The Terrorism Files - 2015, 2016

[Lethality]

No arguments regarding Islam, i have to disagree with you on NT. Whats the punishment for adultery in NT according to Jesus?

I think it was a whipping?

 

[Total Power]

I think it was a whipping?

Lol that would be incredibly kind compared to whats written, and jesus wants to send us to hell if we look at a woman with lust. Go figure lol we are all going to hell

 

[Lethality]

Lol that would be incredibly kind compared to whats written, and jesus wants to send us to hell if we look at a woman with lust. Go figure lol we are all going to hell

Going to hell means the punishment comes after death, which is fine by people who live in the real world. It doesn't call for violence to be enacted here.

Homosexuality is pronounced as a sin in islamic texts, that's why you see gays pushed off rooftops in Islamic countries. Beheading is sanctioned, that's why you see so much beheading in the islamic world. Same with non-believers, Jews. The hateful influence is obvious.

 

[Total Power]

Going to hell means the punishment comes after death, which is fine by people who live in the real world. It doesn't call for violence to be enacted here.

Try again

5:26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.
5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
5:29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
5:30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

Homosexuality is pronounced as a sin in islamic texts, that's why you see gays pushed off rooftops in Islamic countries. Beheading is sanctioned, that's why you see so much beheading in the islamic world. Same with non-believers, Jews. The hateful influence is obvious.

Hellfire is used in Islam, to scare people. I fail to see how Bible is any better than Islam.

1:31Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

Thats just the new testament you dont wanna read OT

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

This the same Afghanistan where women were lined up on a soccer field in their niqabs and systematically executed? Or is it an imaginary Afghanistan where everything was fine until the big bad USA showed up for no reason?

How do you explain the fact that every Muslim every day is NOT out slaughtering the infidel? Not every Muslim takes on 100% of the observances and the laws of the Qur'an and the Hadiths.

You seem to believe that because the ancient texts are interspersed with the violence of the times they were written in it means all subsequent adherents must themselves feel compelled to carry out violent jihad against all unbelievers and apostates for every second of every day.

Yet the proportion of violent fundamentalists vs that those who go about their daily business is still stacked far in the favour of non-violence.

Why is this?

 

[Little Big John]

How do you explain the fact that every Muslim every day is NOT out slaughtering the infidel? Not every Muslim takes on 100% of the observances and the laws of the Qur'an and the Hadiths.

You seem to believe that because the ancient texts are interspersed with the violence of the times they were written in it means all subsequent adherents must themselves feel compelled to carry out violent jihad against all unbelievers and apostates for every second of every day.

Yet the proportion of violent fundamentalists vs that those who go about their daily business is still stacked far in the favour of non-violence.

Why is this?

Because most people are pussies who won't kill and are thus ruled by those who aren't and will.

 

[Lethality]

Try again

5:26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.
5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
5:29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
5:30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

That's not violence, it's at best self-mutilation? The point Jesus is making here is that nothing is more important than getting into Heaven.

 

[Lethality]

How do you explain the fact that every Muslim every day is NOT out slaughtering the infidel?

It's simple, they are able to cherry pick, same as Christians do.

 

[Lethality]

Hellfire is used in Islam, to scare people. I fail to see how Bible is any better than Islam.

Because if I'm a homosexual and your belief is that I will be punished after I die, then I don't need to worry about you. However if your belief is that it's your right to punish me in the only world that exists, this one, then you're a problem.

 

[Sydney Bloods]

wow this thread went full ******* over the last 4 pages.

between the people who refuse to admit there's issues with islamic terror and the people who, basically espouse the rhetoric of a birth of a nation fanfic. It illustrates, albeit ineloquently the very reason we're in this mess.

 

[Sydney Bloods]

It's simple, they are able to cherry pick, same as Christians do.

not all christians NSFW: http://heavy.com/news/2015/12/anti-...urder-mass-grave-genocide-uncensored-youtube/

let me guess, they're not "real" Christians. I mean honestly, do you not see the issue with your argument? you cannot excuse Christian extremists without presenting the same excuse for Islamic extremists.

it is secularism that holds back the rabid dogs of religion. the religious in secular countries pick and choose because they have to. when the truly religious are allowed to run things their way, The results are always the same, Barbarism.

 

[Lethality]

not all christians NSFW: http://heavy.com/news/2015/12/anti-...urder-mass-grave-genocide-uncensored-youtube/

let me guess, they're not "real" Christians. I mean honestly, do you not see the issue with your argument? you cannot excuse Christian extremists without presenting the same excuse for Islamic extremists.

No, they can be real Christians, the question is whether what they are doing is to the letter of Christian texts, as ISIS is to the Koran. You can have murderers from any religion, that doesn't mean their deeds correlate to their religion. This is pretty basic stuff.

 

[Sydney Bloods]

No, they can be real Christians, the question is whether what they are doing is to the letter of Christian texts, as ISIS is to the Koran. You can have murderers from any religion, that doesn't mean their deeds correlate to their religion. This is pretty basic stuff.

you mean s**t like this: But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me

didn't even need to go old testament for that. but by all means keep excusing christian terrorism in Africa. they're only killing heathens after all.

 

[Lethality]

you mean s**t like this: But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me

The Testament also says to love your enemies and contains a peaceful message overall. If anything it's irresponsibly peaceful. I'm not a defender of the NT, and I have been critical of it on this board, but it's just denial to claim it's no different to the Koran which clearly preaches violence and subjugation to its dying verse.

didn't even need to go old testament for that. but by all means keep excusing christian terrorism in Africa.

I'm not excusing the actions, but your claim is that this is a plausible interpretation of the Christian faith, and that's just a nonsense when you read the take home message of Gospels. You might have better arguments to throw at me here, so far all you've given me is a gentle demonstration of how little you know about this subject.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

it is secularism that holds back the rabid dogs of religion. the religious in secular countries pick and choose because they have to. when the truly religious are allowed to run things their way, The results are always the same, Barbarism.

Too right. Religious fervour within a framework of moral absolutism always leads to an extreme. There is room for the worship of Hashem/God/Allah/Buddha etc, within secularism, but at the same time the absolute religious freedom to trample on all who don't share your beliefs is rightly frowned upon.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

Something interesting about the linguistics of Arabic as it applies to the Qu'ran...

http://www.islamforpeace.org/quran.html

A friend of mine once told me that the Quran instructs Muslims to kill all Infidels. I agreed with him that violent interpretations of the Quran exist and permeate many of our Islamic books. My friend then quoted the following 3 verses to prove his point.

Quran: {The infidels are your sworn enemies Sura 4:101}
Quran {Prophet, make war on the infidels Sura 66: 9}
Quran {Never be a helper to the disbelievers Sura 28:86}

I thanked my friend for making this point as well as indicating these verses, and then responded as follows:

Comments:
Clearly, the above verses can incite much animosity and subsequent violence vis-a-vis all non-Muslims. Accepted literally - and uncritically - these verses lend themselves to the unjust persecution of otherwise innocent people, whose only crime is being non-Muslim.

However, a pivotal matter of linguistic importance is often overlooked: the significance and usage of the definite article, "al" (i.e., "the"), which precedes the various disparaging Arabic words - kafirun, mushrikun - that describe non-believers in the Quran and which are often translated as "non-believers," "infidels," "idolaters," or "polytheists." Furthermore, in Arabic, the definite article is physically attached to the word it describes.

See below:

Quran: {The infidels are your sworn enemies Sura 4:101}
Quran {Prophet, make war on the infidels Sura 66: 9
Quran {Never be a helper to the disbelievers Sura 28:86}

The exact Arabic expression in these verses - indeed, in every verse that talks of the non-believer - is "Al-Kaferrin" or "Al-la-dhina Kafaru." The use of "Al-" or "Al-la-dhina" limits the verse (and thus commandment) to

1) a specific time and place in history, and
2) a specific group of people who were obstacles to the establishment of Islam in its nascent phase.

It is these two factors that caused these verses to be revealed. Had the intentions of the Quran been to extend the application of these verses in perpetuity, it would have used the expression "Man Kafar," rather than "Al-Kafereen" or "Al-La-dhina Kafaru". The former, "Man Kafar," literally means any one who does not believe in God; while the latter, "Al-Kafereen," - the infidels - denotes a specific group of people: they who fought Prophet Mohamed in the early stages of Islam...

 

[Sydney Bloods]

The Testament also says to love your enemies and contains a peaceful message overall. If anything it's irresponsibly peaceful. I'm not a defender of the NT, and I have been critical of it on this board, but it's just denial to claim it's no different to the Koran which clearly preaches violence and subjugation to its dying verse.



I'm not excusing the actions, but your claim is that this is a plausible interpretation of the Christian faith, and that's just a nonsense when you read the take home message of Gospels. You might have better arguments to throw at me here, so far all you've given me is a gentle demonstration of how little you know about this subject.

both the old testment and the new testament advocates both peace and violence. your lack of understanding this proves only that you've fallen hook line and sinker for the propaganda of faithful. the truly devout do not pick and choose they fall they're bible to the letter. Hence when the bible calls for violence they commit violence.

you said it yourself in the first part of your reply, "also says to love" indicating that your aware that it does indeed demand violence. you cannot simply dismiss the passages which promote violence and say its not a legitimate interpretation. just because in the west we shackle our Christians and force them to pull back from insanity does not mean the insanity is not very much real.

we have 1500 years of atrocities committed in the name of your lord and we seek to lecture me on interpretation? shall i started quoting historical religious leaders and their interpretations? the modern outspoken evangelicals in america?

your doing exactly what you accuse muslims of doing when it comes to islamic terror. if you can't see that then your already lost.

 

[Lethality]

both the old testment and the new testament advocates both peace and violence. your lack of understanding this proves only that you've fallen hook line and sinker for the propaganda of faithful.

I don't deny it at all. The difference is that the Koran abrogates peaceful verses with violent ones and the Bible abrogates violent verses with peaceful ones. Muhammad is only peaceful when he doesn't have any power.

we have 1500 years of atrocities committed in the name of your lord and we seek to lecture me on interpretation?

Who is my Lord? Who is yours?

your doing exactly what you accuse muslims of doing when it comes to islamic terror. if you can't see that then your already lost.

I'm beheading non-believers, supporting fascism, denying equal rights for minorities, pushing homosexuals off rooftops, kidnapping people's families until they convert? This is nonsense.

 

[Sydney Bloods]

I don't deny it at all. The difference is that the Koran abrogates peaceful verses with violent ones and the Bible abrogates violent verses with peaceful ones. Muhammad is only peaceful when he doesn't have any power.



Who is my Lord?



I'm beheading non-believers, supporting fascism, denying equal rights for minorities, pushing homosexuals off rooftops, kidnapping people's families until they convert? This is nonsense.

you continue to conflate. both the koran and the bible can be used to support violence and both at times demand violence. your understanding of history of religious interpretation and application is astounding for a bloke who doggedly criticise's islam.

you seek only to support both one interpretation of Christianity and one interpretation of Islam and deny others exist because it doesn't fit into your black and white bubble.

and please don't be a dickhead you know exactly what i'm referring to, your trying to argue that the bible does not support the actions of these nutters and that they are acting outside of christianity.

the exact same thing that the muslims defending islam have said in regards to islamic terrorists. Your trying to distance your holy book from the actions of your most devout.

But since you brought it up......... everything you just accused muslim extremists of doing. (quite rightly) Christian extremists also do and have just as many passages and history and classical interpretation backing them up.

You've managed to do something not many people do when it comes to religion and that is open an eye to its atrocities and truly disgusting underbelly, You need only open the other to realise that islam is not the exception but the rule. Have a look at what happens in Africa understand what unbridled Christianity brings even our enlightened age.

the truth is, the only difference between Christian extremists and muslims extremists is the curve of the sword.

 

[Lethality]

you continue to conflate. both the koran and the bible can be used to support violence and both at times demand violence. your understanding of history of religious interpretation and application is astounding for a bloke who doggedly criticise's islam.

I've already explained why it doesn't matter. Your inability to get it means nothing other than you don't know your stuff.

you seek only to support both one interpretation of Christianity and one interpretation of Islam and deny others exist because it doesn't fit into your black and white bubble.

I haven't made any interpretations, didn't argue that Jesus was taken out of context or was only being rhetorical or any of that. Studying the Bible and studying the Koran will make it pretty clear to you what the differences are. So far you have chosen to ignore them, well good luck with that, but it doesn't carry any truck into a real theological discussion.

and please don't be a dickhead you know exactly what i'm referring to

I'll ask again, who is YOUR Lord?

But since you brought it up......... everything you just accused muslim extremists of doing. (quite rightly) Christian extremists also do and have just as many passages and history and classical interpretation backing them up.

Haha, no, not at all. I think you've fallen into the trap of confusing equality amongst people with equality amongst texts. Muslims are equal to people of other faiths but their religion certainly is not. Now, you also claimed that there are just as many violent passages in the Koran, well that's just wrong as well. Firstly, you wouldn't expect there to be as many as it is a smaller book therefore just as many means twice the amount of hatred and justification for violence, but in actual fact there are quantitatively 7.1 times the number of violent verses in the Koran as occur in the Bible. To not know this means again you don't know what you're talking about.

You need only open the other to realise that islam is not the exception but the rule.

LOL, no thankfully Islam is not the rule, which is why there are no Islamic countries in the Top 30 places to live. Islam and its laws are just a nightmare of intolerance. It's important to know what you are arguing for, you want the execution of minority groups at a religious whim, you know where to go.

 

[yebiga]

I don't know but was there like 6 million Jews exterminated by Christians in the middle of Europe only 70 years ago because they killed Jesus?

Seems like the Muslims have a long way to go to catch up to that little bit of history?
Those nazi s where radical Christian supremacists weren't they?

 

[Total Power]

That's not violence, it's at best self-mutilation? The point Jesus is making here is that nothing is more important than getting into Heaven.

yes jesus is saying do that orelse rot in hell...very peaceful right?

 

[Lethality]

yes jesus is saying do that orelse rot in hell...very peaceful right?

It kind of is, because hell doesn't exist . . . this doesn't cause a problem in the real world.

 

[Lethality]

I don't know but was there like 6 million Jews exterminated by Christians in the middle of Europe only 70 years ago because they killed Jesus?
Those nazi s where radical Christian supremacists weren't they?

Not really, they wore Christian symbols and had an alliance with the Roman Catholic church at the time, but they weren't Christians. If you want a beef with Christians during WW2, then it would be with the church who had ties to fascism.

Anyway, you do realise that the most hateful verses in the Hadiths are against Jews, right? It's incredible, there is literature in it where even the landscape helps the Muslims kill Jews by pointing them out.

Oh, and Muhammad killed plenty of Jews too.

 

[Total Power]

It kind of is, because hell doesn't exist . . . this doesn't cause a problem in the real world.

So why is bible full of "Hell" stuff then? sydney bloods is spot on, you are interpreting it as it suits you