Society/Culture This person's got to be having a laugh.

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raskolnikov

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Even though its later in the article, 2009 is not actually later than 2014
 

mottrain

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The mental side of gender dysphoria is the biggest issue considering many who undergo it have some strange beliefs and perceptions. There are some trannies who are actually 'lesbians' after they take the sex reassignment surgery. There's the position taken also by some trannies that they then are actually engaging in a legitimate female to male relationship should they have a partner of the perceived opposite sex after the surgery. This to me is quite unusual as as far as I am concerned they are actually engaging in an actual homosexual relationship after this operation regardless. It is unfortunate as these strange views turn a lot of people off trannies for this reason.
 

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skilts

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Is it in any way possible that the statement quoted is indicative of a person who was trying to hide the nature of their sexual orientation? I think it sad rather than funny that she would may have felt obliged to maintain a veneer of 'normalcy'.
 
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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/29/pat-robertson-transgender_n_3672244.html

Pat Robertson, an anti-gay whacko preacher:
"I think there are men who are in a woman's body," he said. "It's very rare. But it's true -- or women that are in men's bodies -- and that they want a sex change. That is a very permanent thing, believe me, when you have certain body parts amputated and when you have shot up with various kinds of hormones. It's a radical procedure. I don't think there's any sin associated with that. I don't condemn somebody for doing that."

It's strange that it seems a fair few people who think homosexuality is unnatural can understand transgender issues. Goes to show that maybe they only object to some things because they're told that they're bad.
 

raskolnikov

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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/29/pat-robertson-transgender_n_3672244.html

Pat Robertson, an anti-gay whacko preacher:


It's strange that it seems a fair few people who think homosexuality is unnatural can understand transgender issues. Goes to show that maybe they only object to some things because they're told that they're bad.

Someone needs to tell good old Pat that the Bible says a lot more about being judgemental and hypocritical than it does about being gay.
 

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Is it in any way possible that the statement quoted is indicative of a person who was trying to hide the nature of their sexual orientation? I think it sad rather than funny that she would may have felt obliged to maintain a veneer of 'normalcy'.
Given that the quote was from 2004 (not 2014), yes.
 

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The mental side of gender dysphoria is the biggest issue considering many who undergo it have some strange beliefs and perceptions. There are some trannies who are actually 'lesbians' after they take the sex reassignment surgery. There's the position taken also by some trannies that they then are actually engaging in a legitimate female to male relationship should they have a partner of the perceived opposite sex after the surgery. This to me is quite unusual as as far as I am concerned they are actually engaging in an actual homosexual relationship after this operation regardless. It is unfortunate as these strange views turn a lot of people off trannies for this reason.
not sure if serious
 
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The mental side of gender dysphoria is the biggest issue considering many who undergo it have some strange beliefs and perceptions. There are some trannies who are actually 'lesbians' after they take the sex reassignment surgery. There's the position taken also by some trannies that they then are actually engaging in a legitimate female to male relationship should they have a partner of the perceived opposite sex after the surgery. This to me is quite unusual as as far as I am concerned they are actually engaging in an actual homosexual relationship after this operation regardless. It is unfortunate as these strange views turn a lot of people off trannies for this reason.

I think you are overly confusing transsexuals with a form of sexuality, try not to be confused by the '-sexual' suffix. Most fundamentally, you just don't seem to get it (the whole notion of someone being born with the wrong biological sex), which is why you struggle with the idea. If you disagree with these 'strange views' (which are not radical, in fact a considerable majority of transgender people would conform with such a view), then you don't really attempt to understand the transgender condition. If you don't think a trans woman can be a 'lesbian' or in a heterosexual relationship with a man, then you don't really accept their gender identity, it's really that simple.

Additionally, the use of 'trannies' is clearly insensitive.
 

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Sound like the government of Iran, which is incredibly oppressive towards gays, is willing to pay for sex change surgery.

http://www.trust.org/item/20140625223238-i4g9r

It seems they believe homosexuality is a result of being born in the wrong body? Well, they seem to have gotten gender identity down, now they just need to get the memo on sexuality.

Iran is almost a unique case, it's been going on for years. It's an incredibly harmful policy, as it could obviously lead to homosexuals being wrongfully coerced or tricked into undergoing gender transition, which would obviously be a complete disaster. Being born with gender dysphoria is bad enough, but to actually have the reverse happen, would be even more traumatic. As far as I am concerned, they don't really have gender identity down at all, even if it is somewhat less problematic in that context in comparison to sexuality.

Similarly, and certainly to a lesser degree, I think the male-female transformation cultural pastimes seen in some Asian cultures (i.e. Kathoey), and the relative silence regarding the reverse situation, also unhelpfully distorts the transgender reality and blurs the lines a little.
 
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https://au.sports.yahoo.com/news/ar...g-promoter-franck-maloney-reveals-sex-change/

So he wants to live a life as a woman as he believes he was born that way. Fine. But he has no time for gay people because it's immoral.

Ok mete.

Whilst I agree (even if that is unfairly taken a little out of context), if this was a gay man seeing transsexuals as immoral, this wouldn't even be a thread. The LGB discrimination of Ts is far more prevalent and normalised than the reverse, let's not pretend this isn't the case.

I'm also a bit disappointed that the OP would be outraged, yet open with the thread title "This guy's...". Whilst I can see you are fine with transgender people, it's the sort of thread title that instantly negates itself, and sadly somewhat confirms a little of what I mentioned above. Could the OP please change the thread title?!?!
 
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mottrain

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I think you are overly confusing transsexuals with a form of sexuality, try not to be confused by the '-sexual' suffix. Most fundamentally, you just don't seem to get it (the whole notion of someone being born with the wrong biological sex), which is why you struggle with the idea. If you disagree with these 'strange views' (which are not radical, in fact a considerable majority of transgender people would conform with such a view), then you don't really attempt to understand the transgender condition. If you don't think a trans woman can be a 'lesbian' or in a heterosexual relationship with a man, then you don't really accept their gender identity, it's really that simple.

Additionally, the use of 'trannies' is clearly insensitive.
People are born the sex they are. Androgynous people are more likely to conform with gender dysphoria through having more feminine charachteristics coupled with their male characteristics. People like this who would be clearly male to most and actually would look nothing like a girl to me are more likely to have a mental problem called gender dysphoria rather than something else.

I also actually find it quite odd that these people think that there will be acceptance through mainstream values for them and they will be treated as an actual woman. The reason they are often with members of their birth sex who are gay says simply that's what they are just with a changed identity. The fact that many straight people won't engage in sexual relationships with a transsexual if they identify as straight and see themselves as engaging in homosexual behaviour y doing so questions and discredits the notion of transsexuals gender views.

The confusion with gender identity and sexual identity does not exist at all and actually rather it is hand in hand.

As for real women - Born a woman and acts like a woman.
 
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People are born the sex they are. Androgynous people are more likely to conform with gender dysphoria through having more feminine charachteristics coupled with their male characteristics. People like this who would be clearly male to most and actually would look nothing like a girl to me are more likely to have a mental problem called gender dysphoria rather than something else.

I also actually find it quite odd that these people think that there will be acceptance through mainstream values for them and they will be treated as an actual woman. The reason they are often with members of their birth sex who are gay says simply that's what they are just with a changed identity. The fact that many straight people won't engage in sexual relationships with a transsexual if they identify as straight and see themselves as engaging in homosexual behaviour y doing so questions and discredits the notion of transsexuals gender views.

The confusion with gender identity and sexual identity does not exist at all and actually rather it is hand in hand.

As for real women - Born a woman and acts like a woman.

Well after all that, all I can sincerely recommend is a great deal of education in the matter. A lot of the above is incorrect, but the most glaring gaff you made was the claim that gay men would have any sexual interest in women whatsoever, including trans women. You seem to be basing a lot of your opinion purely on your own experiential observations, rather than any real familiarity with these conditions. It very much reads as the outside looking in, and very aesthetically-orientated (i.e. masculinity and femininity don't exactly translate with a person's gender or sexuality).
 

mottrain

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Well after all that, all I can sincerely recommend is a great deal of education in the matter. A lot of the above is incorrect, but the most glaring gaff you made was the claim that gay men would have any sexual interest in women whatsoever, including trans women. You seem to be basing a lot of your opinion purely on your own experiential observations, rather than any real familiarity with these conditions. It very much reads as the outside looking in, and very aesthetically-orientated (i.e. masculinity and femininity don't exactly translate with a person's gender or sexuality).
A lot of 'straight men' who have an interest in or go with transsexuals are often seen as gay men in the closet and are considered such. The fact that many have a penis still and won't get rid of it makes them male. Even some gay men joke and tell them that they are men making their supposed status as a female even more questionable. It is not a matter looking outside in, it is the reality straight males consider transsexuals and dudes who go after transsexuals in this manner. Maybe you need some education on how straight men and women often in most cases see transsexuals male to female.
 
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A lot of 'straight men' who have an interest in or go with transsexuals are often seen as gay men in the closet and are considered such. The fact that many have a penis still and won't get rid of it makes them male. Even some gay men joke and tell them that they are men making their supposed status as a female even more questionable. It is not a matter looking outside in, it is the reality straight males consider transsexuals and dudes who go after transsexuals in this manner. Maybe you need some education on how straight men and women often in most cases see transsexuals male to female.
I am trying to be nice, and I am fully aware of the variety of attitudes out there. But someone having a certain attitude to something doesn't necessarily make them correct, and gender identity is not dictated solely by the surface level judgment of outside observers. I think medical professionals, the person in question, and more recently lawmakers, would have more of an idea about this than the average joe with an outdated perspective. You are just approaching this concept all wrong. Please attempt to educate yourself on the matter before commenting further.
 

mottrain

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I am trying to be nice, and I am fully aware of the variety of attitudes out there. But someone having a certain attitude to something doesn't necessarily make them correct, and gender identity is not dictated solely by the surface level judgment of outside observers. I think medical professionals, the person in question, and more recently lawmakers, would have more of an idea about this than the average joe with an outdated perspective. You are just approaching this concept all wrong. Please attempt to educate yourself on the matter before commenting further.
Legal experts often formulate views on people's perceptions and opinions so don't know why would say they have some special understanding of this. Many doctors also question some of the gender dysphoria cases and also state what was staed by another poster below the chromosomal birth status identifies the sex which would often be right and conformist with their birth sex but they still feel they need reassignment operations which would be why many consider it a mental condition.
 
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Legal experts often formulate views on people's perceptions and opinions so don't know why would say they have some special understanding of this. Many doctors also question some of the gender dysphoria cases and also state what was staed by another poster below the chromosomal birth status identifies the sex which would often be right and conformist with their birth sex but they still feel they need reassignment operations which would be why many consider it a mental condition.

Given the increased acceptance of transgender people in society in recent years, it has led to a reassessment of outdated attitudes and it's no longer really classified as a mental condition. It was only ever really listed as such in the same way that LGB people were in an earlier period.

Additionally, biological sex and gender identity are two separate entities.
 
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