Test Rugby Wallabies Rugby World Cup discussion

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Lions1024 said:
I don't think anyone, even Cheika, expected Horwill to playing this well. He's jumped from being on the outskirts of the team to clearly being our number 1 lock. Mumm has also shown that he can play at test level and his versatility is big plus.
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Douglas is much better than Horwill, fraction more versatile at a pinch too.
 
At full capabilities and fitness, I'd take Douglas over Horwill but Douglas is a long way back relative to Horwill right now. Horwill has shown he can play (at least close to) full games and have an impact while Douglas has been injured on the other side of the world and not fit.

I'd find a way to have Douglas over there at the RWC but Horwill has definitely solidified his place in the XV.
 
Lions1024 said:
It'll be interesting to see the 31 man squad Cheika picks on Friday. Curious as to whether Cheika will put out a surprise as the squad based on the last few games really picks itself.

Loosehead Prop: Sio, Slipper, Smith
Hooker: Moore, TPN, Hanson
Tighthead: Kepu, Holmes
Locks: Horwill, Simmons, Skelton, Mumm, Douglas
Backrow: Pocock, Hooper, Fardy, McCalman
Scrumhalf: Phipps, White, Genia
Flyhalf: Cooper, Foley
Inside: Giteau, Toomua
Outside: Kuridrani
Wings: AAC, Tomane, Mitchell, Horne
Fullback: Folau, Beale
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Bolded are the changes I'd make. Douglas for Palu and Tomane for Speight. Harsh on Henry admittedly but he has done little to nothing at test level (played less than five tests obviously) and Tomane has a better proven record at the same level. If Speight flies over, which I imagine he will, I won't be disappointed at all though.

As for Douglas, I feel we have to have him there and if it's at the expense of Palu, I can deal with that.

I'd love to have Sean McMahon or Speight in the squad at the expense of a third hooker of halfback but that's playing too greatly with fire in case of a very late injury leading up to a big game.
 

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I'd pick 3 tightheads. I know Sio and Slipper have played some tighthead before but not for ages, and I don't think they are realistic back up there. It's easier going from tighthead to loosehead and Greg Holmes can cover it fine.
 
3 tightheads is probably the way to go. It's the more specialised of the two so perhaps Faulkner should go.

On second thought, considering George Smith is over there in Europe already, it isn't quite as necessary to include McMahon. I didn't have him in my squad but I wanted him. We can afford to go without him and call in Smith at short notice if we desperately need an openside.
 
S120 said:
3 tightheads is probably the way to go. It's the more specialised of the two so perhaps Faulkner should go.

On second thought, considering George Smith is over there in Europe already, it isn't quite as necessary to include McMahon. I didn't have him in my squad but I wanted him. We can afford to go without him and call in Smith at short notice if we desperately need an openside.
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Oh great more of the old blokes...yippee....that worked so well before....and lets not forget how terrible George Smith was the year before he went overseas. Exactly how many number 7's do you want? He is not a test number 8, period.
 
LukeParkerno1 said:
Oh great more of the old blokes...yippee....that worked so well before....and lets not forget how terrible George Smith was the year before he went overseas. Exactly how many number 7's do you want? He is not a test number 8, period.
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Relax. I said if Pocock or Hooper get hurt at the tournament and we need an openside at short notice.
 
S120 said:
Relax. I said if Pocock or Hooper get hurt at the tournament and we need an openside at short notice.
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I would rather play Gill or someone else. I just don't see how Smith should waltz in when there are about 4 number 7's in Australian rugby all in form. I don't care what he did in 2008 or whatever, I care about 2015. He was old, slow and so useless the last time he played for the Wallabies. He is even older now...what makes you think it will work? Bit of a difference picking a winger (Mitchell) to picking a number 7. Number 7's have to be quick.

I get what you are saying don't get me wrong, I just disagree with it if Australia goes gown that route.
 
I'd prefer Liam Gill to Smith at 7 as well. But if Pocock were to get injured then I think George Smith coming in to replace him as an 8 would be a good idea.
 
Maester said:
I'd prefer Liam Gill to Smith at 7 as well. But if Pocock were to get injured then I think George Smith coming in to replace him as an 8 would be a good idea.
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Smith at 8...that alone is giving me nightmares! A slow number 8...oh this will be fun. We have Palu and McCalaman as options at 8, do not need Smith!
 
Smith would provide a much more like for like replacement for Pocock. A guy who's great over the ball at the ruck to complement Hooper at 7. And Smith has enough bulk and experience at 8 to play there well. By all reports Smith was one of the best players in the Top 14 last year playing at number 8 in a losing side. I would actually be happy to see him picked ahead of Palu.
 
Maester said:
Smith would provide a much more like for like replacement for Pocock. A guy who's great over the ball at the ruck to complement Hooper at 7. And Smith has enough bulk and experience at 8 to play there well. By all reports Smith was one of the best players in the Top 14 last year playing at number 8 in a losing side. I would actually be happy to see him picked ahead of Palu.
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This 'great over the ball' thing....did you not see how terrible he was the last time he played for Australia. He was that bad we lost to Scotland on the end of season tour when we gave Pocock a 'rest'. Thankfully he was back next week. Smith was that bad it wasn't funny. French Top 14 is nowhere near Super 15 level, not close. Mitchell has struggled even though I see some value there as he is a finisher.
 
LukeParkerno1 said:
This 'great over the ball' thing....did you not see how terrible he was the last time he played for Australia. He was that bad we lost to Scotland on the end of season tour when we gave Pocock a 'rest'. Thankfully he was back next week. Smith was that bad it wasn't funny. French Top 14 is nowhere near Super 15 level, not close. Mitchell has struggled even though I see some value there as he is a finisher.
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He came back to Australia after that. Played for the Brumbies in 2013 after Pocock got injured and was awesome. Still great over the ball. Always has been always will.

And the Top 14 is a different style of rugby to Super Rugby but is a very strong competition. Toulon, Clermont, Toulouse and a couple of others at full strength are basically test quality teams that would beat most super rugby teams. These clubs have many times the player budget of Super Rugby teams. To dismiss his form in that competition is ridiculous, particularly when he was in the worst team in the comp.

It's not like we have great 8's. Palu is old too and not in form. And McCalman is solid, but a different sort of player. George Smith would definitely be the most similar replacement to Pocock, and he's already over in England. That said, hopefully nothing will happen to Pocock and he dominates the tournament!!
 

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Maester said:
He came back to Australia after that. Played for the Brumbies in 2013 after Pocock got injured and was awesome. Still great over the ball. Always has been always will.

And the Top 14 is a different style of rugby to Super Rugby but is a very strong competition. Toulon, Clermont, Toulouse and a couple of others at full strength are basically test quality teams that would beat most super rugby teams. These clubs have many times the player budget of Super Rugby teams. To dismiss his form in that competition is ridiculous, particularly when he was in the worst team in the comp.

It's not like we have great 8's. Palu is old too and not in form. And McCalman is solid, but a different sort of player. George Smith would definitely be the most similar replacement to Pocock, and he's already over in England. That said, hopefully nothing will happen to Pocock and he dominates the tournament!!
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He is slower than he was 7-8 years ago. Slow won't win us a WC, period. I would rather pick McCalman at number 8 if there is an injury, solid, won't do anything wrong, fairly quick, and is a good number 8. Plu is fine as well, at least he has been playing at a higher level in Super 15. If Smith wanted to play he should have been forced to play these last 3 tests, otherwise, I hope he is nowhere near the side. Top 14 form means very little especially when we have Mitchell and Giteau to a lesser degree struggling and that should set the alarm bells off. If you want a like for like replacement, pick Liam Gill.
 
LP1 - Gill isn't really an option at 8 so it's not a like for like replacement.

S120 said:
As long as we go into the big games with both Phipps and Genia in the 23, I don't have a particular problem with that either. I don't want to rely on Giteau as our back up in a big game.
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Yeah lets just hope neither halfback gets sick or injured 1-2 days before a game, and if they do that the starting halfback doesn't get injured early in the match!

Maybe we should wrap the halfbacks up in cotton wool for those 2 days before each match...
 
S120 said:
As long as we go into the big games with both Phipps and Genia in the 23, I don't have a particular problem with that either. I don't want to rely on Giteau as our back up in a big game.
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I'd rather rely on Giteau if he is 100% match fit as backup in some of the games though.
 
Maester said:
LP1 - Gill isn't really an option at 8 so it's not a like for like replacement.
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Neither can George Smith at test level. He was tried there before, he was awful at 8. Don't care what he has done in French rugby, was poor in test rugby at number 8 before.
 
Squad announced:

Stephen Moore (captain), Michael Hooper (vice-captain), Adam Ashley-Cooper (vice-captain), Kurtley Beale, Quade Cooper, Kane Douglas, Scott Fardy, Israel Folau Bernard Foley, Will Genia, Matt Giteau Greg Holmes, Rob Horne, Sekope Kepu, Tevita Kuridrani, Ben McCalman, Sean McMahon, Drew Mitchell, Dean Mumm, Wcliff Palu, Nick Phipps, David Pocock, Tatafu-Polota Nau, Rob Simmons, Scott Sio, Will Skelton, James Slipper, Toby Smith, Henry Speight, Joe Tomane, Matt Toomua
 
Horwill can count himself unlucky after being our most consistent lock over the course of the RC/Bledisloe series.

They're really banking on no late setbacks to our halfbacks or hookers with Cheika only naming two specialists in each area. Taking a risk.
 
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