News Thomas and Keefe - 2 year ban - Trade, De-List, Rookie

[Bard]

"GUYS LET'S COPY ESSENDON AND VICTIMISE OURSELVES AND HAVE A FOOKEN SOOK EVERYWHERE."

Yeah no thanks. Just give them the boot if found guilty and move on.

 

[4tone]

Not to mention how much of the proverbial would hit the fan if it was discovered that ASADA were deliberately tampering with blood samples. Surely no-one would be stupid enough to do that. It would truly be the darkest day in the history of Australian sport if it was discovered that our national anti-doping agency was corrupt, which I very very very much doubt is.

Is it inconceivable that people do stupid s**t all the time, what were thought processes when the plan was conceived to do 9/11, People do stupid s**t, why are we here immune from this. Seriously how hard would it be for a guy to add some illegal s**t to a sample after it has been given, what, is the sample, brief cased, guarded and watched throughout the entire process. The AFL with their cheap food , kicking footys on ground after the game, now the bombers getting off, its making me sick, I thought NRL made s**t up as they went, the AFL have surpassed those guys hands down.

 

[Kirby]

WADA / ASADA at the Moment look like the are “All Talk” and “No Action"

Dave honestly slow down and breathe. They did take action.

They lost!

It doesn't surprise me in the least and I'm surprised so many people just don't get it. It was an entirely "circumstantial case" in which they could not compel evidence from the very people who could shed light on what was injected I.e. Dank, Charter etc.

It was doomed to failure.

 

[surfer1]

As Predicted. After the Bummers got away with Cheating.

The Media has gone 100% into Collingwood Bashing

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...-enhancing-drugs/story-fni5f6hd-1227286698197

How is that Collingwood Bashing?

 

[motr]

To my thinking, ASADA / WADA have been focusing so much on the individual competitors, the Lance Armstrongs and Ben Johnsons of this world, and their code doesn't appear to be set up to handle systematic doping in team sports.

Every regulated industry on the planet has a record keeping obligation.

If Essendon had been running an airline and been busted not keeping maintenance records then they'd be out of business.

WADA / ASADA are clearly out of touch on that count.

There has been, and will continue to be, plenty of print dedicated to this issue. I haven't seen, nor am I expecting to see, such a concentrated dose of common sense.

 

[TradeDraft]

Dave honestly slow down and breathe. They did take action.

They lost!

It doesn't surprise me in the least and I'm surprised so many people just don't get it. It was an entirely "circumstantial case" in which they could not compel evidence from the very people who could shed light on what was injected I.e. Dank, Charter etc.

It was doomed to failure.

They Lost because they did a s**t Job at the Investgation

 

[76woodenspooners]

As Predicted. After the Bummers got away with Cheating.

The Media has gone 100% into Collingwood Bashing

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...-enhancing-drugs/story-fni5f6hd-1227286698197

I thought it was a reasonable article - not Collingwood bashing at all.

 

[BOMBERS 4 LIFE!!!!]

Just want to say i hope this mess gets sorted quickly for your blokes don't want to see another club suffer like we did any ways al the best for 2015.

 

[TradeDraft]

Just want to say i hope this mess gets sorted quickly for your blokes don't want to see another club suffer like we did any ways al the best for 2015.

We are Open on Who and What Happened.

Be over in the 14th Hopefully

 

[Kirby]

I thought it was a reasonable article - not Collingwood bashing at all.

Of course it's not. If anything it makes us look good.

My greatest fear is that I will wake up in the morning and Dave will have chalked up 60,000 posts.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Dave honestly slow down and breathe. They did take action.

They lost!

It doesn't surprise me in the least and I'm surprised so many people just don't get it. It was an entirely "circumstantial case" in which they could not compel evidence from the very people who could shed light on what was injected I.e. Dank, Charter etc.

It was doomed to failure.

Yeah, but you have to admit that a prosecutor who pursues a case for more than two years and fails to secure a guilty verdict is a bit limp?

 

[Robroy22]

Just want to say i hope this mess gets sorted quickly for your blokes don't want to see another club suffer like we did any ways al the best for 2015.

Good on ya mate, all the best

 

[Kirby]

Yeah, but you have to admit that a prosecutor who pursues a case for more than two years and fails to secure a guilty verdict is a bit limp?

They could be but seeing as the hearing was closed I have no idea. I do question why they went ahead with it but it probably had to run after all the hoo-ha.

 

[MagpieBat]

How is that Collingwood Bashing?

No Grundy or Moore puff.

 

[76woodenspooners]

They could be but seeing as the hearing was closed I have no idea. I do question why they went ahead with it but it probably had to run after all the hoo-ha.

Or they had to show to their masters (WADA) that they were being seen to do something.

 

[TradeDraft]

Really you could say that they where Not Found Guilt or Innocent.

They could not talk to the 2 Smoking Guns in Denk and Charter so the Truth is still not known

 

[swiftdog]

Is it inconceivable that people do stupid s**t all the time, what were thought processes when the plan was conceived to do 9/11, People do stupid s**t, why are we here immune from this. Seriously how hard would it be for a guy to add some illegal s**t to a sample after it has been given, what, is the sample, brief cased, guarded and watched throughout the entire process. The AFL with their cheap food , kicking footys on ground after the game, now the bombers getting off, its making me sick, I thought NRL made s**t up as they went, the AFL have surpassed those guys hands down.

Of course people do stupid s**t. I imagine the type of person that works at ASADA is much different to your average AFL player, drug dealer or farmer though. As for a blood sample, I imagine to add the clen to the sample then blood with traces of clen would need to be added to the player's sample, you can't just slip the drug into the sample. Regardless, all of the following are far more likely than ASADA deliberately falsely reporting results:
1) Thomas and Keefe deliberately set out to find and use clen
2) It was a product used to cut another drug (i.e. cocaine)
3) Dodgy meat practices in NZ and/or Australia

Seriously, can you imagine the fallout if ASADA were found to be corrupt? I'm no lawyer but I imagine that any recent guilty verdict that ASADA have handed down could now be questioned in court. Who funds ASADA? Because they are likely due to lose a lot of money. All of this to get one back on the AFL? Not going to happen. The consequences of ASADA doing stupid s**t are far higher than the vast majority of people doing stupid s**t.

Put it this way - what would ASADA have to gain by throwing Keefe and Thomas under the bus?

 

[10571z]

Just want to say i hope this mess gets sorted quickly for your blokes don't want to see another club suffer like we did any ways al the best for 2015.

Should be open and shut case for us you would think!

 

[4tone]

Just want to say i hope this mess gets sorted quickly for your blokes don't want to see another club suffer like we did any ways al the best for 2015.

No I don't want it to get sorted quickly how convenient, for everybody, These guys should be allowed every dirty trick a lawyer can come up with, then delay the entire process at least 3 years then get off with a hand picked magistrate.

 

[noideaatall]

Assuming for a moment this is all about coke laced with clen. I find this an interesting moral question and a challenge for us all in terms of drug taking, particularly in sport. IMO:

The 'norm' seems to view taking clen deliberately as cheating, coke as a silly mistake. Simplistically put we need to recognise that taking either is not uncommon, both involve risk and attaining a proscribed outcome for your pysical or mental state, repeated taking is about reaching that outcome or state again, addiction is about I need it to be ok, to cope. For the user in a lot of ways they are not that different even though for the observer its light and day.

I don't see a lot of difference between taking PEDs and illicit drugs. At best one is about I need this to physically cope, the other I need this to mentally cope. Once down the track the two converge. Both are rife in Australian sport and society today. I grew up in an era where Bob Hawke was lauded for the fastest yard glass, Lillee and Matthews for beer drinking on a flight. The kids of today have inherited that culture and fashioned it in their own way. I'm not suggesting a permissive culture for PEDs or shooting illicit drug users. Equal consequences, do the crime do the time attitude.

As Bucks said, ignorance is no excuse. If its due to cut coke they go.

I am proud of the way Collingwood has dealt with this so far.

 

[Pedro]

As Predicted. After the Bummers got away with Cheating.

The Media has gone 100% into Collingwood Bashing

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...-enhancing-drugs/story-fni5f6hd-1227286698197

What do you expect? Collingwood from the sounds of things fought the AFL & AFLPA to get this thing out into the open. Once its there, its a story. The media are going to run with it and their theorising is no worse than whats done here. The fact is that two of our lads have tested positive for a PED and that is a massive story. They are not bashing Collingwood for the sake of it and in fact, most sentiment seems to be that the club has been praised for its handling of that matter (so far). If you don't like what the paper says, don't read it.

 

[Pedro]

Assuming for a moment this is all about coke laced with clen.

Not a question to you specifically but a general question. Why would someone cut cocaine with clenbuterol? I assume its relatively expensive compared to the usual cutting agents like glucose etc. Purely as a cost/profit thing it doesn't make sense to me. Or am I looking at it wrong. Does it somehow add the the experience of using cocaine by having this stuff in it?

It's not going to help these boys either way. If it was in cocaine and they took it inadvertantly, they are still going to swing

 

[Gone Critical]

Not a question to you specifically but a general question. Why would someone cut cocaine with clenbuterol? I assume its relatively expensive compared to the usual cutting agents like glucose etc. Purely as a cost/profit thing it doesn't make sense to me. Or am I looking at it wrong. Does it somehow add the the experience of using cocaine by having this stuff in it?

It's not going to help these boys either way. If it was in cocaine and they took it inadvertantly, they are still going to swing

It's a question I have seen on a number of boards. My take on 1st principles without any actual knowledge of the area is that what you say makes sense and will in the main be true. However I would also hazard a guess that decisions made around cutting drugs are not necessarily made with Fortune 500 economic principles involved at all times and the decision makers are not likely to be business school graduates. From the decision being made by Nuff nuffs, made by people already sampling their own wares, because they were a bit short on in the good stuff and needed stuff out tonight so Clen seemed a good add to the mix there could be any number of reasons a dealer may on occasions add a bit of Clen to the mix.

 

[Quicky]

Is it inconceivable that people do stupid s**t all the time, what were thought processes when the plan was conceived to do 9/11, People do stupid s**t, why are we here immune from this. Seriously how hard would it be for a guy to add some illegal s**t to a sample after it has been given, what, is the sample, brief cased, guarded and watched throughout the entire process. The AFL with their cheap food , kicking footys on ground after the game, now the bombers getting off, its making me sick, I thought NRL made s**t up as they went, the AFL have surpassed those guys hands down.

With regards to the sampling there would be a chain of custody procedure that would need to be followed. And there would be quality assurance and quality control processes that would need to be adhered to, to ensure no contamination of samples occurs. If I were a lawyer I would be focussing heavily on whether any of these processes fell apart or were not followed to the letter of the relevant standards and guidelines.

 

[Mungo Mulligan Stew]

Isn't that the place from the movie the beach?

Beautiful & from what I can take from the film, very safe, sharks only eat nordic people.

[giggle]
Candidate for best post ever!