MMA-UFC UFC 182 - Jones vs DC

[Guy Threepwood]

Forrest was out match and he knew it straight away.

That I can agree with if you mean as soon as the fight started. Whether you're right in saying it was a well crafted move by Dana, Anderson or whoever, Forrest had never been beaten like that before or since.

Fitch is not the fighter he once was. He lost to Burkman then beat a couple of average at best fighters pretty unconvincingly (one by split decision no less) then got done by Palhares in under 90 seconds (Palhares is a genuine threat to anyone at WW if he could get his head out of his ass to be fair). the Lombard v Burkman fight was pretty awful, Burkman looked shot to pieces after about a minute (which was about 10 seconds after the commentators were going on about him training at altitude and having a good tank) and Lombard just did enough to make sure he won, when in reality he needed to put Burkman away.

A good chin is a nice asset but you need some more, WW is deeeeeeeeeeeeep and Burkman doesn't hold much weight there for me, you wouldnt cut him but he wont be on a main card again for a while, if ever.

I'm not saying he'll be a top 5 or 10 guy. 170 is crazy deep, but the stance I took was Burkman isn't past his prime like Brett33 said, if anything he's as good or better than he's ever been. He's decent everywhere and was able to give Lombard a few hairy moments despite gassing after a minute. I see him as being around the same level as Mike Pyle or Rick Story.... guys who have tools to trouble the better guys at 170 but rarely beat them.

 

[phantom13]

I'm not saying he'll be a top 5 or 10 guy. 170 is crazy deep, but the stance I took was Burkman isn't past his prime like Brett33 said, if anything he's as good or better than he's ever been. He's decent everywhere and was able to give Lombard a few hairy moments despite gassing after a minute. I see him as being around the same level as Mike Pyle or Rick Story.... guys who have tools to trouble the better guys at 170 but rarely beat them.

Youre right, he is not past his prime but the ranking for WW from 9 down are still scary. Tarec, Dong Hyun Kim, Ellenberger, Story, Mein, Nelson and LaFlare. I know its only 1 fight but i dont see Burkman beating any of those guys. Only time will tell, Lombard was a tough first up fight.

 

[MMAPride Scott]

I think GSP get overlooked for GOAT in MMA

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Youre right, he is not past his prime but the ranking for WW from 9 down are still scary. Tarec, Dong Hyun Kim, Ellenberger, Story, Mein, Nelson and LaFlare. I know its only 1 fight but i dont see Burkman beating any of those guys. Only time will tell, Lombard was a tough first up fight.

That's a fair point. Still, we're judging him off a fight with Lombard which is a pretty huge test for anyone at 170. I could see him winning a fight or two amongst that lot, probably against Tarec and LaFlare while I think he'd have good close fights against both Story and Ellenberger. I beleive he already has a loss against Mein too.

 

[phantom13]

Interestingly with Lombard i actually think a fight with Rory would be best for him, he always seems to fights to his opponents level so Rory might bring him out of his shell also from a divisional stand point it makes sense champ v #1 contender (Lawler v Hendricks) then its 3 v 7 (Woodley v Gastelum) 4 is out of action (Condit). Matt Brown is #5 so a fight with him doesnt really move anyone anywhere. R-Mac v Lombard will makes someone a genuine contender (although Rory is continually getting screwed out of a shot) and if Lombard loses he goes way back in the race.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Good shout, Rory vs Lombard is a great fight and the one I'd like to see next. The only reason I can think of to not make it is that it would likely be a title eliminator and with Lombard's bad performance yesterday I don't think he'll receive that honour just yet. I guess we'll know soon enough as if Lombard isn't next for Brown, the only other matchup that makes sense is Rory.

 

[BradWCE]

Jones was just too damn good. I saw in here some comments about Cormier's cardio. Do you realise that Jones landed brutal body shots throughout those first three rounds? I don't know how good anyone's cardio would be going into the 4th round after that.

Not sure why anyone would be rooting for Jones. The guy goes on instagram to stalk some kid and writes all this s**t about the kid being gay and how it's a sin. My mistake, actually he was hacked or had his phone stolen or it was an employee that did it (yeah let's settle on the last one). Then his comments about rape, nah sorry not supporting someone like that. Then again, Mayweather has heaps of fans and he's beaten up a number of women. As long as you're insanely good you'll have support even if you're a piece of s**t.

 

[didaksrightfoot]

Jones was just too damn good. I saw in here some comments about Cormier's cardio. Do you realise that Jones landed brutal body shots throughout those first three rounds? I don't know how good anyone's cardio would be going into the 4th round after that.

Not sure why anyone would be rooting for Jones. The guy goes on instagram to stalk some kid and writes all this s**t about the kid being gay and how it's a sin. My mistake, actually he was hacked or had his phone stolen or it was an employee that did it (yeah let's settle on the last one). Then his comments about rape, nah sorry not supporting someone like that. Then again, Mayweather has heaps of fans and he's beaten up a number of women. As long as you're insanely good you'll have support even if you're a piece of s**t.

simple answer - Jones is a dick.

I'm a big fan of DC, though I have to be honest that I really didn't like his approach to this fight... just would've been better staying quiet.

I can understand the 4-1 result to Jones, but would've thought 3-2 would've been closer to the truth... DC had the 2nd round, and IMO had the first as well because his shots were doing more damage and he had complete control of the octagon... Jones was backpedalling for the first 2 rounds.
But the 3rd onwards was all Jones... I wish there was a way to blame it on the eye-poke, but there clearly isn't. Jones was the better fighter through 5 rounds, and the being outsized was a big factor in DC getting gassed.
---

Did any see the post-match presser? I didn't see it, but I really wish Dana said something to Jones about his action at the end of the fight (this is not the WWE)... was really uncalled for, and you could see in the ring after the fight that Dana wasn't happy with him and gave him some words.
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As for GOAT - I would still have Silva and GSP ahead of Jones. The knock on Jones is that he is in a division where he physically outmatches anybody who comes near him, and for me to consider Jones as the greatest I would need to see him go up to HW and start fighting guys who can actually match him for height and reach.
(But while he can stay in this weight class and keep physically dominating, for the most part, smaller fighters - why would he leave?)
It's quite telling that the guy closest to him in terms of size (Gustaffson) matched him over 5 rounds, and in many people's opinions actually won that fight.

 

[Higgins2Waite]

I'm not saying he'll be a top 5 or 10 guy. 170 is crazy deep, but the stance I took was Burkman isn't past his prime like Brett33 said, if anything he's as good or better than he's ever been. He's decent everywhere and was able to give Lombard a few hairy moments despite gassing after a minute. I see him as being around the same level as Mike Pyle or Rick Story.... guys who have tools to trouble the better guys at 170 but rarely beat them.

Incorrect wording on my behalf. I should of said in his prime...but just not good enough to be a top 10 WW. The division is deep and I think Thatch, Mein, Pyle, Gunni Nelson, Story, Saffeidine, Ellenberger, Thompson, Maia, Kim, 1st Round Silva, Magny and Alves all beat him

 

[Higgins2Waite]

simple answer - Jones is a dick.

Agreed. It's as though he's trying to play the bad guy in an attempt to increase his fight purse. Sonnen and McGregor are cocky but they are funny bastards. Jones just comes across as a complete unlikable w***er.

 

[Higgins2Waite]

That I can agree with if you mean as soon as the fight started. Whether you're right in saying it was a well crafted move by Dana, Anderson or whoever, Forrest had never been beaten like that before or since.

Because he was never exposed that badly speed wise. I hate anderson and I like Forrest but it was no different to Bonnar vs Silva or Sonnen vs Jones.

After that he lost to Shogun, beat Tito twice and a past it undersized franklin.

Before that he lost to Jardine and Evans. He beat a poor Shogun and a Rampage that punches...and not much else. He came in with a game plan against Rampage (leg kicks) that was very effective and won a decision.

 

[phantom13]

simple answer - Jones is a dick.

I'm a big fan of DC, though I have to be honest that I really didn't like his approach to this fight... just would've been better staying quiet.

I can understand the 4-1 result to Jones, but would've thought 3-2 would've been closer to the truth... DC had the 2nd round, and IMO had the first as well because his shots were doing more damage and he had complete control of the octagon... Jones was backpedalling for the first 2 rounds.
But the 3rd onwards was all Jones... I wish there was a way to blame it on the eye-poke, but there clearly isn't. Jones was the better fighter through 5 rounds, and the being outsized was a big factor in DC getting gassed.
---

Did any see the post-match presser? I didn't see it, but I really wish Dana said something to Jones about his action at the end of the fight (this is not the WWE)... was really uncalled for, and you could see in the ring after the fight that Dana wasn't happy with him and gave him some words.
---

As for GOAT - I would still have Silva and GSP ahead of Jones. The knock on Jones is that he is in a division where he physically outmatches anybody who comes near him, and for me to consider Jones as the greatest I would need to see him go up to HW and start fighting guys who can actually match him for height and reach.
(But while he can stay in this weight class and keep physically dominating, for the most part, smaller fighters - why would he leave?)
It's quite telling that the guy closest to him in terms of size (Gustaffson) matched him over 5 rounds, and in many people's opinions actually won that fight.

Yes i did and no he didn't. Dana is all for that sort of stuff, Dana talking to Jones in the ring just before he put the strap around his waist (if thats what you are talking about) was trying to get him to stand still so he could put the belt around his waist. You dont have to like the guy (i don't, i think he is a f**king weirdo borderline sociopath) but he is interesting and he is also the best fighter in MMA right now (i would argue of all time but thats beside the point). The best generally are arrogant flogs, not too many people have anything good to say about Michael Jordan. Jones and Cormier hated each other, genuinely, and Jones can say and do what he wants, Dana wont care provided it doesn't bring the sport into disrepute.

 

[didaksrightfoot]

Agreed. It's as though he's trying to play the bad guy in an attempt to increase his fight purse. Sonnen and McGregor are cocky but they are funny bastards. Jones just comes across as a complete unlikable ******.

No, I don't think it is an act at all with Jones - I think it's just his personality.
In fact, I think Jones tries to present himself in a postive way... his interviews are often just a series of cliches. It is when you see things from behind the scenes, or when he does let his emotions out that you realise how much of a dick he is.

(but yes in the leadup to this fight... I think a lot of it was about increasing their purse... but that would not be an excuse for what happened afterwards)

 

[Higgins2Waite]

Interestingly with Lombard i actually think a fight with Rory would be best for him, he always seems to fights to his opponents level so Rory might bring him out of his shell also from a divisional stand point it makes sense champ v #1 contender (Lawler v Hendricks) then its 3 v 7 (Woodley v Gastelum) 4 is out of action (Condit). Matt Brown is #5 so a fight with him doesnt really move anyone anywhere. R-Mac v Lombard will makes someone a genuine contender (although Rory is continually getting screwed out of a shot) and if Lombard loses he goes way back in the race.

Of course it would be best for Lombard. It'd be like winning the lottery for him. If I was Rory I'd tell Lombard and Dana to suck a lemon. Rory is 8 from 9 and just knocked out the former strike force champion and made Woodley look like a joke. Lombard on the other hand is 4 from 6 and has beaten Burkman (unconvincing) and Shields (unconvincing). It's no different to Brown asking for a title shot after beating pyle, thompson, mein, cope, swick and silva. Fight someone half decent first then start calling out the best in the division.

Fight night Rory vs Lombard 5 rounds. I think Rory would set up the jab and pepper him with kicks for the first three rounds. When Lombard gases he goes crashing down.

 

[Higgins2Waite]

No, I don't think it is an act at all with Jones - I think it's just his personality.
In fact, I think Jones tries to present himself in a postive way... his interviews are often just a series of cliches. It is when you see things from behind the scenes, or when he does let his emotions out that you realise how much of a dick he is.

(but yes in the leadup to this fight... I think a lot of it was about increasing their purse... but that would not be an excuse for what happened afterwards)

I definitely agree it's him in real life. I just mean I think he's turned it up a bit more...or his true colours are starting to show. Even his post fight was a joke "before the fight I went outside and spoke with the fans. They're my inspiration and I draw spirit from them"

 

[phantom13]

No, I don't think it is an act at all with Jones - I think it's just his personality.
In fact, I think Jones tries to present himself in a postive way... his interviews are often just a series of cliches. It is when you see things from behind the scenes, or when he does let his emotions out that you realise how much of a dick he is.

(but yes in the leadup to this fight... I think a lot of it was about increasing their purse... but that would not be an excuse for what happened afterwards)

Its absolutely his personality, he has realistically on just started embracing it too. Preaches he is a bible loving christian yet cheats on his missus constantly, has kids out of wedlock, wraps his car around a tree in a DUI etc etc. Preaches the respect of Martial Arts then does the suck it sign after a fight to his opponent. He needs to just embrace the inner villain, the only time i have found him "likeable" (and i use that very loosely) was the behind the scenes stuff with Cormier ("you still there pussy") that stuff was hilarious.

 

[RU_]

Looks nasty.

 

[Higgins2Waite]

Looks nasty.

DC got off lightly. He's normally good for a few

 

[Barry Roundhouse]

You're right, alot of Andersons guys get mocked because of the way Silva made them look but you cant deny the credentials of the guys Jones has beaten (Machida, Evans, Rua, Jackson and Belfort were all former champions, Cormier an undefeated Heavyweight and Light Heavyweight) when you compare the names and said records against Silvas opponents Jones has faced a murderers row.

it was also at a very different time in mma... when silva went from being champ ufc was just into the zuffa era.. 16 months ago he was champion! silva has fought some extremely high caliber fighters.. and he is close to 40

 

[Higgins2Waite]

it was also at a very different time in mma... when silva went from being champ ufc was just into the zuffa era.. 16 months ago he was champion! silva has fought some extremely high caliber fighters.. and he is close to 40

Henderson, franklin and Belfort...who else? Maybe sonnen

 

[phantom13]

it was also at a very different time in mma... when silva went from being champ ufc was just into the zuffa era.. 16 months ago he was champion! silva has fought some extremely high caliber fighters.. and he is close to 40

He has fought some very high calibre fighters, he also fought some average middleweights who were stylistically perfect for him (Maia is one who comes to mind, undersized, terrible wrestler, terrible striker, high level BJJ but if you cant get a bloke down thats not much good). Its always going to be an individual thing but for me personally Jones has had a better calibre of opponents to defend against. Its worth keeping in mind there isn't much Silva could have done to change this, you can only fight the man put in front of you and Silva did it for a few years more than Jones has currently.

Jones Title Fights - Rua, Jackson, Machida, Belfort, Sonnen, Gustaffson, Texiera, Cormier.
Silva Title Fights - Franklin, Lutter, Marquhardt, Henderson, Cote, Leites, Maia, Sonnen, Belfort, Okami, Sonnen, Weidman (L), Weidman (L) with a handful of LHW fights.

 

[Barry Roundhouse]

it's definatly reasonable to put jones over silva... but imo he hasn't gone past him just yet.. he is damn close tho! a comfortable win over the winner of rumble v AG will probably do it for mine.

 

[phantom13]

it's definatly reasonable to put jones over silva... but imo he hasn't gone past him just yet.. he is damn close tho! a comfortable win over the winner of rumble v AG will probably do it for mine.

Thats totally fair, its always going to be an individual opinion thing. Besides we all know Brock Lesnar is the greatest of all time... dont we?

 

[Quivorir]

He sure is.

 

[phantom13]

Cerrone backing up for fight night, in to replace Alvarez against Hendo... Huge fight for him. Huge. On a three week turnaround no less.