Treasurer Joe Hockey faces $51 billion black hole

[Mofra]

I think it highlights we don't have the structural problem to the extent people think.

Rather we have a debt problem.

So globally we're all screwed, considering we have one of the lowest debt levels in the OECD (debt largely incurred during the worst financial crisis since the great depression).
Iraq War 3 doesn't seem like such a smart investment anymore...

 

[RUNVS]

So globally we're all screwed, considering we have one of the lowest debt levels in the OECD (debt largely incurred during the worst financial crisis since the great depression).
Iraq War 3 doesn't seem like such a smart investment anymore...

Iraq war 3 was never a smart investment. It was just a chance for Abbott to get an erection knowing that he is in command of fighter jets and that they can blow things up.

 

[Power Raid]

So globally we're all screwed, considering we have one of the lowest debt levels in the OECD (debt largely incurred during the worst financial crisis since the great depression).
Iraq War 3 doesn't seem like such a smart investment anymore...

I'm not so excited by a race to the bottom by comparing ourselves with debt ridden nations.

We have just come out of the greatest mining boom known to man, of which Australia was a massive beneficiary. It is such a shame we have so much debt given where we are in the cycle.

I hope they teach year 5 kids and above about the debt they will be paying off when they graduate and why it was incurred. They should also teach the kids how a mining tax that didn't work and was never going to work other than some greedy windfall was spent before it was earned. I hope they see the humour in it!

 

[Floor Pie]

I'm not so excited by a race to the bottom by comparing ourselves with debt ridden nations.

We have just come out of the greatest mining boom known to man, of which Australia was a massive beneficiary. It is such a shame we have so much debt given where we are in the cycle.

I hope they teach year 5 kids and above about the debt they will be paying off when they graduate and why it was incurred. They should also teach the kids how a mining tax that didn't work and was never going to work other than some greedy windfall was spent before it was earned. I hope they see the humour in it!

This is nothing but deflection and rhetoric...
You shouldn't have quoted Mofra, because you didn't reply to him.

 

[Power Raid]

This is nothing but deflection and rhetoric...
You shouldn't have quoted Mofra, because you didn't reply to him.

I'm fairly sure I did other than comment on Iraq which is pretty clear that there is no decision to be had. we made a mistake getting involved in the 1991 gulf war and you shouldn't walk away until the mistake is remedied.

oh and I would say we are at Iraq 4 or 5

 

[Power Raid]

25 years in Iraq

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_disarmament_timeline_1990–2003#1997

 

[Jiska]

These budget black holes happen when you cut your revenue streams before making sure you can legislate their replacements.

Actually black holes develop when you sell off all your assets that bring in billions of dollars of revenue each year. Eventually you get to the stage where you say "*. We've got no way to generate income, and raising taxes will kill us politically. Guess we'll have to spend no money."

Better still, we sold off Telstra and made the books look good temporarily, why not sell off Medibank and do the same thing? All those naive voters will look at the short term fix and think we're economic gurus. Don't worry about the fact our children will have no assets to generate revenue, that's in the future, we won't be around to have to deal with that and realistically who gives a rats ass about the future, as long as we look good today.

 

[Ratts of Tobruk]

So your wonderful maths has resulted in adding 9yo as well as 10yo paying of labor's generation of debt.

Can you provide your estimate of the interest costs as a percentage of the $51b deficit forecasted over 4 years. I have over 100%.

Care to be honest or deflect again?

Lectures on honesty from you are like lectures on healthy living by Clive Palmer.

Since you are still getting your maths wrong, you might like to also add the number 20 to the age of 8, 7, 6, 5, etc. and see what you get. It seems they would all be taxpayers in your scenario of a 20 year debt.

And, no, I'm not going to look up the exact figures for you. I already found a simple graph for your earlier questions and pointed out the errors in your assumptions. Everytime I look something up for you, you don't return the favour by pulling your finger out and doing some Googling. You're lazy and you will pretend we never had the conversation a month later anyway. Just don't look up the GFC when you do get to Googling, bro.

 

[Power Raid]

Actually black holes develop when you sell off all your assets that bring in billions of dollars of revenue each year. Eventually you get to the stage where you say "****. We've got no way to generate income, and raising taxes will kill us politically. Guess we'll have to spend no money."

Better still, we sold off Telstra and made the books look good temporarily, why not sell off Medibank and do the same thing? All those naive voters will look at the short term fix and think we're economic gurus. Don't worry about the fact our children will have no assets to generate revenue, that's in the future, we won't be around to have to deal with that and realistically who gives a rats ass about the future, as long as we look good today.

So by your same logic we should buy back the farms?

Why take 40% risk free when you could tie up all your capital, put it at risk and have 100% right? It is that easy!

 

[Power Raid]

Lectures on honesty from you are like lectures on healthy living by Clive Palmer.

Since you are still getting your maths wrong, you might like to also add the number 20 to the age of 8, 7, 6, 5, etc. and see what you get. It seems they would all be taxpayers in your scenario of a 20 year debt.

And, no, I'm not going to look up the exact figures for you. I already found a simple graph for your earlier questions and pointed out the errors in your assumptions. Everytime I look something up for you, you don't return the favour by pulling your finger out and doing some Googling. You're lazy and you will pretend we never had the conversation a month later anyway. Just don't look up the GFC when you do get to Googling, bro.

Dishonest Ratts comes through with the goods. Makes a claim that the $15b is wrong but knows the end number of over 100% is right.


Ratts it is dishonest to be misleading.

All you had to do was come back with an honest answer based on your own graphs but that is too much to ask .

Would you get the sack if you said something that painted your party in a bad light? Stop being a stooge and have your own opinion Ratts,

 

[Power Raid]

Lectures on honesty from you are like lectures on healthy living by Clive Palmer.

Since you are still getting your maths wrong, you might like to also add the number 20 to the age of 8, 7, 6, 5, etc. and see what you get. It seems they would all be taxpayers in your scenario of a 20 year debt.

And, no, I'm not going to look up the exact figures for you. I already found a simple graph for your earlier questions and pointed out the errors in your assumptions. Everytime I look something up for you, you don't return the favour by pulling your finger out and doing some Googling. You're lazy and you will pretend we never had the conversation a month later anyway. Just don't look up the GFC when you do get to Googling, bro.

Ok add the under 10 to labor's debt burden if you like.

I would have thought most don't earn a great wage until they are thirty and this that buck the trend may be caught by the tail end of the debt.

Then again all graduates will enter the work force with higher unemployment, higher costs of capital and higher taxes than need be if not for the debt. So may be your right.

 

[Floor Pie]

So, to clarify, Power Raid, there was no cost in finding and building/processing the mining area? And none of the money went into the Australian economy?

But you acknowledge that, on the other side..., there is a cost and a financial impact of everything that is done.

So I ask you, if there an important reason not to privatise public businesses? Or did the mining boom have an effect on the Australia economy before 2009?

 

[scon]

The myths of the mining boom | Lowy Institute for ...Boom Boom..

 

[Power Raid]

So, to clarify, Power Raid, there was no cost in finding and building/processing the mining area? And none of the money went into the Australian economy?

But you acknowledge that, on the other side..., there is a cost and a financial impact of everything that is done.

So I ask you, if there an important reason not to privatise public businesses? Or did the mining boom have an effect on the Australia economy before 2009?

I think you have got it!

The early part of the boom was an exploration and development boom. It creates Insitu value (in ground) but no material lift in royalties, company tax or export dollars (by miners)

It does however stimulate the economy as you suggest but not like the mining phase.

The second phase is much easier to understand and that is spade in the ground.

So go back to the start of this element of the discussion and you will see the mining boom started around 2007 to 2009.

 

[Maggie5]

So, to clarify, Power Raid, there was no cost in finding and building/processing the mining area? And none of the money went into the Australian economy?

But you acknowledge that, on the other side..., there is a cost and a financial impact of everything that is done.

So I ask you, if there an important reason not to privatise public businesses? Or did the mining boom have an effect on the Australia economy before 2009?

I think he means no financial cost like:
http://www.theage.com.au/business/m...dani-australia-coal-mine-20141117-11o5es.html
or maybe he means no environmental cost like:
http://www.theguardian.com/environm...l-mine-environmental-impact-unknown-for-years
maybe the un-borns will pay for all of these, forget the 10 year olds.
I would rather post these examples to you as I am over PR pontificating.

 

[Power Raid]

I think he means no financial cost like:
http://www.theage.com.au/business/m...dani-australia-coal-mine-20141117-11o5es.html
or maybe he means no environmental cost like:
http://www.theguardian.com/environm...l-mine-environmental-impact-unknown-for-years
maybe the un-borns will pay for all of these, forget the 10 year olds.
I would rather post these examples to you as I am over PR pontificating.

You do know mining now require 10,000 year future water flow and environmental bonds lodged? Or are you suggesting 2 years is too long for rehab?

 

[Pie eyed]

Time to get that market garden going Joe, even if it's just a front for your bodgy financial management business.