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That's because it's a different award, just as the pre - 1992 'All - Australian' is.
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Opinion Top 20 of all time
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That's because it's a different award, just as the pre - 1992 'All - Australian' is.
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Think Ron Todd would get a berth in that groupd easily.
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Knights played both ends also. Kicked 8 goals on Silvagni, kicked 3 or 4 in our 1978 premiership, etc.
What, like VFL premierships and Brownlows
A bit of misleading statement. Knights started the day on Perovic before a 17yo SOS took over during the first quarter. He was moved off him again later in the match as Knights got on top. Don't know how many goals Knights kicked on the kid exactly, but SOS was 75kg wringing wet back in 85'.
Wouldn't make mine either. I'd probably have him somewhere between 35-50, but he is always thereabouts for inclusion in my best 22 of all time, so go figure. Was only a slight bloke but had balls like you wouldn't believe. He was super fit and super skilled, so I could see him doing very well in today's game.
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The CHB is a tough one, especially in the modern era, Peter Dean would be up there, Gary Aryes/Jakovich as well, i think one player many overlook for the postion (modern day) is David Neitz, especially if factoring in versatility, not many were rated higher as a CHB and no one had the ability to go fwd like he did during his time in the game, he went from 'possibly' being the best CHB in the game at the time to becoming a Coleman medalist, won the goal kicking at Melbourne 7 times in total, pretty much as good as they come.
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Yeah Neitz was underrated. If he played forward all his career he could've kicked a lot more goals. Was also in the shadow of the more flamboyant Schwarz.
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What, like VFL premierships and Brownlows
I likened it to the All-Australian award, which was an entirely different honour prior to 1992 though it bears the same name.
Checked my stats, it was 9 goals apparently.
SOS was at the beginning of his career and Knights at the end.
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Great vision there. I think besides Whitten (who i take on face value) that Knights is the best CHB/CHF the game has seen. Too bad his career was affected by injury as it was.
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His 537 goals in those 98 games is more than enough to to be considered superior to the likes of Carey !
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That owes mainly to Schwarz' knee injuries. He played second banana to Schwarz when they played together.
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He played as a back because of the Dee's strong KFs, pretty sure he would've played with Jako too (early days) and also played a lot of footy with Lyon, it wasn't until those players were gone that he was given a chance up fwd, i'm not saying he was a great fwd, he was a very good KF but he was never a standout, but as a CHB i don't recall seeing any better, if he'd stayed at CHB he would've been up there with the best of alltime IMO, he was seriously good in that position.
So you say, but I'm yet to see any proof. What we do know, is that it was an award given by the VFLPA to the player deemed MVP for the season. Basically it is the same exact award. What your shaky claim is based on, is your unsupported suspicions that the voting system used to determine the MVP was different pre-82. Aside from no evidence, I fail to see the relevance when the same can be said of historically recorded Brownlows and Premierships.
Watch this space. I believe the pre-82 MVP's status is currently under review.
Kiicked 9 for the match yes, but not on SOS as you claimed; and certainly not on the "Silvagni" everyone knows as a player - he was a 17yo kid in his 4th game of league footy. Your statement was misleading, I just wanted to clear those muddied waters.
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My query isn't simply with the voting system, but also with the meaning of the award. The AA award has a completely different meaning these days, and is acknowledged officially from 1992 onwards. The MVP's acknowledgment begins in 1982 and there's reason to believe that the criteria was different prior to that time.
If it was the same award then it would be acknowledged as given to all players pre 1982 and after. Would certainly be unfair if all recipients before 1982 weren't acknowledged in the award's history. The only explanation is that it's a wholly different award.
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- #115
1. Matthews (Has to be no.1 because of his record and ability to play wherever required to win a game.)
2. Carey (Best CHF I've seen, bar none. Possibly best forward overall)
3. Bartlett (Longevity plus brilliance, to play 400 games at that level is outstanding)
4. Haydn Bunton, Sr
5. Peter Hudson
6. Greg Williams
7. Jason Dunstall
8. Tony Lockett
9. Bob Skilton
10. Graeme Farmer
11. Dick Reynolds
12. Gary Ablett Sr
13. Royce Hart
14. John Coleman
15. Malcolm Blight
16. Ron Barassi
17. Peter Knights
18. Steven Silvagni
19. Lance Franklin
20. Alex Jesaulenko
2. Carey (Best CHF I've seen, bar none. Possibly best forward overall)
3. Bartlett (Longevity plus brilliance, to play 400 games at that level is outstanding)
4. Haydn Bunton, Sr
5. Peter Hudson
6. Greg Williams
7. Jason Dunstall
8. Tony Lockett
9. Bob Skilton
10. Graeme Farmer
11. Dick Reynolds
12. Gary Ablett Sr
13. Royce Hart
14. John Coleman
15. Malcolm Blight
16. Ron Barassi
17. Peter Knights
18. Steven Silvagni
19. Lance Franklin
20. Alex Jesaulenko
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Franklin already in the top 20? Delusional.
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Consistent and brilliant forward, deserves to be in top 20.
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You could make a case for Ablett Jr, certainly, not so much for Judd.
My original list had Ablett Jr and Rob Harvey in the Top 20, but they were eventually removed for who I consider better/more complete midfielders at this stage. What works against Ablett Jr is that he has had at the most five years out of 10 that can be considered worthy of an all time great or Top 20 player. Same with Dane Swan.
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I think both will go down as better players than Hird/Buckley/Voss by the time they've finished, both are on track for top 20 all time IMO, they tick all the boxes, Brownlows, NSs (not sure in Ablett has one, but he should) premierships.
I think peole tend to rate the old timers higher than they should, Bunton Snr for example played during the depression, men of playing age had more on their mind at that time, they had to provide for their familys and not many had time for football, i know he has 3 brownlows, but he was swimming in a much smaller pool compared to modern day players.
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I don't think Judd gets there, too many issues with his game compared to other midfielders.
Ablett = Hird imo.
Yes, I take Bunton basically on word of mouth, which is strong enough to pick him in the top 20.
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It's hard to make a direct comparison between two different players, but Franklin is easily as dominant amongst key position players as Ablett is amongst midfielders in this generation.
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