Ukraine on verge of civil war?

[awaremind]

Sure. But this is pretty much the exact opposite of the Scottish referendum in every conceivable way.

A bit more like UK holding onto northern Ireland though in a way, except the Brits never gave it up.

 

[carnthemlions]

You've left off southern Thailand.

Phuket and Bali are must haves.

 

[Ice-Wolf]

Phuket and Bali are must haves.

Well they are extremely important to the Australia people and hold great significance to our culture.

Note: Should probably try to annex the Gallipoli Peninsula again.

 

[Bremner20]

Should probably take over Thailand as well or at least the area around Phuket. Malaysia seems pretty incompetent at the moment how about the entire Malay Peninsula plus Singapore Island.

So the shopping list so far
New Zealand

1. Papau New Guinea
2. West Papua
3. Bali
4. New Caledonia
5. Vanuatu
6. Solomon Islands
7. Fiji
8. Hong Kong
9. Malay Peninsula
10. Singapore

Kiwis bit like Jews , going on about their beautiful homeland but not many of them want to live there, in the Kiwis case seems like most of them are over here or wanting to come here . No problem with that mind you all the New Zealanders I've met are nice people ,so lets just make it official and make it another state of Aus . Great place New Zealand but as someone wrote in the paper recently you can't eat scenery.

 

[Scallop Industry Thug]

The Muslims will have bombed half the world soon enough, Putin is setting up a non-Soviet Soviet Union, Europe will soon fall into the ocean, the US will be part of Mexico soon enough...what say you, Francis Fukuyama?

 

[crackerjack4X4]

Kiwis bit like Jews , going on about their beautiful homeland but not many of them want to live there, in the Kiwis case seems like most of them are over here or wanting to come here . No problem with that mind you all the New Zealanders I've met are nice people ,so lets just make it official and make it another state of Aus . Great place New Zealand but as someone wrote in the paper recently you can't eat scenery.

 

[Smiling Buddha]

Amazing that this thread isn't getting more action.

I suppose that when this crisis is pushed back to the 'World news' section of newspapers and given scant coverage on the television behind Tania Hird and a missing plane, people aren't as interested.

Anyhow does anybody remember that thuggish, far-right leader who physically accosted a prosecutor a few weeks back? Here are some clips to freshen your memory:




Well apparently he's dead. Shot through the heart.

http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_...sia-has-not-yet-been-oficially-notified-6506/

As always, ask yourself, 'cui bono' - who benefits?

 

[Bremner20]

There's not much more to say really ,the Russians have taken back the Crimean Peninsula ,reportedly 30,000 Russian troops have poured into the area as recent as yesterday and whats more it's what the people voted for democratically. Its of strategic and military importance to Russia so if they can easily re-annex it into the Russian Federation ,they will and have done. The US weak-arse Obama administration are no longer in a position to do anything which they have shown or there is really nothing in it for the US anyway apart from losing face with the rest of the world which they obviously can't afford to worry about considering their recent cuts to defence spending. So the Russians have gained back some territory ,that they and the people who live there apparently thought belonged to Russia anyway and the US has just once again showed how it's position as the no1 superpower in the world is diminishing very quickly although it might get interesting if Russia pushes its luck a little further and tries to take back something that does mean something to the US.

 

[tandino]

There's not much more to say really ,the Russians have taken back the Crimean Peninsula ,reportedly 30,000 soviet troops have poured into the area as recent as yesterday

The Soviet Union? I thought you guys broke up.

 

[Bremner20]

The Soviet Union? I thought you guys broke up.

Thankyou my post has been duely edited . I sincerely apologise for the mistake.

 

[tandino]

Thankyou my post has been duely edited . I sincerely apologise for the mistake.

More of a Freudian slip than a mistake.

 

[MoscowHawk]

There's not much more to say really ,the Russians have taken back the Crimean Peninsula ,reportedly 30,000 Russian troops have poured into the area as recent as yesterday and whats more it's what the people voted for democratically. Its of strategic and military importance to Russia so if they can easily re-annex it into the Russian Federation ,they will and have done. The US weak-arse Obama administration are no longer in a position to do anything which they have shown or there is really nothing in it for the US anyway apart from losing face with the rest of the world which they obviously can't afford to worry about considering their recent cuts to defence spending. So the Russians have gained back some territory ,that they and the people who live there apparently thought belonged to Russia anyway and the US has just once again showed how it's position as the no1 superpower in the world is diminishing very quickly although it might get interesting if Russia pushes its luck a little further and tries to take back something that does mean something to the US.

I don't feel that Russia is a clear winner in this (though they have really embarassed the US from a strategic point of view). The end result is that Russia has annexed the Crimea, which, as part of Russia, will be the second poorest region in the country (behind Dagestan). It'll cost a fortune to integrate it with the rest of the country.

Secondly, the US/EU have denied Russia the rest of the Ukraine. As a result of all this - Ukraine and Russia are destined to be enemies for the foreseeable future. Added to this, the Ukraine is a failed state right on the doorstep of Russia. This is a destabilizing factor.

So I think both sides are hurting from this.

 

[MoscowHawk]

Well apparently he's dead. Shot through the heart.

http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_...sia-has-not-yet-been-oficially-notified-6506/

March 1 2014: "Right Sector" Sashko Bily asks for Chechen terrorist Doku Umarov to help Ukraine in its struggle against the Russians
March 18: Doku Umarov confirmed dead
March 25: Sashko Bily killed in Ukraine

A strong performance all around.

 

[Smiling Buddha]

“By the end of the weekend, Europe’s biggest war since 1945 will have begun or Putin will have started to send the troops on the border home,” declared Professor of the Naval War College at Boston University, John Schindler.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/wo...ould-be-imminent/story-fni0xs61-1226867240935

According to Murdoch's outlets (Fox News in the US reprinted by News here in Aus) the Russians aren't just building up their forces on the border, but the forces being sent are some of the best and most loyal Putin has at his disposal.

Now I am usually skeptical about anything Murdoch has to say about, well, anything - especially when it comes to defense/military/war matters. But it seems even his mob might be understating the number of Russians on the border:

http://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/22214256/ukraine-says-100-000-russian-troops-near-border/

It is smart practice to always have a few days worth of non-perishable food and water handy (Australian guidelines suggest a minimum of three days worth). I would contend that this is even more important in times like these. This might sound 'alarmist', however I would point out that these are the government's own guidelines.

 

[nicko99]

Smiling Buddha i heard all of this stems back when Putin and Gazprom kicked BP and all other energy companies out of Russia and Europe in 2008, and now they are trying to screw them over. All you hear now especially Obama in the press is that their "isolating" Russia.

Whats sad now is that the IMF have loaned $15b to bail out Ukraine, the same deal they signed with Russia a few months ago with low gas and interest rates. Ukrainian people have been stooged.

this is a good article about it

http://www.worldaffairsjournal.org/article/russia-greed-british-petroleum’s-other-crisis

 

[JoondalupJ]

American private defense contractors on the ground in Ukraine?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lk-U-S-mercenary-outfit-deployed-Donetsk.html

I've read suggestions that this is just a setup by the Russians.

Even if this were the case, this is still massive news.

We're on the brink.

We are on the brink....................of a new cold war.

 

[JoondalupJ]

Dead serious. I know it's different to living there long-term as a permanent resident, but I was in Vietnam for a month not too long ago. Fantastic people, fantastic food, I really enjoyed it. Of course like in all nations there are cracks beneath the surface and corruption within the State apparatus. It's not 100% harmonious. It's not 100% a workers' utopia.

But it gets by.

A relatives of mine went there for a holiday too , they absolutely loved it .

They get better every day I guess. After what they were put through , they deserve the best outcome for their nation.

 

[Smiling Buddha]

NATO to conduct wargames in Ukraine? Doesn't seem suss at all.

As an aside, found this pic on another forum:

 

[samFFC]

http://www.foreignaffairs.com/artic...sp_rid=MjA3NDk5OTZAc3R1ZGVudC51d2EuZWR1LmF1S0

Should Crimea join Russia, many Ukrainians would mourn its loss as a blow to national self-esteem. But they would soon recognize that they have been freed of many of the burdens associated with the territory. First, Ukrainians would no longer be responsible for providing Crimea with enormous agricultural subsidies, or for propping up its ailing tourism sector. Second, Ukraine could more easily pursue clear, pro-European policies without having to consider blowback from an ardently pro-Russian domestic minority. Third, the government in Kiev would no longer have to invest resources to ward off a festering Islamist insurgency among Crimea’s underprivileged and repressed Tatar population (a task to which Kiev has consistently failed to offer adequate resources).

Finally, Kiev’s foreign policy would no longer be hostage to debates over the fate of Russia’s Black Sea Fleet. In 1997, the Black Sea Fleet was granted basing rights for a term of 20 years, after which Ukraine would become a neutral “non-bloc” country associated with neither NATO nor a Russian military alliance. But in April 2010, Yanukovych railroaded the Kharkiv Accords through parliament, which extended the fleet’s rights through 2042 -- although Ukraine’s official foreign policy strategy released in July 2010 still maintained that the country intended to pursue non-bloc status. Yanukovych never clarified the contradiction between accepting a de facto permanent foreign base and pursuing military neutrality.

Putin would be wrong to mistake Ukrainians’ ambivalence about Crimea for a broader ambivalence about eastern Ukraine. Ukrainians would not hesitate to fight over the other territories there. Although they have sizeable Russian-language populations, Ukrainians think of these regions as an integral part of the country, historically and culturally. Most would feel that the loss of any territory beyond Crimea would represent an existential threat to Ukrainian independence.

 

[The_Reaper]

http://www.foreignaffairs.com/artic...sp_rid=MjA3NDk5OTZAc3R1ZGVudC51d2EuZWR1LmF1S0

And what is Ukraine going to do about the Donbas and Kharkiv and Odessa? Who don't want to go the EU?

Ukraine is going to collapse sooner rather than later.

 

[samFFC]

And what is Ukraine going to do about the Donbas and Kharkiv and Odessa? Who don't want to go the EU?

Ukraine is going to collapse sooner rather than later.

Perhaps. Article suggesting that they would oppose any further annexations:

Ukrainians would not hesitate to fight over the other territories there. Although they have sizeable Russian-language populations, Ukrainians think of these regions as an integral part of the country, historically and culturally.

 

[Smiling Buddha]

samFFC That article is published by the Council on Foreign Relations.

Are you aware of who these people are?

Check out this video:



If 38 minutes is too long, the part focused on the CFR begins around the 16m mark.

 

[The_Reaper]

Perhaps. Article suggesting that they would oppose any further annexations:

Yes they will obvious oppose annexation. But how are they going to convince all these area to economically integrate with the West?

Not only do they have cultural and historical ties with Russia (plus everyone speaks Russian). But everyone is employed selling stuff to Russia. They produce goods that the Russians will buy but Europe won't.

 

[JoondalupJ]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/wo...ould-be-imminent/story-fni0xs61-1226867240935

According to Murdoch's outlets (Fox News in the US reprinted by News here in Aus) the Russians aren't just building up their forces on the border, but the forces being sent are some of the best and most loyal Putin has at his disposal.

Now I am usually skeptical about anything Murdoch has to say about, well, anything - especially when it comes to defense/military/war matters. But it seems even his mob might be understating the number of Russians on the border:

http://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/22214256/ukraine-says-100-000-russian-troops-near-border/

It is smart practice to always have a few days worth of non-perishable food and water handy (Australian guidelines suggest a minimum of three days worth). I would contend that this is even more important in times like these. This might sound 'alarmist', however I would point out that these are the government's own guidelines.

I am building my underground bomb shelter now , so I can die of suffocation along with all the preppers in the USA.
Last comment to all you over worriers, ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[JoondalupJ]

And what is Ukraine going to do about the Donbas and Kharkiv and Odessa? Who don't want to go the EU?

Ukraine is going to collapse sooner rather than later.

Why , is my question, Russia has miserable history, the Ukraine no better. Why does everyone want to be boss, who gives a s**t.Just get along.