very clean athlete. This did not matter, she had taken a banned substance so a one year ban followed.

The situation at Essendon is far worse then this with there systematic doping program. It is also key to remember that the AFL are signatories to the ASADA code. And ASADA play by the rules that WADA set out. IF the AFL/ASADA hand out penalties that WADA feel are inappropriate WADA have the right to step in and over rule the sanctions that are put in place by ASADA. So players are going to need to be punished here, and they will be missing out on matches.

I agree with everything you are saying.
However I'm confused re the NRL Sharks punishments...they were very very small...amounting to a few games for some. How did ASADA figure that one? What is WADA going to do? Accept or reject?

 

[MooreTreloar]

Waste of beer.

Just fruit? Maybe rotten fruit and eggs?

 

[BlackWhiteBlood]

I agree with everything you are saying.
However I'm confused re the NRL Sharks punishments...they were very very small...amounting to a few games for some. How did ASADA figure that one? What is WADA going to do? Accept or reject?

Fair point:

From memory it was a bit uncertain, and there was no guarantee WADA would not interject. John Fahey, former NSW premier and former head of WADA tended to think WADA would accept the 6 month ban on the Sharks. This was because ASADA used the no-fault clause and the players accepted they had doped. The sharks also sacked their coach, who has since undergone a whole series of retraining/education and the board stood down. Also the doping was over a fairly short time frame. The players also missed out on playing games. It is important to note that from my understanding these bans also mean they players can not attended the club or be involved at all with the club ie no training. So this also hurts them.

As far as Essendon are concerned none of this has occurred, so the way I read it, there is now no chance 6-months will be offered, they are looking at 1yr bans. An example needs to be set.

 

[Sloth]

It is the administration at Essendon that is responsible and should pay what penalties there are. The players are employees, and have no choice under the AFL system but to obey orders. Any penalties for them should be minimal. The scum who gave the orders should be crucified.

Absolute rubbish. I'm not a professional athlete and even I know that even a sports drink can get you banned. The players knew what they were doing. Zaharakis was the only one the did the right thing by refusing.

 

[Sloth]

POOR KIDS
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-09-22/we-feel-let-down

looks like the famous "Essendon mother" has been vindicated at last

 

[Baltimore Jack]

It is the administration at Essendon that is responsible and should pay what penalties there are. The players are employees, and have no choice under the AFL system but to obey orders. Any penalties for them should be minimal. The scum who gave the orders should be crucified.

Two Essendon players refused to be injected.
The Club took no adverse action against them, they were selected and continued to play through out the years

They all had a choice all they had to do was say "No"

 

[Baltimore Jack]

I agree with everything you are saying.
However I'm confused re the NRL Sharks punishments...they were very very small...amounting to a few games for some. How did ASADA figure that one? What is WADA going to do? Accept or reject?

1. Delay in finalising the investigation (because resources were directed towards Essendon)
2. No systemic doping, it was ad-hoc at worst

Neither of those things applied to Essendon

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Absolute rubbish. I'm not a professional athlete and even I know that even a sports drink can get you banned. The players knew what they were doing. Zaharakis was the only one the did the right thing by refusing.

....and Fletcher

 

[MyManLynch]

1. Delay in finalising the investigation (because resources were directed towards Essendon)
2. No systemic doping, it was ad-hoc at worst

Neither of those things applied to Essendon

It is still strange that players who allegedly ingested banned drugs got away with a slap on the wrist.
Saad drank a sports drink...18 months...
Was it because of no proof or evidence i.e drugs test or any documents?
Lance Armstrong never failed a drug test...banned for life.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

It is still strange that players who allegedly ingested banned drugs got away with a slap on the wrist.
Saad drank a sports drink...18 months...
Was it because of no proof or evidence i.e drugs test or any documents?
Lance Armstrong never failed a drug test...banned for life.

Lance Armstrong failed a drug test in 1999

Saad was tested and found to have a banned substance in his system, a slam dunk for ASADA

There was ample proof for the Cronulla guys but there were extenuating circumstances, they were lucky Essendon's drug doping was far worse or Cronulla would have been hit far harder

 

[Chameleon75]

1. Delay in finalising the investigation (because resources were directed towards Essendon)
2. No systemic doping, it was ad-hoc at worst

Neither of those things applied to Essendon

the ad hoc thing is bs* imo, doesn't matter if you used once or 100 times, a breach is a breach.


*the decision not your views

 

[Black_White]

Lance Armstrong failed a drug test in 1999

Saad was tested and found to have a banned substance in his system, a slam dunk for ASADA

There was ample proof for the Cronulla guys but there were extenuating circumstances, they were lucky Essendon's drug doping was far worse or Cronulla would have been hit far harder

Armstrong was never cited for the four failed tests in 1999, so we simply did not know.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...r-drugs-tests-in-1999-uci-admits-8577491.html

The issue with the Essendon drug regime is, and remains, the lack of documentation.
Simply, no- one can prove the did not ingest banned substances. And as the worldwide doping code puts the onus on the athlete to prove there was no ingestion of a banned substance they are stuffed.
I feel for the young players, as they were bullied into going along with the club and senior team mates. They did not have the power to say no.
But the senior players, knowing their worth on an open market, should have said no.
All players, every year, are lectured on their responsibilities in regard to the anti doping code.
They have no excuse.

 

[Optimax]

Two Essendon players refused to be injected.
The Club took no adverse action against them, they were selected and continued to play through out the years

They all had a choice all they had to do was say "No"

One of them was quickly delisted and has been shunned since that point though.

Rim job was a w***er, but still.

 

[danielnajdek]

Waste of beer.

We could do what people in Adelaide do and throw cups of "beer" at them.

 

[popin]

AFL RIVALS
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...ssendon-as-saga-drags-on-20140922-10kj0r.html

 

[popin]

TIM WATSON
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...sy-over-supplements-saga-20140923-10kutq.html

 

[MyManLynch]

TIM WATSON
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...sy-over-supplements-saga-20140923-10kutq.html

The Koolaid is starting to flow out of his ears.
If EFC didn't drag this through the courts...it would be over already...evidence presented...punishments meted out or deals offered.

 

[rose jam]

The Koolaid is starting to flow out of his ears.
If EFC didn't drag this through the courts...it would be over already...evidence presented...punishments meted out or deals offered.

I heard Tim Watson this morning, he was typically blaming everyone else again..oh it's the AFL investigation that took a long time, it's the ASADA investigation that's taking a long time, it's not Essendon dragging this out....
Tim wake up and smell it

 

[Baltimore Jack]

One of them was quickly delisted and has been shunned since that point though.

Rim job was a ******, but still.

The two players who refused to be injected are Zakaharis and Fletcher, neither have been delisted or shunned

 

[MightyPies1]

Tim Watson has come out with an article stating, if, if, if any other club, and if is the key word here, were in Essendon's position they would do the same.

The reality is that because of a superior framework of ethics, morals and integrity no other club is in Essendon's position. So it's a stupid hypothetical and a morally flawed hypothetical.

 

[Jonno94]

Tim Watson has come out with an article stating, if, if, if any other club, and if is the key word here, were in Essendon's position they would do the same.

The reality is that because of a superior framework of ethics, morals and integrity no other club is in Essendon's position. So it's a stupid hypothetical and a morally flawed hypothetical.

Absolutely ridiculous statement, but not surprised, its Tim Watson after all. That's like a serial killer on trial saying to the jury, "you would have murdered all those people too if you had my psychotic tendencies".

 

[MooreTreloar]

TIM WATSON
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...sy-over-supplements-saga-20140923-10kutq.html

Just when you thought he couldn't be a bigger flog or campaigner.

 

[vjknight]

the evidence tim & the players desire will be released once the show cause stage is complete.
thats their opportunity to defend themselves with the evidence.

the show cause is just that. asada say "after gathering all the evidence we have something on you with TB4 - what have you got to say about that?"

effectively a final chance to dob in others before the ADRVP determine whether the evidence is sufficient and whether infractions are issued.

then its off to the tribunal.......34 separate hearings. and other are sure to follow.

 

[TheFrenchCut]

Armstrong was never cited for the four failed tests in 1999, so we simply did not know.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...r-drugs-tests-in-1999-uci-admits-8577491.html

The issue with the Essendon drug regime is, and remains, the lack of documentation.
Simply, no- one can prove the did not ingest banned substances. And as the worldwide doping code puts the onus on the athlete to prove there was no ingestion of a banned substance they are stuffed.
I feel for the young players, as they were bullied into going along with the club and senior team mates. They did not have the power to say no.
But the senior players, knowing their worth on an open market, should have said no.
All players, every year, are lectured on their responsibilities in regard to the anti doping code.
They have no excuse.

Apologies, since I assume opp. Supporters aren't supposed to post in here. But I thought I'd just quickly state that the onus is only on the player at the show-cause stage. If that moves into infraction, then the onus is on ASADA to prove that the player(s) took banned substances. This is in part on account of the lack of a positive drug test. That's all I wanted to quickly say.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Apologies, since I assume opp. Supporters aren't supposed to post in here. But I thought I'd just quickly state that the onus is only on the player at the show-cause stage. If that moves into infraction, then the onus is on ASADA to prove that the player(s) took banned substances. This is in part on account of the lack of a positive drug test. That's all I wanted to quickly say.

You're wrong ...

... respectful opposition supporters are most welcome to post here